Mr. O takes less than a gram

[johnjuanb1]

My view is that the greatest service that one could provide to the community would be an objective, compound-specific risk/reward (tradeoff) itemized list. Nobody can truthfully place themselves in another's shoes and perform a risk/reward balancing on their behalf. This would be a considerable undertaking, and I am not proposing that anyone actually devote themself to the task per se; but merely observing that YouTubers and social media "harm reduction" experts and pro BBers alike are spinning fantastical claims to satisfy the algorithm at the expense of honesty.

Clearly, most are not fairly able to even identify the risks, rewards & rational objectives of the full spectrum of compounds in popular use. These "gurus" and "role models" are making a fortune off the knowledge gap that exists.

Aside from promoting an objective risk/reward profile for a compound, I believe it is pure arrogance for anyone to lie "to protect the sheep" - and a dishonest rationalization.

 

[rotinaj]

I feel like there’s no end to this conversation.

Because people rather increase their dosages and project their insecurities from the results they don’t have while calling other people liars, instead of talking about the other factors beyond doses that could cause some to be more muscular.

Do they have more muscle cells? What hypertrophic gains have they trained for? What training frequency? Ice baths? Stem cel therapy? Fascial tissue variations, physical therapy, sleep quality with more/less rem, better periworkout nutrition…

People have turned bodybuilding into pharmaceutical warfare.

But watch the thread keep taking about “honesty” instead of “possibilities.”

 

[jaxino]

While new threads asking for advice on how to effectively take thousands of mg’s gear continue to pop up, the classic Mr. O mentions he only take a couple hundred mg’s of gear to prep for his show.

I would say I’m surprised people aren’t talking about this since was posted nearly a week ago but people like to have confirmation bias to support their abuse of gear.

Thoughts on this?

The incredible thing is not that Chris takes 200mg but that YOU think that he is not bullshitting you and all his fan base.

I stopped listening to IFBBPROs most of them are just a bunch of useless bullshit.

You want really know what HIS coach Iain Valliere advised to me to run on Instagram DM like more than a year ago?

I was 240lbs when i sent him my photos:
1g TestE
600mg EQ
350 TrenAce
6 to 8iu HGH ed
Humalog postwo

Now for a 270lbs on offseason how much do you think he can run? 200mg? Come on......

 

[jaxino]

Because people rather increase their dosages and project their insecurities from the results they don’t have while calling other people liars, instead of talking about the other factors beyond doses that could cause some to be more muscular.

Do they have more muscle cells? What hypertrophic gains have they trained for? What training frequency? Ice baths? Stem cel therapy? Fascial tissue variations, physical therapy, sleep quality with more/less rem, better periworkout nutrition…

People have turned bodybuilding into pharmaceutical warfare.

But watch the thread keep taking about “honesty” instead of “possibilities.”

Professional Bodybuilding IS pharmaceutical warfare?

When top notch genes go one against each other what do you think that counts?

You are so naive boi.

 

[Dens228]

The incredible thing is not that Chris takes 200mg but that YOU think that he is not bullshitting you and all his fan base.

I stopped listening to IFBBPROs most of them are just a bunch of useless bullshit.

You want really know what HIS coach Iain Valliere advised to me to run on Instagram DM like more than a year ago?

I was 240lbs when i sent him my photos:
1g TestE
600mg EQ
350 TrenAce
6 to 8iu HGH ed
Humalog postwo

Now for a 270lbs on offseason how much do you think he can run? 200mg? Come on......

That's pretty much double my highest dose but still lower than I would have thought. Did you use that cycle?

 

[jaxino]

That's pretty much double my highest dose but still lower than I would have thought. Did you use that cycle?

Yes this year and tbh a tad higher in doses but i should be eating more.... And needed to run it for more time...

Growing is more about food than drugs, but even drugs have to be there....

 

[rotinaj]

Professional Bodybuilding IS pharmaceutical warfare?

When top notch genes go one against each other what do you think that counts?

You are so naive boi.

I used to coach guys who coach ifbb pros for a living so let’s not talk about who’s “naive boi” lol.
I’m starting a conversation for people to consider factors beyond how many ~mg a guy takes to be at the “top” but everyone wants to fixate on AAS and pushing them higher and higher.
There are methods to grow beyond that. They guys who choose to ignore it with fall victim to the health consequences of abusing AAS and that’s just a fact.
You can choose to engage in a constructive conversation beyond the scope of AAS dosage or stay in a bubble

 

[A50#]

I might believe that his sister is on 1gram or less per week, but not Chris.

