Opinions on Overtraining?

[JaredLinez]

What are your guys thoughts?

Lately I’ve been very into high volume training, as well as high intensity. I’m doing 20+ sets for body parts over the coarse of a week, and am also implementing drop sets and intensifier techniques. I also train 6x a week (push pull legs)

I feel like most people would say I’m “overtraining”, but I personally feel great training this way. I focus a lot on recovery (cozy, relaxing IT job), and am eating loads.

What are your guys personal experiences on pushing volume and intensity simultaneously?

 

[M@NU]

it will sooner or later get you.
For me it is always something like:
too high of a stressor (volume or/and intensity) --> works for a short time (2-3 weeks) --> sleep gets worse and worse --> recovery goes downhill --> if i still push it, resting heart rate and average sleep heart rate dramatically increaes (atleast 10 bpm, more often 10-15) and i get heart palp. --> immune system gets worse --> sickness --> "forced deload".

my biggest issue is to manage volume properly because I (and i think many have this "issue) tend to do more sets than really necessary/useful (junk volume)
also, taking regular rest days for me is a chore xD i hate them.

right now i think ive found the maximum recoverable amount of training at high intensity:
maximum 20 total working sets per workout; maximum 9 working sets per muscle group; quads and back not 3 times per week to failure (frequency); rest day after 3 workout days; maximum of 5 sets that go beyond failure per workout

 

[Joltan]

You are most definitely not overtraining on 2x per week.

If you are over 20+ sets total per week, I would recommend splitting it up into 3x per week instead. Not adding volume.. just spreading it out.

Max protein synthesis starts to drop off (and even regress) after about 6-8 sets per session (per bodypart). Typically anything over this is considered 'junk volume' as mentioned above.

 

[Gunsmith]

I believe that there is WAY more to "over training" than the training.
I think many people are not over training but are under recovering. Not getting enough sleep , not getting enough NUTRIENTS not just calories , keeping their Central Nervous System hammered constantly with stimulants
Most serious guys are probably training with enough intensity that they could be "over training" even when good nutrition , sleep and endocrine function are optimal. The average gym bro probably not over training because there idea of "training to failure" is stopping when it gets uncomfortable which is way short of physical failure but then eat bullshit , take in a million grams of caffeine and get four hours sleep cause they are up playing video games all night.

 

[Mountolympus]

I train 4 times at week with a lot of volume and my body respond very well. In my opinion the crucial factors are :
- many calories
- good sleep and if possible a nap after the wo
Too many people are concern about overtraining, but it's important evaluate the life out the gym ( work , family , children ecc) this is the factors that can reduce the recovery between workouts

 

[Bio]

Here's the thing, will you listen to your body when it truly needs a day off? Will you be willing to take a few days off if needed? Will you be willing to move to an every other day schedule for a while and then return to the other style of training? Most lifters are pig headed and say, "I can't miss a day", and in my experience, this is where things can start to go wrong with progression and injury. Be intuitive and listen to your body!

Like Gunsmith said, and it's as true as true gets, focus on food, rest and other aspects of life outside the gym. What you do in the gym is only half the equation.

 

[qbkilla]

I'm around 10 sets to failure per part with rest pause ..I count a rest pause in the 20-30 range 3 sets. So low volume. Will do 13 sets for TRI and delt to bring them up.

One time I kept at about 8 sets for everything and jacked up delts to 18 to try and stimulate some growth. That's the first time I really ever felt over training like I wasn't recovering and felt like I began to hate training them and was just going through the motions.

So if I did 20 for all parts to failure I'd say I'd overtrain and just feel like I'm doing junk volume and not be able to focus on each set. With low volume I can really give each set max effort. Don't see how mentally I can give max effort if I'm doing 20 sets a week per part

 

[Flex500]

What are your guys thoughts?

Lately I’ve been very into high volume training, as well as high intensity. I’m doing 20+ sets for body parts over the coarse of a week, and am also implementing drop sets and intensifier techniques. I also train 6x a week (push pull legs)

I feel like most people would say I’m “overtraining”, but I personally feel great training this way. I focus a lot on recovery (cozy, relaxing IT job), and am eating loads.

What are your guys personal experiences on pushing volume and intensity simultaneously?

My opinion has changed over the years. As far as handling a big workload, your body is capable of so much. I've been doing a ton of GPP...I've been walking a mile with 100-250lbs of additional weight, training daily at times, etc. and my work capacity continues to go up and up and up.

