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2024 NPC USA

I just asked Spark why and here was the response…accurate?

The differences in physiques between bodybuilders from the 1980s and 1990s compared to those of today can be attributed to several factors:

1. **Training and Dieting Approaches**: The training methods and dietary strategies of the 80s and 90s often emphasized symmetry, proportion, and aesthetic appeal. Bodybuilders like Arnold Schwarzenegger, Lee Haney, and Flex Wheeler focused on achieving a V-taper with broad shoulders, a narrow waist, and full muscle bellies. Modern bodybuilding tends to prioritize sheer size and extreme conditioning, sometimes at the expense of symmetry and aesthetics.

2. **Drug Regimens**: The types and combinations of anabolic steroids, growth hormones, and other performance-enhancing drugs (PEDs) used have evolved. In the 80s and 90s, the use of PEDs was less advanced and perhaps less aggressive. Today's bodybuilders use more potent drugs, including insulin and growth hormone, which can lead to distended abdomens (often referred to as "tortoise shell stomach" or "GH gut") and different muscle shapes.

3. **Focus on Mass and Conditioning**: Modern bodybuilding competitions emphasize extreme muscle size and low body fat percentages. This focus on mass and dryness has led to physiques that are larger but often less aesthetically pleasing compared to the more balanced and proportionate physiques of the past.

4. **Genetics and Muscle Bellies**: The round muscle bellies seen in bodybuilders from the 80s and 90s can also be attributed to genetic factors. The champions of that era often had naturally fuller and more aesthetically pleasing muscle shapes. While modern bodybuilders are massive, the muscle shape is influenced by both genetics and the types of drugs used.

5. **Evolution of Judging Criteria**: The criteria used by bodybuilding judges have shifted over time. In the past, aesthetics, symmetry, and overall proportion were highly valued. In recent years, the emphasis has been more on size and extreme leanness, sometimes at the cost of aesthetics and balance.

6. **Nutrition and Supplementation**: Nutritional strategies and supplementation have also evolved. While today's bodybuilders have access to more advanced supplements, the diets of the past focused on achieving a balanced, healthy look that supported the development of fuller muscle bellies and tighter waists.

7. **Training Techniques**: The training techniques and philosophies have also changed. Bodybuilders in the past often trained with a focus on sculpting and shaping the muscles, while modern training can sometimes prioritize adding as much mass as possible, regardless of the aesthetic outcome.

In summary, the difference in physiques is a result of changes in training and dieting approaches, drug regimens, focus on mass and conditioning, genetic factors, judging criteria, and nutritional strategies. These changes have led to the modern look of bodybuilders, which often features larger but sometimes less aesthetically pleasing physiques compared to the balanced and proportionate bodies of the 80s and 90s.
 
Now you’re trying to compare the most recent USA winner to Jay Cutler… 🤣

Cmon man, there’s good and bad in all era’s. If you’re going to make comparisons though at least make them realistic and equal.
The comparison was Jay vs Jay smart guy.
 
That was Jay vs Jay smart guy.
In your thread comparing the current USA winner to past eras retard. 😂 I didn’t make this non sense, you did.

Let’s see your past pics vs his…
 
I was AT the finals on Saturday night. You're right, that overall winner didnt have a bubbly flowy physique. But he was fuckin shredded. In person it was another look compared to the rest of the SHWs. There were bigger, rounder ones. But it was clearly evident the judges were going to reward the most conditioned guys. So to make an argument that, "well thiiis is what guys now look like" is ludicrous and just false. Its all based on judge criteria as well as who the fuck shows up.

And be smart for 5 seconds. Why do you think the talent pool is smaller? Big Dave just laid out the exact explanation. Most YOUNG talent are choosing other options, even if they ARE interested in fitness. The elite freaks 20-30 years ago had BBing as their only option. Now they have several classes as well as Crossfit options to choose. Less development time, more instant gratification than the long game that is BBing. Its fairly easyyy to see this, so anyone acting like its drugs or like physiques have changes is again, false.
 
Kind of tortoise like but no roundness to the muscle belly whereas the old school look was fuller yet tighter.
You’re simply looking at what you want to. Reality is physiques come in all shapes, sizes, structures, conditions in every generation of this sport.
 
