Study: High-Dose TRT Reduces Heart Attack and Death Risk in Men with Heart Disease

[Bleed]

This is interesting and counterintuitive. I havent seen this one posted yet.

CLINICAL EFFECTS OF TESTOSTERONE SUPPLEMENTATION AMONG HYPO-ANDROGENIC MEN WITH PREEXISTING SEVERE CORONARY ARTERY DISEASE: THE INTERMOUNTAIN HEART COLLABORATIVE STUDY | JACC: Journal of the American College of Cardiology

The research team studied 755 male patients at Intermountain Healthcare hospitals. The men were between the ages of 58 and 78, and all had severe coronary artery disease. They were split into three different groups, which received varied doses of testosterone administered either by injection or gel.
The medium-dose group achieved normal levels - up to 742 ng/dl, while the high-dose group had levels over 742 ng/dl. The conclusions:
After one year, 64 patients who weren’t taking testosterone supplements suffered major adverse cardiovascular events, while only 12 who were taking medium doses of testosterone and nine who were taking high doses did.
After three years, 125 non-testosterone-therapy patients suffered major adverse cardiovascular events, while only 38 medium-dose and 22 high-dose patients did.
After three years, 99 patients who weren’t taking testosterone supplements had died, while only 25 medium-dose and 9 high-dose did.
This is one of the first studies that compares medium-dose to high-dose TRT. High-dose TRT was able to reduce death by 400% compared to no TRT and by 200% compared to medium-dose TRT over a 3 year time period in people with heart disease. Up to date there hasn't been a single drug that has produced better results in a clinical trial.

 

[nothuman]

Can you link you part that you copied and pasted?

Great stuff

 

[Bleed]

I would have linked to it but its reddit. Ill go back and grab the link from there. I thought the pasted part was either the abstract or conclusion but it looks like it could be one of the posters extrapolation of the data.

Can you link you part that you copied and pasted?

Great stuff

 

[Bleed]

Here is the link to reddit. Posted by gp_dude.

https://www.reddit.com/r/steroids/comments/f7sfy9

 

[muscle96ss]

This is interesting and counterintuitive. I havent seen this one posted yet.

CLINICAL EFFECTS OF TESTOSTERONE SUPPLEMENTATION AMONG HYPO-ANDROGENIC MEN WITH PREEXISTING SEVERE CORONARY ARTERY DISEASE: THE INTERMOUNTAIN HEART COLLABORATIVE STUDY | JACC: Journal of the American College of Cardiology

The research team studied 755 male patients at Intermountain Healthcare hospitals. The men were between the ages of 58 and 78, and all had severe coronary artery disease. They were split into three different groups, which received varied doses of testosterone administered either by injection or gel.
The medium-dose group achieved normal levels - up to 742 ng/dl, while the high-dose group had levels over 742 ng/dl. The conclusions:
After one year, 64 patients who weren’t taking testosterone supplements suffered major adverse cardiovascular events, while only 12 who were taking medium doses of testosterone and nine who were taking high doses did.
After three years, 125 non-testosterone-therapy patients suffered major adverse cardiovascular events, while only 38 medium-dose and 22 high-dose patients did.
After three years, 99 patients who weren’t taking testosterone supplements had died, while only 25 medium-dose and 9 high-dose did.
This is one of the first studies that compares medium-dose to high-dose TRT. High-dose TRT was able to reduce death by 400% compared to no TRT and by 200% compared to medium-dose TRT over a 3 year time period in people with heart disease. Up to date there hasn't been a single drug that has produced better results in a clinical trial.

I wouldn't say counterintuitive, there have been studies for a long time showing that low T levels is dangerous from a heart perspective and TRT levels show benefits from a heart perspective. My only question would be when they say the high dosage group was ">742"; how much greater as I would say once you start getting a bit above around 1100 or so, then I would agree about it being counterintuitive. Also, I am wondering why they chose the cut-off for high dosage to be 742, thats an odd number to choose and wonder if it was chosen before the data was tabulated or after in order to manipulate the narrative.

 

[Deleted member 121863]

Great study. I`m gonna try and find full data and see if the measured estrogen levels as well. That is a big part of equation towards negative health events and mortality in that demographic.

 

[Bleed]

This method of keeping estrogen higher is new to me but it seems it's the way to go for health purposes.

Great study. I`m gonna try and find full data and see if the measured estrogen levels as well. That is a big part of equation towards negative health events and mortality in that demographic.