 

[SouthernMuscle]

Professional Bodybuilding IS pharmaceutical warfare?

When top notch genes go one against each other what do you think that counts?

You are so naive boi.

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...-be-a-top-pro-bodybuilder.121100/post-2032780

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...new-members-thread-post-here.259/post-3091699

 

[rotinaj]

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...-be-a-top-pro-bodybuilder.121100/post-2032780

https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...new-members-thread-post-here.259/post-3091699

Threads where I said I had a decent AAS response but average structural genetics?

Damn 8 years ago. Im getting old ugh

 

[junker]

dude was more muscular as a teen than most of u are now....and u scoff at 200-500 a week doses? he's literally a one in 100,000,000 men....literally. more like one in a billion....
none of yall will never win a show even. or compete in the first godam place.

 

[rotinaj]

dude was more muscular as a teen than most of u are now....and u scoff at 200-500 a week doses? he's literally a one in 100,000,000 men....literally. more like one in a billion....
none of yall will never win a show even. or compete in the first godam place.

Most* of ya’ll

 

[Dens228]

dude was more muscular as a teen than most of u are now....and u scoff at 200-500 a week doses? he's literally a one in 100,000,000 men....literally. more like one in a billion....
none of yall will never win a show even. or compete in the first godam place.

There have been a lot of members here that have come and gone that were bigger, faster, smarter, leaner, better at pulling pussy, than anyone here. But I'm sure you're the real deal. LOL

 

[buck]

He may or may not use more. But a lot can be done with hard training and a great diet. I packed on a lot of muscle before ever using any AS and was called out for years about my use with never having used any. And from personal experience i can say it is quite possible to put on a shit load of muscle with a gram. Even after maxing out naturally.

 

[Type-IIx]

Because people rather increase their dosages and project their insecurities from the results they don’t have while calling other people liars, instead of talking about the other factors beyond doses that could cause some to be more muscular.

Do they have more muscle cells? What hypertrophic gains have they trained for? What training frequency? Ice baths? Stem cel therapy? Fascial tissue variations, physical therapy, sleep quality with more/less rem, better periworkout nutrition…

People have turned bodybuilding into pharmaceutical warfare.

But watch the thread keep taking about “honesty” instead of “possibilities.”

I know that you didn't send this my way as a direct reply, just for a frame of reference here, I'm going to draw this statement of yours out as an example.

Do you believe that someone can fairly point out the readily apparent absurdity of a claim by Mr. O that he takes 200 mg testosterone weekly, without transposing any personal insecurities or bullshit personal judgments onto the statement?

Note that there are different sorts of lies: but deceit by omission is still a lie.

I believe that all of your suggested factors (from "fascial tissue variations" to "ice baths") are, at best, far down the list from drug and training response (related to innate factors like CAG repeat length in the AR gene; d3-GHR polymorphisms; absolute and relative quantity of available type II fibers; p-ratio [related to insulin & leptin sensitivity, etc.]; satellite cell regenerative capacity [related to NO, IL-6, and Notch signaling], etc.) among the features that distinguish top pro bodybuilders from the genetically average.

Does holding this belief mean that I am a skinny-fat, no work ethic or discipline, armchair critic that just wishes I could grow as well as Mr. O on TRT when I am blasting grams of gear and spending $10K monthly on pharmaceuticals?

What if I actually value drug response, simply, as talent (I do)?

And yet - competitive pro bodybuilding still is, in my view, primarily an arms race between drugs and their methods of use - and the nature of the game calls for trade secrets (i.e., misinformation & disinformation) - it's a war (of information & applied science). At the root of why this is: the fact that drug response trumps all else (beyond the first 1.5 years of well-planned and implemented resistance training, +/-). Note: I am not saying muscle attachments to bone, adherence to diet and training plans, etc. are not factors involved in success.

Does holding this belief mean that I am a proponent of luki's protocol for a 75 kg aspiring bodybuilder with a 90 kg bench press and < 1 year of training experience?

Drugs are profoundly effective; similarly effective to resistance training stimuli to a novice trainee, but synergistic and greater than additive to resistance training.

200 mg testosterone weekly, though, wouldn't suffice to maintain Mr. O's (supra-physiologic) muscle for any reasonable period; he's still a human being, despite excellent drug+training response.

I'd just really like to understand where people's inferring personal insecurities and judgments onto otherwise reasonable statements comes from. Your post just happens to be a classic example of this.

My question (it's a broad one, I know) is: from where do these assumptions arise? Is it just lack of reading comprehension? Or is it because such readers are themselves prone to transposing judgments and personal insecurities onto everything they hear or read (projection)?

