2g Test E, 1g EQ

[jrs]

subject is

5'9, 240 @ ~10-12% bodyfat

diet is 4-7 meals almost entirely of lean red meat, salmon, other fish in that order including an assortment of vegetables. oatmeal and rice are the preferred carbs and they are usually only included in pre and post-workout meals as subject feels too many carbs bloats him bad and makes him feel sick. will attempt to increase protein portions by 50%.

major food allergies by the way so any whey, dairy, lots of green veggies, grains, etc are out. oatmeal i'm told is hit or miss for him.

trained naturally for 7-8 years then the past 4-5 have been mostly test only with either a sprinkle of dbol (under 20mg a day) or a moderate amount of tren

plan is 6 injections per week (2 on each workout day), each consisting of 666mg test E and 333mg EQ

subject's goals after this winter is to be 255+ @ 10%. not a bodybuilder but earns his money based largely on looks and performance so looking good is important. gym goals include: 585 olympic squat for reps, deadlift 675 for 3 reps, 495 x 3 bench and will need the extra mass to reach these numbers at this point

training is 3 days per week, alternating upper and lower body workouts. heavy lifts stay in the 3-8 rep range and everything else varies. lots of rotation of movements and constant progression, with planned periods of down-time.

**Only reason I'm asking for him and posting these dosages is because he is not used to Enanthate or EQ and has only ever used prop. He doesn't know what to expect for sides with the different esters and would also like opinions on how often to donate blood, or if it is usually not necessary.

That is the purpose of the question. Not critiquing the dosages, just looking for experience on the matter.

I was also wondering if maybe it would be better for him to cut these dosages in half - 3/4 and add slin and gh with the same goals in mind..?

 

[jrs]

Also, he despises and never uses Anti-Es or SERMs for some reason. Will he want to change his mind and have something in particular on hand before it's too late?

 

[jm425]

This "subject" of yours should be using AIs and/or SERMs if he plans on using such high doses of test. Gyno and bloat are pretty common sides the higher you bump the dosage of test due to excessive test being converted into estrogen. This is strictly my opinion, but I wouldn't suggest him moving to gh and slin right away. Slin is dangerous especially in the hands of guys who are ignorant and those who are not disciplined enough to use it. Have him perhaps start off on gh. Also, I feel as though the doses are a little high, but I don't know exactly his cycling backround, so I can't say for sure. Hold off on the slin, maybe throw in some gh and maybe consider cutting the doses down a bit is my advice.

 

[xxsuprman22xx]

Without an AI, I think your subject is going to have some massive headaches from the water retention.

 

[jrs]

Is there a specific AI that would work also for other sides that could arise from these two compounds? He would rather get one good substance than to use several.

 

[jm425]

Is there a specific AI that would work also for other sides that could arise from these two compounds? He would rather get one good substance than to use several.

He could just go with aromasin or adex and he would be fine. EQ's bad sides I can think of at high doses, is headaches, high bp and high rbc which an AI or SERM will do nothing for, because those sides are not estrogen or bloat related.

 

[eroc613]

If your not sure, use the search feature. There's alot more expirenced people that have posted on these things in the past. Never expirenced some of the above posts "sides". But the there are theories to everything. And some people weren't meant to use certain ass, bodies just can't handle it.

 

[hellraiser27]

hmm

Its not sides I would worry about. The dosages are just very high and probably beyond being useful.

 

[jm425]

Its not sides I would worry about. The dosages are just very high and probably beyond being useful.

You wouldn't worry about the possibility of high bp, high hemocrit levels and a fucked up lipid profile? Those are some serious sides and over time can lead to major problems later on. If he were to high dose, the best thing he could do is to get blood work checked often while on cycle.

 

[Mr.Huge]

hmm...

Well if he's only used prop before then why the high doses of Test E & EQ? Sound like something a uninformed retard would do sorry to say.


