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T4 vs T3 use with Hgh

whacked

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Which do you use and why?

I used to be in the camp that subscribed to the notion that low dose T3 just made more sense if and when GH drove Thyroid levels down from long term use due to it being active and direct thyroid hormone. No guessing involved.

Also read that T4 ramps up TBG (Thyroid Binding Globulin) and/or rT3 (Reverse Thyroid) after extended use and either of these essentially bound up quite a bit of active free T3. No bueno.

Conversely, I’ve also read that T4 is not only not as catabolic but had some mild anabolic attributes.

So confused. Any insight is appreciated.
 
Last edited:
Which do you use and why?

I used to be in the camp that subscribed to the notion that low dose T3 just made more sense if and when GH drove Thyroid levels down from long term use due to it being active and direct thyroid hormone. No guessing involved.

Also read that T4 ramps up TBG (Thyroid Binding Globulin) and/or rT3 (Reverse Thyroid) after extended use and either of these essentially bound up quite a bit of active free T3. No bueno.

Conversely, I’ve also read that T4 is not only not as catabolic but had some mild anabolic attributes.

So confused. Any insight is appreciated.


T4 and T3 are fairly poor fat burners. The others are much better.

At best, high dose T4 will increase BMR by 2-4% according to research on humans.

T3 at +50 mcg can make you flat and can decrease strength and endurance.

GH does not decrease thyroid activity. It increases the conversion of T4 to T3, so it does lower T4 but only because it's being converted.

Reverse T3 is completely inert and does not block T3, that's a myth. Zero proof and only started from stopthyroidmadness bs.
 
BB, you are correct when saying T3 is a poor fat burner when used as a stand alone. I have switched my way of thinking in the last few years....however, 50 mcg can be very effective when consuming large amounts of food with enough AAS.

I have a shit ton of previous experience using T3 and never felt bad at 50mcg. I typically didn't ever go flat or lose strength...etc.

Enough of that, would I see the need to use T3 on a couple of IUs of HGH, no.
 
I take t4 100 mcg eod year around,doctor prescribe. I also cruise blast and do 3 ius of gh year around,not doctor prescribed :D
 
BB, you are correct when saying T3 is a poor fat burner when used as a stand alone. I have switched my way of thinking in the last few years....however, 50 mcg can be very effective when consuming large amounts of food with enough AAS.

I have a shit ton of previous experience using T3 and never felt bad at 50mcg. I typically didn't ever go flat or lose strength...etc.

Enough of that, would I see the need to use T3 on a couple of IUs of HGH, no.

Yeah, if carbs/protein are high enough, it can offset the flatness. Thyroid hormone increases glycogen and nitrogen turn over. So your body uses up more and has a harder time keeping stores full.


Flatness in scientific terms is just low glycogen levels in the muscle. AAS will further help offset the effects as they can also artificially increase glycogen and nitrogen levels in the muscle.


T3 is great for energy @25-50 mcg on a long/harsh cut as the body sharply decreases conversion of T4 to T3 in response to decreasing levels of leptin from fat loss and low calories/carbs.


T3 can also enhance the efficacy of other stimulants by sensitizing beta adrenergic receptors to beta receptor agonists like ephedrine and clenbuterol.
 
Which do you use and why?

I used to be in the camp that subscribed to the notion that low dose T3 just made more sense if and when GH drove Thyroid levels down from long term use due to it being active and direct thyroid hormone. No guessing involved.

Also read that T4 ramps up TBG (Thyroid Binding Globulin) and/or rT3 (Reverse Thyroid) after extended use and either of these essentially bound up quite a bit of active free T3. No bueno.

Conversely, I’ve also read that T4 is not only not as catabolic but had some mild anabolic attributes.

So confused. Any insight is appreciated.

You should make a blood test. If T3 T4 TSH are great, you don t need to take medication.
 
You should make a blood test. If T3 T4 TSH are great, you don t need to take medication.

Yeah, he should wait a few weeks so that his endogenous production recovers just in case there was some T3 in the stuff he took.


Preferably FREE T4 and FREE T3 instead of regular T4/T3.


That's the biologically active fraction for each respective hormone. TSH is okay, but it gives you the least amount of information.


It's like using LH to test your testicular function instead of directly looking at serum Testosterone levels.
 
Thanks for all the help all! Much appreciated
 
Currently on my first run of hgh. I had bloods pulled one month in and it revealed that I had low T4 and high T3. Therefore I am now taking t4.

