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High Hgb and Rbc on TRT..Need advice Please

fryzway

Banned
Joined
Feb 10, 2012
Messages
411
This is my 1st post to this forum and i'm excited bc their seem to be some pretty knowledgeable ppl on here when it comes to this problem and topic. A little background: 27yrs old been on Trt with Test cyp since April 2011. I am currently running 200mg/wk of Test Cyp, shot every Sun. I am 5ft 8" 245lbs and 13.5%bf. I just got my recent labs back 1wk ago and I was concerned about the RBC HGB levels and my TT to be honest. My RBC is 6.14 Ref (4.3-5.9)
My HGB is 16.5 Ref (13.9-16.4) and my Total Test on 200mg/wk is 554 Ref (250-1,100). The labs were done on the morning of my injection day before I pined. My Hematocrit is normal @47.5 Ref (39-55). I also use Aromasin at 12.5mg/day and on shot day and day after shot I use 25mg. My E2 is @ 15.1 Ref (5.37-65.9). Also my HDL is 27. Red Cross would not let me donate blood bc of pimples near my veins in my arm, I tried giving twice. I can't take aspirin bc I am on Depakote for Bi-Polar, the aspirin makes Depakote more toxic. My bp usually runs 120's/70-80's and my RHR is 60's. I would like to have my TT higher but I'm already on 200mg/wk of Test Cyp and Doc won't go any higher and I wouldn't want to increase my RBC,HGB any more anyway. Why is my TT not sky high on that dose ? Is it bc of my size ? My doc won't do Therapeutic Phlebatomy either, he did refer me to a hematologist tho, which I haven't seen yet. I just don't want to throw a clot or something from this but am I being paranoid with the #'s where they are ? I won't lower my Test dose bc I'm barely mid-range as it is. My dad does have a Hyper Coagulated State and Peripheral Vascular Disease with Diabetes and has had both legs amputated below the knee and he is 51yrs old. I had an echo last summer which was perfectly normal as well as my chest x-ray and ekg's. I also had ck/mb done and cardiac enzymes done in labs and they were also fine. My Iron and Ferritin are normal as well as b-12,dhea,Igf-1 and Dht. Prolactin is also normal. My daily supps are 3,600mg Fish OIl, Vit C 3,000mg, 2 Multi Vitamins, Vit D3 @ 5,000iu. Flax Oil 3x's a week in a shot with Cranberry juice and Sativia. Any advice would be great guys. Sorry for the long post but I didn't want to leave anything out so u guys could help me as best u can. Thanks in advance.
 
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Wow, I thought this would be way more important to people than it obviously is considering everyone on here uses either AAS/TRT and should be concerned about how to improve their help of they run into this prob.
 
This is my 1st post to this forum and i'm excited bc their seem to be some pretty knowledgeable ppl on here when it comes to this problem and topic. A little background: 27yrs old been on Trt with Test cyp since April 2011. I am currently running 200mg/wk of Test Cyp, shot every Sun. I am 5ft 8" 245lbs and 13.5%bf. I just got my recent labs back 1wk ago and I was concerned about the RBC HGB levels and my TT to be honest. My RBC is 6.14 Ref (4.3-5.9)
My HGB is 16.5 Ref (13.9-16.4) and my Total Test on 200mg/wk is 554 Ref (250-1,100). The labs were done on the morning of my injection day before I pined. My Hematocrit is normal @47.5 Ref (39-55). I also use Aromasin at 12.5mg/day and on shot day and day after shot I use 25mg. My E2 is @ 15.1 Ref (5.37-65.9). Also my HDL is 27. Red Cross would not let me donate blood bc of pimples near my veins in my arm, I tried giving twice. I can't take aspirin bc I am on Depakote for Bi-Polar, the aspirin makes Depakote more toxic. My bp usually runs 120's/70-80's and my RHR is 60's. I would like to have my TT higher but I'm already on 200mg/wk of Test Cyp and Doc won't go any higher and I wouldn't want to increase my RBC,HGB any more anyway. Why is my TT not sky high on that dose ? Is it bc of my size ? My doc won't do Therapeutic Phlebatomy either, he did refer me to a hematologist tho, which I haven't seen yet. I just don't want to throw a clot or something from this but am I being paranoid with the #'s where they are ? I won't lower my Test dose bc I'm barely mid-range as it is. My dad does have a Hyper Coagulated State and Peripheral Vascular Disease with Diabetes and has had both legs amputated below the knee and he is 51yrs old. I had an echo last summer which was perfectly normal as well as my chest x-ray and ekg's. I also had ck/mb done and cardiac enzymes done in labs and they were also fine. My Iron and Ferritin are normal as well as b-12,dhea,Igf-1 and Dht. Prolactin is also normal. My daily supps are 3,600mg Fish OIl, Vit C 3,000mg, 2 Multi Vitamins, Vit D3 @ 5,000iu. Flax Oil 3x's a week in a shot with Cranberry juice and Sativia. Any advice would be great guys. Sorry for the long post but I didn't want to leave anything out so u guys could help me as best u can. Thanks in advance.

