AAS Cycle for Collagen Synthesis - Desperate

[Scarface]

Has anyone attempted with any success a cycle directed towards collagen synthesis, tendon/ligament repair?

I'm suffering from serious elbow pain (golfer's elbow, it's like tennis elbow but on the opposite side of the elbow). It's from years of very heavy lifting. I suppose going over 30 the abuse on my tendons is finally catching up.

Back in the days we could play tackle football without any equipment, jump off the 2nd story building, brake bones and tear ligaments; I mean we can hurt ourselves really bad and recuperate thereafter as if nothing ever happened.

I recently fell of my sportbike at a very low speed and broke my fall with my hands pretty hard (but we've had it worse when we were younger). It's been almost 2 months and the lowest mid-section of my palm on both hands is painful to the touch and hinders my from normal life activities. Nothing helps, it hasn't even alleviated of pain or gotten any better. I fear this too will be pretty much permanent.

I can live with being put out of the gym, heck my elbows put me out for almost 6 yrs. But now in addition to my hands it's affecting my work life (it's physical work). It's now taking a toll on me mentally pretty bad considering we have our first baby on the way in a few weeks and here I am on the verge of not being able to provide.

In case you guys are wondering about my visits to the doctors, I have lost all faith and hope with them. I just see them as money grabbers, that's all. I have spent over $9,000 on PRP Injections, Cortisol Injections, countless visits to well known sports clinics, pain killers, etc. Nothing to no avail. I just don't comprehend it at all, I mean professional sports players have it worse yet they are back out on the field and here I am sports doctors looking at me as if it's completely alien to them. The final straw was I just snapped on my doctor to stop treating me like a fukcing number and actually pretend to care and analyze the situation rather than sending me all over the place for results with no conclusion. The doctor finally recommended surgery. We all know that even with surgery chances are pretty good pain will continue to exist. I know because I had surgery on my knee over 15 yrs ago.

I'm attempting to run a cycle for collagen synthesis in hopes of repairing my tendons and ligaments in my elbows and hands in the following manner:

Test 200mg/week
Anavar 80mg/daily
Equipoise 800mg/week
HGH 4-5iu/daily

Obviously this is out of desperation as the only science I've seen on the above is bro-science from posts.

Has anyone else attempted to repair their tendons and increase their collagen synthesis with any AAS compound(s)? If so please share your experience.

And more importantly, if anyone has any science backing up any of the above AAS (and GH) increasing collagen synthesis please post it.

 

[PitbullTank]

Hydrolyzed Collagen type II is the only supplement I've heard of proven in studies to actually regenerate cartilage... I have hydro collagen type II in my LBAs.... ill message you with some other info as well brother


Dante posted this info a little bit ago-

This is the study that really got the ball rolling on hydro collagen and one of the fascinating things in it is that it showed it was dose dependant

Stimulation of type II collagen biosynthesis and secretion in bovine chondrocytes cultured with degraded collagen. - PubMed - NCBI - PubMed - NCBI

So maybe the Swanson 10 grams supplement is the way to go


keynotes below:


In March 2003, Oesser et al. demonstrated for the first time that collagen hydrolysate stimulates collagen synthesis in cartilage cells (Cell Tissue Res 311:393-399). The enrichment of a chondrocyte cell culture medium with collagen hydrolysate led to a significant, dose-dependent stimulation of collagen synthesis in cartilage cells, that was not detectable in the controls.

Studies conducted by the renowned American specialist Roland Moskowitz, MD on 389 patients in the USA, Great Britain and Germany also found a pain-relieving effect from collagen hydrolysate. The patients were able to significantly reduce their consumption of analgesics and reported an improvement in physical function.

Experimental and clinical studies have found that:

Collagen hydrolysate stimulates the synthesis of type II collagen in articular cartilage
Taking collagen hydrolysate can lead to a significant reduction in pain among osteoarthritis patients
Taking collagen hydrolysate, osteoarthritis patients may be able to reduce their consumption of analgesics
Physiological functions of the joints improve significantly

Summary

Collagen hydrolysate may be an effective nutritional supplement for those suffering from osteoarthritis.

While there are no recommendations on the therapeutic intake of collagen hydrolysate, studies suggest a 10 g daily dose may be beneficial. The treatment period should not be less than three months. However, as symptoms tend to return after discontinuation of treatment, long-term administration may be prudent. Collagen hydrolysate has no side effects, therefore long-term regular use is safe and may serve as preventive measure.

 

[PitbullTank]

This is what collagen supplements do to your knee cartilage

 

[ThatSickRip]

Hydrolyzed Collagen type II is the only supplement I've heard of proven in studies to actually regenerate cartilage... I have hydro collagen type II in my LBAs.... ill message you with some other info as well brother


Dante posted this info a little bit ago-

This is the study that really got the ball rolling on hydro collagen and one of the fascinating things in it is that it showed it was dose dependant

Stimulation of type II collagen biosynthesis and secretion in bovine chondrocytes cultured with degraded collagen. - PubMed - NCBI - PubMed - NCBI

So maybe the Swanson 10 grams supplement is the way to go


keynotes below:


In March 2003, Oesser et al. demonstrated for the first time that collagen hydrolysate stimulates collagen synthesis in cartilage cells (Cell Tissue Res 311:393-399). The enrichment of a chondrocyte cell culture medium with collagen hydrolysate led to a significant, dose-dependent stimulation of collagen synthesis in cartilage cells, that was not detectable in the controls.