I was AT the finals on Saturday night. You're right, that overall winner didnt have a bubbly flowy physique. But he was fuckin shredded. In person it was another look compared to the rest of the SHWs. There were bigger, rounder ones. But it was clearly evident the judges were going to reward the most conditioned guys. So to make an argument that, "well thiiis is what guys now look like" is ludicrous and just false. Its all based on judge criteria as well as who the fuck shows up.

And be smart for 5 seconds. Why do you think the talent pool is smaller? Big Dave just laid out the exact explanation. Most YOUNG talent are choosing other options, even if they ARE interested in fitness. The elite freaks 20-30 years ago had BBing as their only option. Now they have several classes as well as Crossfit options to choose. Less development time, more instant gratification than the long game that is BBing. Its fairly easyyy to see this, so anyone acting like its drugs or like physiques have changes is again, false.
Maybe, When there are more pro cards given out at bodybuilding shows, it can potentially dilute the overall quality of competitors who attain professional status. Back in the day, it seemed like only 1-2 pro cards were handed out at a show, making it extremely competitive and ensuring that only the absolute best of the best achieved professional status. Now, with many more pro cards given out, the criteria for turning pro might be perceived as less stringent, potentially leading to a larger pool of professionals who may not all meet the same high standards that were once required. This can result in a more varied level of quality among pros, with some not quite matching the elite level that was once the hallmark of achieving professional status.
 
If this thread is passive aggressively trying to say “old school guys just looked better”… what is the point?

Are you aware that more pro cards are given out, thereby reducing the number of high level amateurs left to compete?

Are you aware that fitness culture itself has shifted, reducing the number of LHW/HW/SHW competitors?

Are you aware that classic physique has rerouted a lot of would-be bodybuilders?

If old school was “better”, and everyone universally understands this and agrees, why don’t we all just do what they did and get the same result?
Agree entirely. And old school wasn't "better" in terms of the process of becoming a pro, there were some obvious problems. If you compared 1991 Nationals with 1991 Olympia, Nationals blew Olympia outta the water because the number of pro cards given out was just too few.
 
Maybe, When there are more pro cards given out at bodybuilding shows, it can potentially dilute the overall quality of competitors who attain professional status. Back in the day, it seemed like only 1-2 pro cards were handed out at a show, making it extremely competitive and ensuring that only the absolute best of the best achieved professional status. Now, with many more pro cards given out, the criteria for turning pro might be perceived as less stringent, potentially leading to a larger pool of professionals who may not all meet the same high standards that were once required. This can result in a more varied level of quality among pros, with some not quite matching the elite level that was once the hallmark of achieving professional status.
That is partially true, but it is completely irrelevant because the top tier of pros RIGHT NOW are equal to the top tier of pros from 10, 20 or 30 years ago. The cream always rises. So just because a top 8 place in 1997 suddenly is a pro card winner in 2024, does not mean they will be relevant in the pro ranks. They still fall by the wayside. This we know for a fact. There are no shitty looking top 10 Olympians, simple as that.
So again, completely irrelevant to what we are discussing.
 
That is partially true, but it is completely irrelevant because the top tier of pros RIGHT NOW are equal to the top tier of pros from 10, 20 or 30 years ago. The cream always rises. So just because a top 8 place in 1997 suddenly is a pro card winner in 2024, does not mean they will be relevant in the pro ranks. They still fall by the wayside. This we know for a fact. There are no shitty looking top 10 Olympians, simple as that.
So again, completely irrelevant to what we are discussing.
not to mention that a huge portion of pros never compete in a pro show, or only do one show and then quit.

There are so many more pro shows nowadays and bodybuilding is bigger now than it ever has been, they gotta fill those shows somehow.

end result is the top 001% are still the top 001%
 
The whole “pro card” thing for many is just the NPC making money and brainwashing bodybuilders

Sure a personal trainer with their “pro card” is like having highly qualified certifications and one of many examples of why somebody might want a pro card

But there are way many many more people brainwashed they they just “gotta get that pro card” when it will return nothing to them and rather just suck the money and life out of them as they chase it for years

Btw on the comparison pic that was posted I would say Newman looked much much better ….. but you’d really need to see several direct comparison pics to truly legitimately assess the 2 physiques
 
I just asked Spark why and here was the response…accurate?