I’ve read that after 3 months that my thyroid should normalize on gh and I could discontinue the t4. Not sure if it’s true so I’ll drop the T4 for two weeks in a few months and test agin to see




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:
Currently on my first run of hgh. I had bloods pulled one month in and it revealed that I had low T4 and high T3. Therefore I am now taking t4.

I’ve read that after 3 months that my thyroid should normalize on gh and I could discontinue the t4. Not sure if it’s true so I’ll drop the T4 for two weeks in a few months and test agin to see




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, HGH is proven to increase Free T3 by increasing deiodination of T4. This lowers Free T4 because it's being converted into Free T3.


The second part is bullshit. It does not normalize after 3 months.


T4 does have some functions that T3 cannot perform contrary to popular belief that only T3 is "active". They both play important and unique roles in the body. So there may be a benefit to supplementing T4 with GH useage and it has been show in a study in chickens to increase anabolism (The T4)


Study about HGH effect on T4 and T3 levels:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1365-2265.1994.tb01826.x?sid=nlm:pubmed
 
I know what the research shows but HGH didn't raise my FT3 or lower my FT4 at all. My body's T4 to T3 conversion just sucks so I am probably the exception.
 
I know what the research shows but HGH didn't raise my FT3 or lower my FT4 at all. My body's T4 to T3 conversion just sucks so I am probably the exception.

Yeah, probably just you.


You also said your IGF-1 levels are already super high in the 300s ng/mL which might explain the discrepancy.
 
Yeah, probably just you.


You also said your IGF-1 levels are already super high in the 300s ng/mL which might explain the discrepancy.

Yea I was wondering if there was any relationship there. IGF is routinely between 303-313. I wonder if there is a connection...
 
Yea I was wondering if there was any relationship there. IGF is routinely between 303-313. I wonder if there is a connection...

I would assume there's a good chance that's the reason. There ARE some effects of HGH that are completely independent from IGF-1, but IGF-1 is a significant determinant of it's biological activity.



I think this is why some guys running tren/nolvadex who don't see a big rise in IGF-1 still get good results from HGH.



The two things i've seen that have the biggest effect on free T3 conversion with data to back it up are 1. HGH administration 2. High carb/calorie intake



300s ng/mL IGF-1 is the equivalent of 3 IU HGH for the average person and levels seen in your average late teens/early twenties male. I think you mentioned you were in your 30s, so that's an awesome level.
 
So I wonder if taking bitiron T3/T4 12.5/50 would be a better choice with gh? Ive only ever taken T4 with gh the first 30 days or so just for lethargy
 
Yeah, he should wait a few weeks so that his endogenous production recovers just in case there was some T3 in the stuff he took.


Preferably FREE T4 and FREE T3 instead of regular T4/T3.


That's the biologically active fraction for each respective hormone. TSH is okay, but it gives you the least amount of information.


It's like using LH to test your testicular function instead of directly looking at serum Testosterone levels.

You are absolutely correct.
 
I would assume there's a good chance that's the reason. There ARE some effects of HGH that are completely independent from IGF-1, but IGF-1 is a significant determinant of it's biological activity.



I think this is why some guys running tren/nolvadex who don't see a big rise in IGF-1 still get good results from HGH.



The two things i've seen that have the biggest effect on free T3 conversion with data to back it up are 1. HGH administration 2. High carb/calorie intake



300s ng/mL IGF-1 is the equivalent of 3 IU HGH for the average person and levels seen in your average late teens/early twenties male. I think you mentioned you were in your 30s, so that's an awesome level.

I'll be 34 in a month so it's definitely high for my age. I think it's good but I also have to wonder if that explains why my free T3 sucks (2.9). Who knows
 
I'll be 34 in a month so it's definitely high for my age. I think it's good but I also have to wonder if that explains why my free T3 sucks (2.9). Who knows

What's your body fat %?


Being very lean will lead to lower T3 levels. So does lower carb intake.
 
Yes, HGH is proven to increase Free T3 by increasing deiodination of T4. This lowers Free T4 because it's being converted into Free T3.


The second part is bullshit. It does not normalize after 3 months.


T4 does have some functions that T3 cannot perform contrary to popular belief that only T3 is "active". They both play important and unique roles in the body. So there may be a benefit to supplementing T4 with GH useage and it has been show in a study in chickens to increase anabolism (The T4)


Study about HGH effect on T4 and T3 levels:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1365-2265.1994.tb01826.x?sid=nlm:pubmed

What are your thoughts on this study, as it seems to support the claim that thyroid function returns to normal 3 months into using GH?
 

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