Mr.Huge

 

[buselmo]

the sides will depend on how much total MG he's used to in the past. a big jump in doses (say from 1 gram to 3 grams) will give him flu like symptoms, achy joints, loss of appetite, headaches (high bp), increased heart rate, lethargy... etc. if he's used to doses like that, i don't think he'll face any problems.
if he doesn't want to use an AI or SERM, there's no need to. but he should just keep it on hand in case.
going from 240 lbs at 10% fat to 255+@10% fat is quite impossible in 3-4 months... going from 240 at 10% to 270 at 16% fat, on the other hand, is possible.
unless ofcourse he's been clean for a while now and he's 240 at 10%... then yeah.
if he never used gh+slin... he shouldn't start now... after this cycle, let him take a break then go on lower doses, and start with slin... then his next cycle, he adds GH... he has to know how he reacts to each differently.

 

[Bump]

Any particular reason why he wants to use Test E over Prop? Having used both a like Prop better for a number of reason. Test E made me hold a lot of water and took 6-7 weeks to get noticeable gains. Prop on the other hand had me holding far less water and it was very quick to produce solid gains for me. I don't think i'll ever go back to Test E now. I think your friend might be disappointed if he switches to Test E after using Prop in the past.

 

[1bigun11]

If he's dead set against AI or Serm, have him do 50 mg day Proviron. I think he will like it.

 

[FeverishFlux]

This thread needs to be put in the beginners forum, because it's that terribad.

Anyone considering taking 3g of gear a wk should know without question what they are doing. You should be prepared for sides that are definitely gonna come, and know how to deal with them.

666/333, do you really believe you can dose like that?

Why not just come out and say, "Hi I'm to new to gear and I'm going to start taking 3g of test/eq a week, what's going to happen to me? And by the way I hate/refuse to take ancillaries!"

Why would someone who is 5'9" 240 with a 10% bodyfat want to take 3g of gear if they got to that point on prop? :star-w;rs

 

[marshallmadman]

Anything over 800mg/per week of EQ can lead to major anxiety attacks. Happened to me @ 800mg.

 

[mikeyt869]

This thread needs to be put in the beginners forum, because it's that terribad.

Anyone considering taking 3g of gear a wk should know without question what they are doing. You should be prepared for sides that are definitely gonna come, and know how to deal with them.

666/333, do you really believe you can dose like that?

Why not just come out and say, "Hi I'm to new to gear and I'm going to start taking 3g of test/eq a week, what's going to happen to me? And by the way I hate/refuse to take ancillaries!"

Why would someone who is 5'9" 240 with a 10% bodyfat want to take 3g of gear if they got to that point on prop? :star-w;rs

lmao... i wasnt going to say anything but this is how i interpreted the post too.

 

[jrs]

jesus christ people

this isn't my decision. i really am relaying info for a close friend. i train with this guy and have known him a long time. i don't agree with what he wants to do but he got this stuff for free and to his credit, he has ran up to 2500mg for short bursts and has weighed as much as 260 in the past, just fatter than he would like to be. i think it's stupid because i'm pushing him and i wouldnt use 1/3 of that but it's his choice and i believe he has the right to know what to expect, from anybody who has actually had the experience to know the difference.

i personally would only use test only. i don't really believe in a lot of other stuff very much in terms of sids vs gains. i am also one who likes prop for the reasons mentioned plus being cheaper, more measurable testosterone vs ester weight, quicker response, etc etc etc

thus, i didn't keep up with the new wave of these crazy serms and ais. when i started, there was clomid, nolva, and hcg was sparce. you people who complain about a 4 day wait period should have been around when your package took a MONTH to get to you and if it took three months, you didn't fucking complain. "new to steroids.." lol fuck you

as for using the search function, that's all i do. look at my join date and then my number of posts. i'm on here every day, using the search function so much that i bet i know every time that its down. all i do on here is research and read archived posts. i have a hunger for learning, and the search let me down this time.the problems that i identified in my quest for this knowledge are

1) all the threads results didn't discuss what i want to know, only about gains
2) every other thread contradicted the other
3) nobody talked about these dosages and many stated that sides/affects do change with dosage

 

