"You don't need anything but protein to keep muscle"

[Cinder]

"You don't need anything to keep what you've gained (over the years) but high protein and trt dosages."

I was having a conversation with a few old giants at the airport. It was basically about longevity in the sport.
They were basically saying that unless you're trying to gain muscle... you don't need anything to keep what you've gained (over the years) but high protein and trt dosages. They're just trying to keep what they have, and be healthy. The rest of their diet being standard servings of healthy fats, veggies, fruits, and whole grains.

 

[Cinder]

Thoughts?

 

[maldorf]

All I can say is that for me when I would drop down to 250 mg/wk on a cruise I was just barely keeping what I had built up. If I had dropped down to 100 mg/wk, which is a true HRT dose, I would have surely lost size and strength. I never tried it because I was slowly losing some on the 250 mg/wk.

Now that I only take 100 mg/wk I have lost a lot of muscle, but don't lift very hard either because of my weak heart.

I would be curious to know what those guys thought a "hrt dose" was. I would definitely say though that you don't need to take nearly as high a dose to maintain as you did to build it in the first place. That much is true.

 

[brutus69]

All I can say is that for me when I would drop down to 250 mg/wk on a cruise I was just barely keeping what I had built up. If I had dropped down to 100 mg/wk, which is a true HRT dose, I would have surely lost size and strength. I never tried it because I was slowly losing some on the 250 mg/wk.

Now that I only take 100 mg/wk I have lost a lot of muscle, but don't lift very hard either because of my weak heart.

I would be curious to know what those guys thought a "hrt dose" was. I would definitely say though that you don't need to take nearly as high a dose to maintain as you did to build it in the first place. That much is true.

same here, 100 a week and ive gone from 235 to 205.
but i started at 185 so im at a heavier set point.
but thats scale weight. my chest measurement is 50, neck 18, legs 26 now. at 235 they were 52, 19. and 27. thats not that many inches less on a 30 pound weight loss. but i def look way smaller, i think maybe cuz the water bloat is gone and im a little leaner. still got the fuckin love handles tho.
what i have lost is strength. tons of strength. 270 pound pulldowns are hard for 8 reps. when i was on, 1.2 grams total, i'd do 320 for 8.
and 1.2 grams is the highest i ever went on a "blast" dose.
50 pounds on maybe 2-3 8 week blasts in 3 years. other than that i'd keep total dosage between 100-500 a week for a few months spread out in a year.

 

[Cinder]

All I can say is that for me when I would drop down to 250 mg/wk on a cruise I was just barely keeping what I had built up. If I had dropped down to 100 mg/wk, which is a true HRT dose, I would have surely lost size and strength. I never tried it because I was slowly losing some on the 250 mg/wk.

Now that I only take 100 mg/wk I have lost a lot of muscle, but don't lift very hard either because of my weak heart.

I would be curious to know what those guys thought a "hrt dose" was. I would definitely say though that you don't need to take nearly as high a dose to maintain as you did to build it in the first place. That much is true.

250 a week lol...was considered trt.
But also 350 -400 grams protein

 

[Delt123]

same here, 100 a week and ive gone from 235 to 205.
but i started at 185 so im at a heavier set point.
but thats scale weight. my chest measurement is 50, neck 18, legs 26 now. at 235 they were 52, 19. and 27. thats not that many inches less on a 30 pound weight loss. but i def look way smaller, i think maybe cuz the water bloat is gone and im a little leaner. still got the fuckin love handles tho.
what i have lost is strength. tons of strength. 270 pound pulldowns are hard for 8 reps. when i was on, 1.2 grams total, i'd do 320 for 8.
and 1.2 grams is the highest i ever went on a "blast" dose.
50 pounds on maybe 2-3 8 week blasts in 3 years. other than that i'd keep total dosage between 100-500 a week for a few months spread out in a year.

Why did you drop to trt/ stop blasting? I assume health but is it as a precaution or did you had Some health issues?

 

[maldorf]

250 a week lol...was considered trt.
But also 350 -400 grams protein

Well, if they consider that TRT, then yeah I can believe it because I was just about able to maintain 235 lbs pretty lean on that at 6 foot tall. That isn't TRT though, it is about 2x the amount. Most on here know that now though.