There are lots of guys out there on youtube and IG that do similar (I don't just mean Liver King) and do a lot of training and create an extraordinary work capacity.

So from a work capacity standpoint you can handle an obscene amount and adjust and adapt. However, from a muscle building standpoint I don't think training in your fashion would be optimal for me. I've tried it and it just doesn't fit and never really grew well that way. I can train a muscle daily but only if it's 1 set...or I can do high volume, but much less frequency.

 

[Flex500]

I'm around 10 sets to failure per part with rest pause ..I count a rest pause in the 20-30 range 3 sets. So low volume. Will do 13 sets for TRI and delt to bring them up.

One time I kept at about 8 sets for everything and jacked up delts to 18 to try and stimulate some growth. That's the first time I really ever felt over training like I wasn't recovering and felt like I began to hate training them and was just going through the motions.

So if I did 20 for all parts to failure I'd say I'd overtrain and just feel like I'm doing junk volume and not be able to focus on each set. With low volume I can really give each set max effort. Don't see how mentally I can give max effort if I'm doing 20 sets a week per part

this is basically where I'm at all well.

 

[JaredLinez]

it will sooner or later get you.
For me it is always something like:
too high of a stressor (volume or/and intensity) --> works for a short time (2-3 weeks) --> sleep gets worse and worse --> recovery goes downhill --> if i still push it, resting heart rate and average sleep heart rate dramatically increaes (atleast 10 bpm, more often 10-15) and i get heart palp. --> immune system gets worse --> sickness --> "forced deload".

my biggest issue is to manage volume properly because I (and i think many have this "issue) tend to do more sets than really necessary/useful (junk volume)
also, taking regular rest days for me is a chore xD i hate them.

right now i think ive found the maximum recoverable amount of training at high intensity:
maximum 20 total working sets per workout; maximum 9 working sets per muscle group; quads and back not 3 times per week to failure (frequency); rest day after 3 workout days; maximum of 5 sets that go beyond failure per workout

I’ve been training this way for 6 months plus now, feeling fine. I guess I’ll just keep listening to my body in the meantime and monitor my heart rate. Sleep has been okay as well. Like I said, I got it lucky in terms of recovery for sure with my job situation.

 

[juggy38]

I thought a push pull leg split 5x a week was borderline overtraining,

Then I started training for an Ironman.


80 sets a week and guys think they are overtraining.

Now..training beyond what is necessary fke
Hypertrophy? Maybe. But training to the point of digging yourself in a hole from dumbbells and squats? Highly unlikely. Just add food or more sleep.

And there’s a limit to how hard you can hit the “build muscle switch” but that doesn’t mean your not capable of running 3-4 800s the next day and swimming 1000 meters the next day, if you rest and eat.

 

[juggy38]

Bodybuilding is not an extremely taxing sport. Even a 22 set leg day….has no fight against how fucked you feel after a 1 mike am swim and a 68 mile bike ride.

Dante used to say, there was a line you had to cross in a workout to throw the anabolic trigger. Once’s your flipped it on, anything else was depleting resources.

I think in BB overtraining…we use that as going beyond this trigger when we don’t have too.

Other sports use overtraining in the context of thyroid crashing, physiological problems, depression, extreme fatigue….it depends on the definition

 

[trackstar19]

I workout 7 days a week and haven’t taken a day off in many months. I’m also prepping. So calories/carbs are getting scarce these days. Some days I think I should tone down the volume/intensity but I believe I’m still seeing results so I keep it all maxed out. Figure I’ll rest/deload after my show.

Currently doing 2 hours fasted cardio and a separate 80 minute gym session daily. Crazy volume with no real breaks between sets/reps/exercises. It’s seemed to help keep my muscles full and strength relatively untouched despite my calories being down to 1800 last few weeks

 

[Flex500]

I thought a push pull leg split 5x a week was borderline overtraining,

Then I started training for an Ironman.


80 sets a week and guys think they are overtraining.

Now..training beyond what is necessary fke
Hypertrophy? Maybe. But training to the point of digging yourself in a hole from dumbbells and squats? Highly unlikely. Just add food or more sleep.

And there’s a limit to how hard you can hit the “build muscle switch” but that doesn’t mean your not capable of running 3-4 800s the next day and swimming 1000 meters the next day, if you rest and eat.

I think this puts it perfectly. The body can handle so damn much from a work capacity standpoint so long as you eat and rest and gradually build capacity you will be good to go. Even with poor rest and nutrition the body can take a lot.