 

[totalrecomp]

What I would not give for this study to have included a 900-1200 group and a 1200-1500 group. That data would have been really cool. I am sure that the trend would be away from reduced risk but it would be interesting to see if HIGH ie 1000+ is safer than LOW sub 300. I am talking ng/dl not mg/week for the record.

Thank you for the study. I have been trying for years to get some of the older men in my family to look into TRT. My dad has great levels so no need yet but my uncle is borderline cripple due to nerve disease and loos of muscle but his old ass doc told him TRT would give him heart disease. I keep saying would you not prefer to be mobile and feel good for 10 years vs cripple for 12??? This is assuming his doc is right which he is NOT. Oh well.

Thank you!

 

[Bleed]

In my opinion, higher than average doses of test levels are going to be better than having crashed levels. Even if it werent the case, id rather live to 60 years old and enjoy my time here than to get to just get to 80. Quality beats quantity every time. We are all going to die and I choose this path.

In regards to your family, there are a lot of older guys that just dont get it. Most never will. All the men in my immediate family and step family (especially my step dad, the poster child for self inflicted heart disease, diabetes, and self deception) have it all figured out im their minds. A lot of has to do with their perception of masculinity. A lot has to do with social programming. Thats an uphill battle my friend and I wish you the best of luck.

What I would not give for this study to have included a 900-1200 group and a 1200-1500 group. That data would have been really cool. I am sure that the trend would be away from reduced risk but it would be interesting to see if HIGH ie 1000+ is safer than LOW sub 300. I am talking ng/dl not mg/week for the record.

Thank you for the study. I have been trying for years to get some of the older men in my family to look into TRT. My dad has great levels so no need yet but my uncle is borderline cripple due to nerve disease and loos of muscle but his old ass doc told him TRT would give him heart disease. I keep saying would you not prefer to be mobile and feel good for 10 years vs cripple for 12??? This is assuming his doc is right which he is NOT. Oh well.

Thank you!

 

[nothuman]

In my opinion, higher than average doses of test levels are going to be better than having crashed levels. Even if it werent the case, id rather live to 60 years old and enjoy my time here than to get to just get to 80. Quality beats quantity every time. We are all going to die and I choose this path.

It doesn't have to be either/or.

If you make the right choices and have decent genetics, you can live to 80 WITH quality of life. Or longer. Not everyone has to be a cripple 80 year old.

 

[Bleed]

It wasnt trying to present a false dichotomy as reality. Just stating if having to choose in a theoretical, what my choice would be.

It doesn't have to be either/or.

If you make the right choices and have decent genetics, you can live to 80 WITH quality of life. Or longer. Not everyone has to be a cripple 80 year old.

 

[maldorf]

id rather live to 60 years old and enjoy my time here than to get to just get to 80. Quality beats quantity every time. We are all going to die and I choose this path.

You wouldn't be saying that if you were 60 years old and the grim reaper is on his way to visit you. Youd be praying to God to let you live longer. Trust me, Ive been there.

 

[Bleed]

I dont believe in any god and I dont pray. Ive watched my mother die a slow death of cancer that left me with 10 years of horrible vivid memories. There are things worse than death. We will have to agree to disagree. Quality of life is the only thing that matters.

You wouldn't be saying that if you were 60 years old and the grim reaper is on his way to visit you. Youd be praying to God to let you live longer. Trust me, Ive been there.

 

[maldorf]

I dont believe in any god and I dont pray. Ive watched my mother die a slow death of cancer that left me with 10 years of horrible vivid memories. There are things worse than death. We will have to agree to disagree. Quality of life is the only thing that matters.

God or not, you are fooling yourself if you think that even if you are young and it is your time to die that you will just welcome it with open arms.

 

[Bleed]

No one welcomes death. No one wants to die. No one wants to think they have to leave the party but the party will continue on without them.

Theres a difference between being suicidal and accepting the inevitable outcome of a life. You get this one shot. You can do your best to stay as healthy as you want and still get killed by a drunk driver or get shot by a lunatic stopping for 16oz of grassfed beef. You can be a young 25 year old girl who finds out she has a granular brain blastoma and if she doesnt end her life on her terms by going to a state that allows assisted suicide, shes going to die the most painful and degrading death a person can suffer with the added benefit of having all her loved ones watch her going through it and the subsequent life long trauma theyll carry until they also die. This is reality. Its not welcoming with open arms. Its making the toughest decision of your life. I dont think any sane person is hyped for that.