The differences in physiques between bodybuilders from the 1980s and 1990s compared to those of today can be attributed to several factors:

1. **Training and Dieting Approaches**: The training methods and dietary strategies of the 80s and 90s often emphasized symmetry, proportion, and aesthetic appeal. Bodybuilders like Arnold Schwarzenegger, Lee Haney, and Flex Wheeler focused on achieving a V-taper with broad shoulders, a narrow waist, and full muscle bellies. Modern bodybuilding tends to prioritize sheer size and extreme conditioning, sometimes at the expense of symmetry and aesthetics.

2. **Drug Regimens**: The types and combinations of anabolic steroids, growth hormones, and other performance-enhancing drugs (PEDs) used have evolved. In the 80s and 90s, the use of PEDs was less advanced and perhaps less aggressive. Today's bodybuilders use more potent drugs, including insulin and growth hormone, which can lead to distended abdomens (often referred to as "tortoise shell stomach" or "GH gut") and different muscle shapes.

3. **Focus on Mass and Conditioning**: Modern bodybuilding competitions emphasize extreme muscle size and low body fat percentages. This focus on mass and dryness has led to physiques that are larger but often less aesthetically pleasing compared to the more balanced and proportionate physiques of the past.

4. **Genetics and Muscle Bellies**: The round muscle bellies seen in bodybuilders from the 80s and 90s can also be attributed to genetic factors. The champions of that era often had naturally fuller and more aesthetically pleasing muscle shapes. While modern bodybuilders are massive, the muscle shape is influenced by both genetics and the types of drugs used.

5. **Evolution of Judging Criteria**: The criteria used by bodybuilding judges have shifted over time. In the past, aesthetics, symmetry, and overall proportion were highly valued. In recent years, the emphasis has been more on size and extreme leanness, sometimes at the cost of aesthetics and balance.

6. **Nutrition and Supplementation**: Nutritional strategies and supplementation have also evolved. While today's bodybuilders have access to more advanced supplements, the diets of the past focused on achieving a balanced, healthy look that supported the development of fuller muscle bellies and tighter waists.

7. **Training Techniques**: The training techniques and philosophies have also changed. Bodybuilders in the past often trained with a focus on sculpting and shaping the muscles, while modern training can sometimes prioritize adding as much mass as possible, regardless of the aesthetic outcome.

In summary, the difference in physiques is a result of changes in training and dieting approaches, drug regimens, focus on mass and conditioning, genetic factors, judging criteria, and nutritional strategies. These changes have led to the modern look of bodybuilders, which often features larger but sometimes less aesthetically pleasing physiques compared to the balanced and proportionate bodies of the 80s and 90s.
^^^^
Above would be great topic for discussion broken down in the categories. Since my journey and a lot of others here started in the 1990s it would be great refresher to see all the changes observed today that we sometimes complain about. Changes in supplementation training ergogenics diets etc etc. We can never go back but some of us never leave our old ways. I hate machines and cables for the most part but use them only on my play days vs all freeweights on my pay days in which I destroy my body and perform active recovery on my play days.
 
That is partially true, but it is completely irrelevant because the top tier of pros RIGHT NOW are equal to the top tier of pros from 10, 20 or 30 years ago. The cream always rises. So just because a top 8 place in 1997 suddenly is a pro card winner in 2024, does not mean they will be relevant in the pro ranks. They still fall by the wayside. This we know for a fact. There are no shitty looking top 10 Olympians, simple as that.
So again, completely irrelevant to what we are discussing.
First off, thanks for keeping it respectful (and maintaining your dignity)…beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Here is a 25 year comparison. Forward progress? Equal? Worse?
 

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First off, thanks for keeping it respectful (and maintaining your dignity)…beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Here is a 25 year comparison. Forward progress? Equal? Worse?
At least in my eyes, equal. I think Hadi, Derek and Nick would be top 10 olympians no matter what BBing decade they were in.
 
First off, thanks for keeping it respectful (and maintaining your dignity)…beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Here is a 25 year comparison. Forward progress? Equal? Worse?
Are you now trying to compare Ronnie Coleman??? He is the best ever. You are being ridiculous now.
 
Now is the competition level like it was back then? for the most part no.

In all fairness to this guy, in that picture hes not even fully in the pose. I do have to say,NONE of the pictures from the show reflect what these guys look like. Idk why but as of past few years, pictures just dont translate to stage. Youd think in 2024, we would have the best pictures possible. but no...even at most pro shows.

I was there in person and the SHW was definitely pretty damn hard, and BIG.
 

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