Now there is the topic of pure hypertophy that may be a bit different (what you can handle vs optimal). Anyone I coach I like to build work capacity through GPP work but “only” weight train 3-4 times a week, usually 10-15 “work sets” per body part, per week.

The increased work capacity also lets you pour a lot into the work sets.

 

[johnjuanb1]

I follow my instincts with training. I go until I know I hit maximum pump. I may do 12 sets per muscle. I may do 30 sets. My body tells me when it’s done.
I had a friend who constantly looked for the magic number on sets by copying the pros he liked. I never could understand why he didn’t put more trust in himself. Sorry, but stoping after 6 hard sets just doesn’t cut it for me. Training for me is mental and fun. It helps bring my life and mental instability into a place of balance with some semblance of peace. I train until the fun stops. It’s like Arnold said, “Training has to be fun!”

 

[jaxino]

I always trained without any deload weeks and it was mainly why my gains weren't as good as I was thinking about, i was in an overreaching overtraining state constantly. Despite being on steroids overtraining will hit you .....

I think that, if you train high volume or low volume, every 4-6weeks deload or just stay at home do cardio and rest.

To me is like asking to donate a kidney and an eye, but i started using those weeks to do things that usually i don't do.
Like i clean all the windows of my house inside and outside, get water and meat in stock, take a long weekend with the girl i am dating, deep clean my car (which usually looks like a mess), stay some times with my nephews and so on....so on...

 

[A50#]

You are most definitely not overtraining on 2x per week.

If you are over 20+ sets total per week, I would recommend splitting it up into 3x per week instead. Not adding volume.. just spreading it out.

Max protein synthesis starts to drop off (and even regress) after about 6-8 sets per session (per bodypart). Typically anything over this is considered 'junk volume' as mentioned above.

I don't think you can accurately assess that not knowing each individuals lifestyle and genetics.I think it could vary per individual drastically. I know when I was working 12+ hr days 6-7 days wk then coming home and taking care of my family and household responsibilities sleeping only 5 hours per night I couldn't recover from volume training or training each body part more than once per week. In a perfect world if a guy was lucky enough just train ,eat and sleep things may be different but in a real world scenario there are numerous factors to take into effect.

 

[Gunsmith]

I workout 7 days a week and haven’t taken a day off in many months. I’m also prepping. So calories/carbs are getting scarce these days. Some days I think I should tone down the volume/intensity but I believe I’m still seeing results so I keep it all maxed out. Figure I’ll rest/deload after my show.

Currently doing 2 hours fasted cardio and a separate 80 minute gym session daily. Crazy volume with no real breaks between sets/reps/exercises. It’s seemed to help keep my muscles full and strength relatively untouched despite my calories being down to 1800 last few weeks

Gawd damn man , not sure about your stats or situation but that sounds like and completely fuckin miserable existence.!!!
You would probably benefit GREATLY from taking a day off a week at least on your refeed day.

 

[trackstar19]

Gawd damn man , not sure about your stats or situation but that sounds like and completely fuckin miserable existence.!!!
You would probably benefit GREATLY from taking a day off a week at least on your refeed day.

Haha ya it has made the gym a bit less fun lately but I’m actually still mostly loving it. My show is next weekend so I am almost done seeing this thing through. I have a rare autoimmune disease that attacks my kidneys and I was told I couldn’t work out again a few years ago - so I kind of love that I proved that wrong and am healthy as shit despite 70% scarred kidneys. I just have to do things wildly differently to keep my kidneys happy and autoimmune disease at bay - so tricky to balance putting together a winning physique and health. No PED’s anymore or fat burners, etc. I’ve eaten the same two meals in a small 2 hour pre/post workout window every day for ten months now. I’m a bit neurotic lol but I was supposed to be dead so this is just fun for me now. Easier to embrace the suck and go the extra mile when I wasn’t supposed to be able to

 

[buck]

What are your guys thoughts?

Lately I’ve been very into high volume training, as well as high intensity. I’m doing 20+ sets for body parts over the coarse of a week, and am also implementing drop sets and intensifier techniques. I also train 6x a week (push pull legs)

I feel like most people would say I’m “overtraining”, but I personally feel great training this way. I focus a lot on recovery (cozy, relaxing IT job), and am eating loads.

What are your guys personal experiences on pushing volume and intensity simultaneously?

I trained like that but with double the amount of sets, when i started at a real gym, for almost 2 years and made good gains 35+ pounds. But then had start incorporating more rest days and less sets as the poundage i was lifting was getting to much to recover from with that high of volume.