Are you Bipolar I or II?

Do you feel the AAS affect your condition?
 
your numbers are not terrible. With a hypercoagulable state disease possible though you can throw a clot even with a normal hemoglobin and hematocrit. Having said that, form what I have heard splitting doses of testosterone helps. doing 2 100 mg shots a week would be better. You will not fluctuate as much as well.

Question for you, how do you feel on trt? how old are u and how long u been on it. do you use hcg? how is ur libido?
 
Trust me, you'll get responses. People do have jobs! Maldorf in particular will have very solid advice for you!!

The hematologist might prescribe a regular phlebotomy to reduce RBC if they feel it's necessary. As for total test, other than the number, how do you feel? Personally, I wouldn't use anymore than you're using, considering your fathers condition...Too much risk there!!
 
Wow and I thought no one cared:love:. Anyhow, to answer a few of the questions. I did use Hcg for just a few weeks at 250iu 2days before and the day before my shot. It drove my E2 way up so that was stopped. I am on Trt bc I had 3 consecutive Testosterone test come back in the 100's from improper pct procedure on past AAS. I still feel tired and run down, although not as bad as before or at the lower dose. My dads condition, as I was told by his doctor usually skips a generation. My dad also had a history of alcoholism, marijuana use and cocaine abuse and years of Uncontrolled diabetes. I don't smoke or drink or do any drugs. I am 27. My libido is fine. Erections in the middle of the night and in morning and can get hard for sex without even being touched by my wife. I just got diagnosed with Bi-polar last year and no I don't believe Testosterone effects my mood. I will split the shots and see if that makes any diff in how I feel or how my bloodwork will react. 100mg/mon with 25mg Aromasin and 100mg/thurs with 25mg Aromasin. My doc told me today that before sending me to the Hematologist she wants to redo my labs without fasting while I'm well hydrated to see if that makes any diff in the reading. I have a couple bottles of Prop 100 laying around I was going to blast with @ 50mg EoD for 6 wks on top of my Trt dose, until I got my labs back. I'm just not wanting to chance it but I will run it if my BW comes back ok or I can go get the Therapeutic Phlebatomy done. I haven't blasted yet while on Trt so can anyone offer advice on that ? Anything else I can do to try to bring the blood counts down while I wait ? Thanks So far y'all.
 
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sneding u a pm
 
fryzway, unless you have these pimples near your arms veins 52 weeks a year [which would be its own problem] than you should just try and donate when the zits go away. You are correct that getting rid of that old blood will drop most of the numbers you are concerned with. The numbers you posted surely could be a tad better but they are not nearly as bad as ones I've seen in myself. Then again that's what prompted me to start donating as well.

As far as your total test being proportionally low. That's just the variance. Some guys will be over 1000 on 200mg others are like yourself. Rarely are guys lower than you on that dose. Having said that and doc's like alpha can attest that while 100-200mg is the default dosing for trt there are rare cases where the dose is as high as 300mg I've seen to bring guys into the upper-middle of normal. It's a very individual thing.

