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Training to Failure Vs. Not Training to Failure

B-Trotter

Member
Registered
Joined
Mar 6, 2012
Messages
113
Hi,

for the last 3 years of training, I've trained every muscle and set (usually 2 per muscle) to failure. I've experimented with doing this 1, 2 & 3 times per week.

For the first three weeks, I'd gain strength rapidly, but thereafter I'd stagnate and even regress in strength - very disheartening.

Nevertheless, I kept this up for 3 years because I read on the internet that anything less and than failure means that you're not training hard enough.

However, after watching some of Lee Priests videos I decided to not train to failure, and to increase volume. I have maintained an abbreviated training routine with the same exercises but now with increased but moderate volume (6 sets over two exercises), and not to failure.

Strength gains and bodyweight gain have been linear for about 11 weeks now.

I have no doubt that by switching to a lower volume higher intensity approach I'd make rapid gains again but only for a few workouts, and then I'd definitely regress. Sure, periodisation could be an idea, but for me, a few workouts of strength before regresing isn't worth messing with the linear gains I'm getting on the lower intensity.

I suppose I'm putting this out there for those who, like me, kept hitting brick walls and stagnating by training to failure.

Anyone else feel the same?
 
Hi,

for the last 3 years of training, I've trained every muscle and set (usually 2 per muscle) to failure. I've experimented with doing this 1, 2 & 3 times per week.

For the first three weeks, I'd gain strength rapidly, but thereafter I'd stagnate and even regress in strength - very disheartening.

Nevertheless, I kept this up for 3 years because I read on the internet that anything less and than failure means that you're not training hard enough.

However, after watching some of Lee Priests videos I decided to not train to failure, and to increase volume. I have maintained an abbreviated training routine with the same exercises but now with increased but moderate volume (6 sets over two exercises), and not to failure.

Strength gains and bodyweight gain have been linear for about 11 weeks now.

I have no doubt that by switching to a lower volume higher intensity approach I'd make rapid gains again but only for a few workouts, and then I'd definitely regress. Sure, periodisation could be an idea, but for me, a few workouts of strength before regresing isn't worth messing with the linear gains I'm getting on the lower intensity.

I suppose I'm putting this out there for those who, like me, kept hitting brick walls and stagnating by training to failure.

Anyone else feel the same?

you need to understand what "training" is or should be.

that is your mistake.

it is probably the most common gym mistake.

learn about cns and why its important.

training is about training the cns more then anything. muscle damage is easy.

you gain strength as your body adapts, it develops new nerve innervations to become more efficient. you need to adapt and push this by adding weight.

firs 3-4 weeks you will get big strength gains, then they slow. it takes 6-8 weeks to develop new innervations. there you slow, then at some point you will stop and go the wrong way. this is the signal to stop that training cycle and recover.

you are missing the basics. that is the problem :lightbulb:
 
Hi,

for the last 3 years of training, I've trained every muscle and set (usually 2 per muscle) to failure. I've experimented with doing this 1, 2 & 3 times per week.

For the first three weeks, I'd gain strength rapidly, but thereafter I'd stagnate and even regress in strength - very disheartening.

Nevertheless, I kept this up for 3 years because I read on the internet that anything less and than failure means that you're not training hard enough.

However, after watching some of Lee Priests videos I decided to not train to failure, and to increase volume. I have maintained an abbreviated training routine with the same exercises but now with increased but moderate volume (6 sets over two exercises), and not to failure.

Strength gains and bodyweight gain have been linear for about 11 weeks now.

I have no doubt that by switching to a lower volume higher intensity approach I'd make rapid gains again but only for a few workouts, and then I'd definitely regress. Sure, periodisation could be an idea, but for me, a few workouts of strength before regresing isn't worth messing with the linear gains I'm getting on the lower intensity.

I suppose I'm putting this out there for those who, like me, kept hitting brick walls and stagnating by training to failure.

Anyone else feel the same?

Check out DUP principles by Layne Norton.
 
Constantly training to failure = burn out. Do it enough and you won't even want to step foot in the gym. Mental as well as physical burnout.

Have to know your body and train smart. :)
 
Load and consistency.. Yes training to failure is a powerful stimulus .. It has its place.. But train with appropriate loads.. Train with frequency.. Be consistent and your body will adapt.. I can train to failure ect fir about 4 weeks..mthe nI need to detain a bit .. I learned at my advanced age ;) that I need a week off every 8 to 10 weeks any way.. But training to failure is not " necessary" so to speak.. Knock on its door but don't enter if Ya know what I mean,, .. I know many that don't train to failure and look great.. I know many who do and look great.. The issue is that those who take gear have made what works even more confusing.. Everything works to an extent on gear.. So therefore you will get many answers..
 