Ultimately all you have control of is your own actions.

There are worse things than being dead. Enjoy your time here while it lasts. I only speak for me but if I can no longer enjoy myself and the meaning of life becomes pain and the best they can do is "keep me comfortable" then Ill be taking that trip to Oregon too. Not because I welcome death but because I know dying is inevitable but I still have control over how I die.

Like I said, there are worse things than death

God or not, you are fooling yourself if you think that even if you are young and it is your time to die that you will just welcome it with open arms.

 

[pesty4077]

I just turn 60. Trust me, it gets here a lot faster then most realize. I am however, healthy as a horse. I rather have quality of life too, then to be in poor health and live longer.

 

[Bleed]

Do you feel this lifestyle has done you more good than harm? Because most of the guys I personally know in their early fifties arent healthy people. Granted none are bodybuilders or AAS users.

My cousin died at 51 years old, right after a massive heart attack and a nasty divorce. Dude said "I dont feel good" and just fell down and died. He had no history of PED usage. None at all. Zero prohormones. He lifted and took creatine and protein. The last pics I saw of him he looked so rough I wanted to say something.

It is good to get some confirmation you can age while enjoying life. I think someone said mike ohearn is 50? Theres a spectrum. It seems age is relative like most metrics.

If I can live to be a centenarian while enjoying life sign me up. Then sometime past 2070 when they ask me, I can tell them what I was really up to with zero fucks to give. I have a feeling a few board members here will pick up and apply enough health knowledge to outlive a lot of family and friends.

I just turn 60. Trust me, it gets here a lot faster then most realize. I am however, healthy as a horse. I rather have quality of life too, then to be in poor health and live longer.

 

[IronLion2]

I've discussed this finding with some of my colleagues and professors, none of them can find any reason to discredit the results. My undergrad was in data science so that's always my first thought, where's the skewness or bias? This study on its own isn't concrete but 100% warrants more research. A more robust follow up and I think a lot of TRT clinics are going to be making a lot of money.

 

[NEMSZ]

Do you feel this lifestyle has done you more good than harm? Because most of the guys I personally know in their early fifties arent healthy people. Granted none are bodybuilders or AAS users.

My cousin died at 51 years old, right after a massive heart attack and a nasty divorce. Dude said "I dont feel good" and just fell down and died. He had no history of PED usage. None at all. Zero prohormones. He lifted and took creatine and protein. The last pics I saw of him he looked so rough I wanted to say something.

It is good to get some confirmation you can age while enjoying life. I think someone said mike ohearn is 50? Theres a spectrum. It seems age is relative like most metrics.

If I can live to be a centenarian while enjoying life sign me up. Then sometime past 2070 when they ask me, I can tell them what I was really up to with zero fucks to give. I have a feeling a few board members here will pick up and apply enough health knowledge to outlive a lot of family and friends.

You can absolutely have a long life and still be active and healthy.. Depending on genetics and how you care for yourself.. But I know of several people who lived into their 80’s and even late 90’s and were active.. Yes ACTIVE.. Walking around town, farming, drinking wine and playing pool with friends etc.. There’s even a 98 year old man who goes to my barbershop and he dances salsa and does pushups etc..

Mike O’Hearn is a shit example because yes, he’s 50.. But he definitely uses AAS/HGH and he absolutely has had work done (surgery) on his face...

 

[chopsuey]

You can absolutely have a long life and still be active and healthy.. Depending on genetics and how you care for yourself.. But I know of several people who lived into their 80’s and even late 90’s and were active.. Yes ACTIVE.. Walking around town, farming, drinking wine and playing pool with friends etc.. There’s even a 98 year old man who goes to my barbershop and he dances salsa and does pushups etc..

Mike O’Hearn is a shit example because yes, he’s 50.. But he definitely uses AAS/HGH and he absolutely has had work done (surgery) on his face...

Yes I think the crucial part here is genetics. Life extension is something I follow closely and from my understanding centurians don't do anything special to live that long they just have good genetics that combats degeneration.

My grand grand father lived to 99 I believe and he smoked for 55 of those years, drank beer till the end and ate whatever he wanted, was strong and moving around himself and I think what killed him in the end was when he lost his wife and was depressed as fuck as everyone he knew basically passed on already.

I hope I've got that side of the family's genetics lol.

Regarding the OP I'd be curious to see if its the T thats causing the benifit, the elevated estrogen or maybe everything together?