[jm425]

jesus christ people

this isn't my decision. i really am relaying info for a close friend. i train with this guy and have known him a long time. i don't agree with what he wants to do but he got this stuff for free and to his credit, he has ran up to 2500mg for short bursts and has weighed as much as 260 in the past, just fatter than he would like to be. i think it's stupid because i'm pushing him and i wouldnt use 1/3 of that but it's his choice and i believe he has the right to know what to expect, from anybody who has actually had the experience to know the difference.

i personally would only use test only. i don't really believe in a lot of other stuff very much in terms of sids vs gains. i am also one who likes prop for the reasons mentioned plus being cheaper, more measurable testosterone vs ester weight, quicker response, etc etc etc

thus, i didn't keep up with the new wave of these crazy serms and ais. when i started, there was clomid, nolva, and hcg was sparce. you people who complain about a 4 day wait period should have been around when your package took a MONTH to get to you and if it took three months, you didn't fucking complain. "new to steroids.." lol fuck you

as for using the search function, that's all i do. look at my join date and then my number of posts. i'm on here every day, using the search function so much that i bet i know every time that its down. all i do on here is research and read archived posts. i have a hunger for learning, and the search let me down this time.the problems that i identified in my quest for this knowledge are

1) all the threads results didn't discuss what i want to know, only about gains
2) every other thread contradicted the other
3) nobody talked about these dosages and many stated that sides/affects do change with dosage

Bro, I gave you a list of sides for the dosages you posted. Now these are very real sides to think about and that I've seen first hand happen to buddies of mine. Have your friend get blood work done often while on cycle and after cycle and have him run an AI like aromasin or adex in case he gets those nasty estrogen related sides from using such a high dose of test.

 

[eroc613]

jesus christ people

this isn't my decision. i really am relaying info for a close friend. i train with this guy and have known him a long time. i don't agree with what he wants to do but he got this stuff for free and to his credit, he has ran up to 2500mg for short bursts and has weighed as much as 260 in the past, just fatter than he would like to be. i think it's stupid because i'm pushing him and i wouldnt use 1/3 of that but it's his choice and i believe he has the right to know what to expect, from anybody who has actually had the experience to know the difference.

i personally would only use test only. i don't really believe in a lot of other stuff very much in terms of sids vs gains. i am also one who likes prop for the reasons mentioned plus being cheaper, more measurable testosterone vs ester weight, quicker response, etc etc etc

thus, i didn't keep up with the new wave of these crazy serms and ais. when i started, there was clomid, nolva, and hcg was sparce. you people who complain about a 4 day wait period should have been around when your package took a MONTH to get to you and if it took three months, you didn't fucking complain. "new to steroids.." lol fuck you

as for using the search function, that's all i do. look at my join date and then my number of posts. i'm on here every day, using the search function so much that i bet i know every time that its down. all i do on here is research and read archived posts. i have a hunger for learning, and the search let me down this time.the problems that i identified in my quest for this knowledge are

1) all the threads results didn't discuss what i want to know, only about gains
2) every other thread contradicted the other
3) nobody talked about these dosages and many stated that sides/affects do change with dosage

I was only saying to use the search feature becuase of the self-proclaimed gurus that post to threads like this. I know you've been here longer than most of the guys that have posted to your thread. Giving you info you already know. Like they're an authority. on bodybuilding.
Yes, those doses are fine. I've expirenced first hand in the past. (Not the test) Everybody is different. Simple answer is, if his body starts having sides, it's not for him. He can back off. In my expirence it's a damn good combo!!! The Eq with help in alot of ways. Increased nutrient transport is one of many.

Hell, some people will make you think your gonna die if your not taking the same stack that works for them. And your friend has much better stats than most people here. You and I know he's not a beginner, even if he's not a bookworm.

 

[jrs]

He told me today that in the end, the only real appeal to him is that, in dosing over 2g of test, the test and EQ would be way, way less oil and injections.

2g of prop @ 100mg/ml = 20 ml in 7 days

2g of test E @ 250mg/ml = 8 ml in 7 days