Your talking about intensity. Of course both is necessary, however CNS, injuries, age, and overall fitness level will often dictate how often training to failure can occur.

Listen to your body.
 
I don't get how people DONT go to failure, why would the muscle grow if it's not being pushed?

I go to failure on at almost all my sets and I train high volume an have been for 5 years, it donesnt burn me out at all, I only have 1-2 days off per week too

Eg: 4 exercises on chest, say, flat bench, incline dumbbell, decline plate load, then cable cross overs, I would do 2 warm up sets on flat, say 80k then 100k, then do my heavy set (140k) to full failure 6-8 reps, plus have my spotted touch bar so I can get 3 more out, next set I would lighten the load an shoot for failure again, and make sure I get hard squeezes an slow tempo on this set, if reps end up too low then I'll turn it in to a drop set

Last 2 exercises I change and just shoot for failure on every set, mid range reps, around 15-20 and go for really hard contractions

Pretty much the same on all muscles
 
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I don't get how people DONT go to failure, why would the muscle grow if it's not being pushed?

I go to failure on at almost all my sets and I train high volume an have been for 5 years, it donesnt burn me out at all, I only have 1-2 days off per week too

Eg: 4 exercises on chest, say, flat bench, incline dumbbell, decline plate load, then cable cross overs, I would do 2 warm up sets on flat, say 80k then 100k, then do my heavy set (140k) to full failure 6-8 reps, plus have my spotted touch bar so I can get 3 more out, next set I would lighten the load an shoot for failure again, and make sure I get hard squeezes an slow tempo on this set, if reps end up too low then I'll turn it in to a drop set

Last 2 exercises I change and just shoot for failure on every set, mid range reps, around 15-20 and go for really hard contractions

Pretty much the same on all muscles

There's no way that my body would let me get away with that. I will say though, that the higher reps (15-20) do allow me to train closer to failure but produces little in the way of strength.
 
I don't get how people DONT go to failure, why would the muscle grow if it's not being pushed?

I go to failure on at almost all my sets and I train high volume an have been for 5 years, it donesnt burn me out at all, I only have 1-2 days off per week too

Eg: 4 exercises on chest, say, flat bench, incline dumbbell, decline plate load, then cable cross overs, I would do 2 warm up sets on flat, say 80k then 100k, then do my heavy set (140k) to full failure 6-8 reps, plus have my spotted touch bar so I can get 3 more out, next set I would lighten the load an shoot for failure again, and make sure I get hard squeezes an slow tempo on this set, if reps end up too low then I'll turn it in to a drop set

Last 2 exercises I change and just shoot for failure on every set, mid range reps, around 15-20 and go for really hard contractions

Pretty much the same on all muscles


But you're also probably "enhanced," which makes a huge difference in your recovery times.
 
the only time i DONT go to complete positive failure is when im on a deload phase... if im training, i go till the muscle stops, then ill even go further with some forced or mini reps..

recovery isnt going to matter whether you hit failure or not IMO.. more so on the # of sets and time between training the muscle again... i can do crazy hi volume w 16-20 sets stopping 1-2 reps short of failure and crush my cns where i need more days in between training that muscle, or i can goto failure on 2-3 sets hit style and be able to train that muscle sooner... of course the whole goal is to see how often and how many sets you can train a muscle and still be progressing with overload...

now, when we are talking HIT, we are talking heavier weights more so than probably a hi volume routine so i DO BELIEVE in deloading to give your joints, tendons, nerves a chance to recouperate... but it doesnt have to do with failure or not imo ... ill still goto failure, ill just work up in the 15-20 range instead of going heavy into the 6-10 range weights... i do cut out the forced reps, mini reps at the end when im deloading as well and usually just goto positive failure even on "pump sets" at the end
 
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Training to failure is the only way I can get stronger but to do it all day everyday my body will break down eventually. I will go to failure for several weeks at a time but then I'll drop it down to a weight I can control with every rep and set. Higher reps keeping the tempo squeezing flexing feeling the burn with every rep. Time under tension slowing it down. I think both have there place. I'm 48 I try not to lift the whole gym anymore. :D
 
Training to failure is the only way I can get stronger but to do it all day everyday my body will break down eventually. I will go to failure for several weeks at a time but then I'll drop it down to a weight I can control with every rep and set. Higher reps keeping the tempo squeezing flexing feeling the burn with every rep. Time under tension slowing it down. I think both have there place. I'm 48 I try not to lift the whole gym anymore. :D

Paraphrasing Ronnie: "Everybody wants to get big, don't nobody want to lift no heavy assed weights"

I think TOP is point on.
. I initially was focused on strength because of sports where that was beneficial. The byproduct was body changes. When I got in my mid twenties and sports were over, I still trained for strength. You know what? It was okay because I was "young".