 

[nihilixm]

keeping things on trt is a meme

maybe if gh is in play and trt is like 400mg or somth...but if you blast grams tren or sdrol etc continuously then drop down to 150-250 test yea youre gonna lose gains.

especially if youre cutting ...rip

 

[nothuman]

"You don't need anything to keep what you've gained (over the years) but high protein and trt dosages."

I was having a conversation with a few old giants at the airport. It was basically about longevity in the sport.
They were basically saying that unless you're trying to gain muscle... you don't need anything to keep what you've gained (over the years) but high protein and trt dosages. They're just trying to keep what they have, and be healthy. The rest of their diet being standard servings of healthy fats, veggies, fruits, and whole grains.

High protein, TRT, and weight training are the three best weapons in the war on atrophy when one stops using AAS.

Even if you do lose some over time, you could bump the dose up for a few weeks to get the muscle memory going and get it back, before dropping back to TRT.

 

[Kaladryn]

I have noticed that a lot of people aren't actually trying to be freaks, they don't realize how lean and muscular they can be on only minimal TRT doses, eventually, they realize the health risks for doing things competitive bodybuilders do is not only unwise but also unnecessary to achieve their goals.

High protein doesn't do jack shit, it's more about overall nutrition and health, especially as you get older. TRT doses will keep you surprisingly big if you have been bigger in the past...

 

[suppdude]

Listen to the new rxmuscle with John meadows and they talk about this exact thing.

 

[dale338]

I have noticed that a lot of people aren't actually trying to be freaks, they don't realize how lean and muscular they can be on only minimal TRT doses, eventually, they realize the health risks for doing things competitive bodybuilders do is not only unwise but also unnecessary to achieve their goals.

High protein doesn't do jack shit, it's more about overall nutrition and health, especially as you get older. TRT doses will keep you surprisingly big if you have been bigger in the past...

This right here is where I'm at. I've never been in the class of a "freak" just a big gym rat. was always naturally built and didn't need any drugs. then it all started slowing in my early 40's and about three years ago, I went into TRT with some sides thrown in with the main purposes of anti-aging, building and or keeping lean vascular muscle and keeping the younger women coming in. LOL. And I must say, aside from my three month drinking vacation, I did very well. GH. 125mg T. occasional masteron, or proviron, and a few times per year I'll hit some HCG to flex the boys, supplements I use are amino acids, green powders like spirulina, etc. DHEA, vitamin D, vitamin B. and if I do say so myself, I'm now 51, sill get guessed my age in my late 30's by most women I go on dates with.

There is a lot to be said for keeping your hormones balanced, steady and level and throwing in a low dose of like GH, etc. maybe a few times per year make it all pop with some Masteron. Don't need much to keep it all good.

 

[Elvia1023]

I have noticed that a lot of people aren't actually trying to be freaks, they don't realize how lean and muscular they can be on only minimal TRT doses, eventually, they realize the health risks for doing things competitive bodybuilders do is not only unwise but also unnecessary to achieve their goals.

High protein doesn't do jack shit, it's more about overall nutrition and health, especially as you get older. TRT doses will keep you surprisingly big if you have been bigger in the past...

Exactly. High protein can be useful for maintaining muscle but it's the overall diet that is most important. We don't need a lot of protein to maintain muscle especially with protein sparing carbs/fats in place. Moreover, only a small amount of protein is actually used for muscle maintenance/repair. Maintaining muscle you have held for years is very easy as long as you're on trt, eat well and train hard (or smart).

I do come across some people who bullshit because they say they have come off everything for life when it's clear as day they must be on TRT (at least). It's like they don't count TRT as using because it's through a doctor. Some can maintain more than others but it's night and day going down to TRT compared to coming off everything after using steroids for many years.

 

[maldorf]

I do come across some people who bullshit because they say they have come off everything for life when it's clear as day they must be on TRT (at least). It's like they don't count TRT as using because it's through a doctor. Some can maintain more than others but it's night and day going down to TRT compared to coming off everything after using steroids for many years.