 

[Biggerp73]

So just lie to protect others from their stupidity because the masses aren’t intelligent enough to hear the truth, do research, and come to their own conclusions about health and the risks involved with AAS use/abuse? This isn’t an attack on the person I'm replying to per se. This is me venting at all the lying cunts out there who self righteously think others are less intelligent than themselves, and too weak to make intelligent decisions. This is the crap I dealt with here many years ago when I told the truth on my dosing regimen: A. Because I was asked about it. B. I see lying as weak and pathetic. C. Lying to protect others is arrogant and self righteous.
If you can’t handle the truth, don’t ask the question!!!
Many who gave me shit for posting my true doses when asked were the same guys messaging my friends for gear advice and admitting they lie about they doses here because they fear being flamed. Pathetic!!!
This was 10 or 11 years ago. I hate liars! They’re cowards!

I don't think people should lie about it. But there's clearly a difference about talking about high doses while exercising due caution, respect, etc, and doing so wrecklessly in such manner that listeners are encouraged to think it's safe, cool, fun, etc.

Bumstead has millions of teenagers looking up to him. He is aware that if he was to talk about doing high doses that his audience would follow suit.

 

[johnjuanb1]

I don't think people should lie about it. But there's clearly a difference about talking about high doses while exercising due caution, respect, etc, and doing so wrecklessly in such manner that listeners are encouraged to think it's safe, cool, fun, etc.

Bumstead has millions of teenagers looking up to him. He is aware that if he was to talk about doing high doses that his audience would follow suit.

That’s true. Plus, didn’t his sister get busted for roids? It would be in his best interest to say he’s on 200mg which is low enough for legal prescriptions. You can legally get prescribed 200mg test, 200mg deca, and plenty of Anadrol and anavar, HGH, and other ancillaries. I was just venting about my experience here in years past. But this a forum for advanced bodybuilding and PED use. If we lie to each other here then what’s the point of being here at all.

 

[SOUR DIESEL]

I don't think people should lie about it. But there's clearly a difference about talking about high doses while exercising due caution, respect, etc, and doing so wrecklessly in such manner that listeners are encouraged to think it's safe, cool, fun, etc.

^^^holy smokes ..you really don't get it, do you??

..it doesn't matter what somebody says ..or fails to say

►one man's "caution" is another man's "reckless" ..

what's "reasonable" to one individual ..is "NOT-reasonable" to another individual
^^^so who makes the decision of where that line-of-reason is?
^^^you do ..of course
..is it really a surprise that when you don't take personal responsibility for your life, that somebody else ends up running it?

"Responsibility is the price of freedom" -Elbert Hubbard

^^^i'll add; personal responsibility is really what defines maturity
..it's a key-component of character


YOU are ACCOUNTABLE for YOUR ACTIONS & DECISIONS


^^^it's baffling how you can think that somebody else is responsible for something that YOU decided to do??


i mean not so long ago, you encountered heart problems running high doses of GH
..were you not responsible for that??

^^^own your mistakes ..& grow
(..it's not like we all don't have them)


.

 

[Biggerp73]

^^^holy smokes ..you really don't get it, do you??

..it doesn't matter what somebody says ..or fails to say

►one man's "caution" is another man's "reckless" ..

what's "reasonable" to one individual ..is "NOT-reasonable" to another individual
^^^so who makes the decision of where that line-of-reason is?
^^^you do ..of course
..is it really a surprise that when you don't take personal responsibility for your life, that somebody else ends up running it?

"Responsibility is the price of freedom" -Elbert Hubbard

^^^i'll add; personal responsibility is really what defines maturity
..it's a key-component of character


YOU are ACCOUNTABLE for YOUR ACTIONS & DECISIONS


^^^it's baffling how you can think that somebody else is responsible for something that YOU decided to do??


i mean not so long ago, you encountered heart problems running high doses of GH
..were you not responsible for that??

^^^own your mistakes ..& grow
(..it's not like we all don't have them)


.

Bro... I've never not accepted responsibility for my actions or implied anyone else wasn't responsible for theirs...

 

[11sh11]

The bb industry is very much about public approval, popularity, being current and trending, and 'liked' in all arenas of social media. With recent deaths, the organizations governing bodies putting out statements, the flood of stories and interviews like this... any one of these pros who know how to work the industry will be telling just enough to satisfy the media, make them look themselves look like the good guy, the honest one, and will be a standout in the lineup for favorable judgement.
All these guys in the public eye, who are also in the money... it doesn't matter what they actually do, but how they come across, and doing what it takes to stay out front.