I had have some setbacks, "Heart failure, Hip Replacement, Hillary running for President", that have caused me not be allowed for train for half years at a time more or less. I have always done a strength program, even at my advanced age, to get back a basic level of lifting strength.

It is a pain in the ass to do use less than 45 or 25 plates unless you are in a strength gaining phase. I always get back to a basic strength ability, and then never test increases in strength.

My doctors limits are quite a bit less. I was allowed 5 lb dumbells and twenty pound dumbells on strength movements. Yeah, about that. I will say I never ever put more than 315 on a bar. Ever. That is a limit I can work with at my age at my gym.

Your shoulders, tendons, ligaments, elbows, etc are much more important than loading up a bar. It is also unneeded outside the highest level competitions where 90 plus percent of us do not live.

I feel every time I post these days, I am yelling "Git off my lawn!", but I am just giving perspective from my age.

I have already lived through yours.

Pekkerwood
 
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I highly doubt anyone would see much different results whether they trained to failure or near failure. I am a near failure guy these days. Used to do to failure. I don't think it makes a difference at all really.
 
I don't get how people DONT go to failure, why would the muscle grow if it's not being pushed?

I go to failure on at almost all my sets and I train high volume an have been for 5 years, it donesnt burn me out at all, I only have 1-2 days off per week too

Eg: 4 exercises on chest, say, flat bench, incline dumbbell, decline plate load, then cable cross overs, I would do 2 warm up sets on flat, say 80k then 100k, then do my heavy set (140k) to full failure 6-8 reps, plus have my spotted touch bar so I can get 3 more out, next set I would lighten the load an shoot for failure again, and make sure I get hard squeezes an slow tempo on this set, if reps end up too low then I'll turn it in to a drop set

Last 2 exercises I change and just shoot for failure on every set, mid range reps, around 15-20 and go for really hard contractions

Pretty much the same on all muscles

i train so similar to this i almost feel like you are inside my brain
 
I highly doubt anyone would see much different results whether they trained to failure or near failure. I am a near failure guy these days. Used to do to failure. I don't think it makes a difference at all really.

There's a huge difference for me because -to failure training burns me out very quickly, even while "on." Thus, I don't gain and even go backwards.

I can't believe that I've wasted so many years going to failure.
 
i don't see how you can progressively overload your body with lbs or reps the FASTEST if you are stopping short of your index to tell you where you are failing... :confused:

if my max effort bench was 365x10, my goal next session is either 365x11 or 370x10... i am going to PUSH to be progressive where i FAILED before... how in the world am i going to be able to progress the FASTEST if i simply stop a rep or 2 short on every exercise when i "think" I'm going to fail.... I've had so many times where i thought it was my last rep, then BOOM, something like snaps in my head then 2...3...4 more..... of course not failing over time your body will adapt and that extra rep will come, there isn't one way... but I'm talking about building muscle the FASTEST way....

You guys are talking about getting burned out w failure.... your telling me 3 sets to failure 1x a week you are going to burn you out more so than 16-20 sets 1 short 2x a week? that is not a failure issue IMO but a volume and recovery issue....... now, if your doing 16 sets ALL to failure and trying to workout 2x a week, sure, i could see getting burnt out very very quickly...

Im not saying that failure is the only way, but i do believe constantly PUSHING mentally and physically to make PRs happen for reps with good form on each exercise, each training session will be the fastest way to gain tissue if your sups and food are right...


Also, don't get me wrong, i do believe your body needs DELOAD periods where you aren't progressively pushing PRs and start using more "pump" techniques.... your joints and tendons don't like constantly doing something they aren't use to...
 
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everything works at one time or another . Seriously stop thinking about and just get there. let your body tell you some days life will get in tge way and you just go through the movements . Other days you want to fuck shit up. As long as your diet is consitent with your goal and your form is good you cant do wrong in the gym.
 

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