Another thing I seem to see on here is so many guys calling 200 to 300 mg/wk TRT. It is more like 100 to 200 mg tops. Most seem to get up to 800 total test on between 100 and 150 per week. 200 to 300 a week is a small cycle, not trt.

 

[Elvia1023]

Another thing I seem to see on here is so many guys calling 200 to 300 mg/wk TRT. It is more like 100 to 200 mg tops. Most seem to get up to 800 total test on between 100 and 150 per week. 200 to 300 a week is a small cycle, not trt.

Yeah I see that all the time on here. Just on TRT at the moment 250mg test and 100mg tren I have even seen dbol listed on a trt cycle before

I am weird in the sense that I cruised and came off everything at times. Although I don't plan to do that again as it fucked my body up too much last time. I like the mental break from everything so it's always a possibility though. I also stay on blast for long periods at times but not at high doses. Although my cruise is 150mg test every time unless I can be bothered doing ed injs then it will be 20mg max per day.

I come across a lot of guys who either cruise on 500mg+ or just stay on blast all the time.

 

[buck]

Even on doses that are 2x TRT I have lost muscle from my biggest over the last several years. But I am older and not lifting as much weight as I did years ago.

 

[Gearsofwar]

I don’t think trt doses are enough juice to keep what you built, not when it took grams to get to a high level of development. But if your talking about the average gym rat then yes.

 

[1bigmofo]

when comming off or lowering dose to a true trt dose, isn’t the immediate loss in the first 3 weeks mostly water? or are we truly loosing muscle in those 3 weeks? Im refering to comming off test.

 

[Elvia1023]

when comming off or lowering dose to a true trt dose, isn’t the immediate loss in the first 3 weeks mostly water? or are we truly loosing muscle in those 3 weeks? Im refering to comming off test.

Yes that is water in most cases. Although that can still make a massive difference to someone's appearance both for the better or worse. Someone lean but full of water when they come off cycle dropping the water will likely make them look better. There are so many variables but usually I will look better after those 3 weeks because I tighten up all over. Now if my cycle was test p, tren a and avar and I was cutting I would obviously not look as good 3 weeks later. Now someone who is small but very lean may look much better with the added water as they look much bigger/fuller with it.

I am obviously nothing special so it's not like I am some 300 pound pro but I can maintain very well on 150mg test. Sure you won't look as good over time but it's not like I melt away like I would with zero test. On zero test at about the 3 month mark there is a massive difference in the way I look/feel off everything.

Some may not be able to maintain that well but I think most would be surprised. I know many who are even scared to come down to a real TRT dose. Sounds silly but it's very true and they think they will melt away Although over the last few years the mindset has definitely swifted and more and more guys don't add to their TRT dose fearing they will shrink. Although more definitely do he opposite now and cruise on test, tren, mast, primo etc.

Now if you took tonnes of gear and weren't that lean and grew on cycle sure you won't be able to maintain as well. But if you blast and cruise over years maintaining the same sort of weight without having any big off periods from training etc then you should be ok. Now I have never stayed on 150mg test for 2 years for example so maybe things change over the long run but as long as you're eating and training effectively I don't see there being a big difference even over the long run.

I also come across some guys who train much differently on TRT as well. Basically they don't train as hard. Granted there needs to be deload periods and to train smart (recovery in mind) but I would train the same whether I was enhanced or natural. The same can be said for diet as well. It's like they think I am on blast/cycle now so I will put 100% in but to maintain all year the same thinking needs to be applied to off periods as well.

 

[maldorf]

when comming off or lowering dose to a true trt dose, isn’t the immediate loss in the first 3 weeks mostly water? or are we truly loosing muscle in those 3 weeks? Im refering to comming off test.

The loses early on are yeah, but slowly you begin to lose strength too and that's when you know you are losing muscle. If you keep pushing hard in the gym the loss is slow, but slowly you have to drop weight and intensity. You just cant lift as much weight and if you try to youll end up hurting yourself and overtraining. I tried and failed. Volume you drop some too but not as much. That's my experience.