I'm not on Rx trt I just self dose on blasts and cruises. A cruise of 150-175mg/wk for me only gets to around 600mg myself, even 250mg/wk will only get me around 900-ish. Other guys will go over 1300 on 250wk. Now like you I keep a close on all aspects of blood. I also donate blood a few times a year [not the every 8 weeks like I should though]. I've had my hematocrit measured in the mid 50's on a blast but if I'm donating every couple months and cruising it can drop down into the upper 40's. I also just started aspirin therapy which I know you said you cannot do. I've got about the same HDL as you and mine used to be even lower but I've had to adjust my cruises down to that aforementioned 150-175mg level just so my HDL can recover as well as limited my ever increasing iron, rbc, hematocrit etc.

You're certainly heading in the right direction and doing what you can. Whether its the Red Cross or just therapeutic phlebatomy get that blood out every couple months and that will go a long way to keeping you in tip top shape.
 
Your numbers are nothing to worry about. Don't even sweat Hematocrit until it goes over 50%, which probably won't happen. Donating blood could actually drive it up higher (initially it will go down 1-2 points, then it will rebound even higher). Athletes that live at altitude are often over 50% crit naturally.

That being said, why is your total test level so low on 200mg? How long after your shot did you test? Also, your Aromasin dosage makes no sense, you are doing 12.5mg on the day of your shot then 25mg the day after, yet the actual testosterone from your shot will not even peak until 2 days after your shot. Aromasin has a halflife of 9 hours in males. You should be doing 1/4th of a tab per day maximum. What are your DHT levels like?
 
Damn, thanks for the replies guys. I will move the aromasin to 25mg 24 and 48hrs after my shot. As far as the 12.5mg on the rest of the rest of the wk I won't drop it lower bc my E2 stays around 15-20. I am also moving my shot to 100mg/Sun & 100mg/Wed to see if that helps me feel any diff or puts levels of TT any higher. As for my Dht, it is mid-upper range, not sure of the exact number. I will keep trying to donate at the RC. It's good to hear the experoences of others also. Thanks for sharing.
 
I forgot to mention that I tested on the day of my injection before I did my next pin. Does hydration reall have that muh effect on CBC ? I have no idea why my TT is that low on 200mg/wk that's what I was hoping y'all might be able to tell me
 
Your hemoglobin isnt dangerously high yet, but it could creep up if you dont keep an eye on it. I would see that hematologist. As you probably know I had a clot/heart attack abour 4 yrs ago and I now see a hematologist once a month to get a phlebotomy done. Mine runs higher than yours though. I would see the doc and get his advice on what to do. Since you have a family history of clots and youre on HRT you are at a much higher risk for clots.

You might be like me and have a genetic condtion for clots. I found out after my heart attack that I have a prothrombin mutation in my DNA. Maybe since you have a family history the hematologist will run a coagulability panel on you and test your for things like my prothrombin disorder and factor 5 etc, those require DNA tests. Did your dad ever get tested for these problems?
 
Thanks Maldorf. I'll check that link out and def see about that Hematologist after the next round of cbc here in a few wks. I may actually see if my Gp will order the u mention. It may be over his head and he may just want to wait to see what the new cb show. Can hematocrit, Rbc, Hgb etc be fine on one set of labs then come back higher in the next set even if the Test Cyp dose is unchanged ? Does it accumulate ?
 
Thanks Maldorf. I'll check that link out and def see about that Hematologist after the next round of cbc here in a few wks. I may actually see if my Gp will order the u mention. It may be over his head and he may just want to wait to see what the new cb show. Can hematocrit, Rbc, Hgb etc be fine on one set of labs then come back higher in the next set even if the Test Cyp dose is unchanged ? Does it accumulate ?

It accumulates and takes about 3 months to come down naturally on its own if you dont do a phlebotomy. A RBC has a lifespan of about 3 months if I remember correctly. Just a HRT dose of 100-150 mg/wk can cause this.
 

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