Studies conducted by the renowned American specialist Roland Moskowitz, MD on 389 patients in the USA, Great Britain and Germany also found a pain-relieving effect from collagen hydrolysate. The patients were able to significantly reduce their consumption of analgesics and reported an improvement in physical function.

Experimental and clinical studies have found that:

Collagen hydrolysate stimulates the synthesis of type II collagen in articular cartilage
Taking collagen hydrolysate can lead to a significant reduction in pain among osteoarthritis patients
Taking collagen hydrolysate, osteoarthritis patients may be able to reduce their consumption of analgesics
Physiological functions of the joints improve significantly

Summary

Collagen hydrolysate may be an effective nutritional supplement for those suffering from osteoarthritis.

While there are no recommendations on the therapeutic intake of collagen hydrolysate, studies suggest a 10 g daily dose may be beneficial. The treatment period should not be less than three months. However, as symptoms tend to return after discontinuation of treatment, long-term administration may be prudent. Collagen hydrolysate has no side effects, therefore long-term regular use is safe and may serve as preventive measure.

Great info. In the key notes section, it mentions reducing pain in patients with osteoarthritis. Think it would be possible that it helps with AC joint arthritis?

Ive been on the fence about ordering some, may just have to now

 

[Love_to_Bodybuild]

i feel ive felt a lessening of tendon joint pain just by using certain ones that aromatize

that cycle youve got going looks great though on paper for collagen synthesis

low test- anything over 200-300 the higher you supposely isnt the best (unless you take hgh)


anavar, and eq increase collagen synthesis supposedly

please let us know how this works for you

 

[johnjuanb1]

Look into using BPC-157. I and many others here in the peptide forum have used it to heal elbow tendinitis that wouldn't heal on its own regardless of time.
Administer 250-500mcg into the injury site everyday with a slin pin until it's better. Both of my elbows took a month to heal using this method.

 

[chinaboy]

Look up PRP, prolotherapy, proteiolytic enzymes, infrared lasers and graston technique. Some of these things are promising for ligament and tendon repair.

 

[Fa Seeshus]

Effect of selective estrogen receptor modulator/raloxifene analogue on proliferation and collagen metabolism of tendon fibroblast. - PubMed - NCBI

As someone prone to severe elbow tendonitis I have found raloxifene really helps. Also not overdoing it on AIs.

there are different kinds of collagen synthesis... Your body can make weak and brittle collagen (Winstrol can trigger this) or supple elastic collagen. That whole article that recommends eq and anavar for collagen synthesis is oversimplifying things. If you dose var high you could end up dropping cortisol too much and create more pain (why do you think cortisone shots reduce pain?)

 

[need4tren]

I injected bpc directly in my elbow. Did nothing except hurt like hell. One point I went into the funny bone had numb hands till next morning

 

[Scarface]

Hydrolyzed Collagen type II is the only supplement I've heard of proven in studies to actually regenerate cartilage... I have hydro collagen type II in my LBAs.... ill message you with some other info as well brother


Dante posted this info a little bit ago-

This is the study that really got the ball rolling on hydro collagen and one of the fascinating things in it is that it showed it was dose dependant

Stimulation of type II collagen biosynthesis and secretion in bovine chondrocytes cultured with degraded collagen. - PubMed - NCBI - PubMed - NCBI

So maybe the Swanson 10 grams supplement is the way to go


keynotes below:


In March 2003, Oesser et al. demonstrated for the first time that collagen hydrolysate stimulates collagen synthesis in cartilage cells (Cell Tissue Res 311:393-399). The enrichment of a chondrocyte cell culture medium with collagen hydrolysate led to a significant, dose-dependent stimulation of collagen synthesis in cartilage cells, that was not detectable in the controls.

Studies conducted by the renowned American specialist Roland Moskowitz, MD on 389 patients in the USA, Great Britain and Germany also found a pain-relieving effect from collagen hydrolysate. The patients were able to significantly reduce their consumption of analgesics and reported an improvement in physical function.

Experimental and clinical studies have found that:

Collagen hydrolysate stimulates the synthesis of type II collagen in articular cartilage
Taking collagen hydrolysate can lead to a significant reduction in pain among osteoarthritis patients
Taking collagen hydrolysate, osteoarthritis patients may be able to reduce their consumption of analgesics
Physiological functions of the joints improve significantly

Summary

Collagen hydrolysate may be an effective nutritional supplement for those suffering from osteoarthritis.

While there are no recommendations on the therapeutic intake of collagen hydrolysate, studies suggest a 10 g daily dose may be beneficial. The treatment period should not be less than three months. However, as symptoms tend to return after discontinuation of treatment, long-term administration may be prudent. Collagen hydrolysate has no side effects, therefore long-term regular use is safe and may serve as preventive measure.

Certainly something I'll be looking into, thnx pitbulltank

i feel ive felt a lessening of tendon joint pain just by using certain ones that aromatize

that cycle youve got going looks great though on paper for collagen synthesis

low test- anything over 200-300 the higher you supposely isnt the best (unless you take hgh)


anavar, and eq increase collagen synthesis supposedly

please let us know how this works for you

I'm pretty sure eq, and anavar especially, promote collagen synthesis. I'm absolutely certain that hgh promotes collagen synthesis as well but I'm still confused as to whether or not the hgh has to be directly injected to the injured tendon/ligament area or not. In the studies I've read they were injected directly to the injured sight. If someone can confirm please chime in.

I've also read in probably every study backing up hgh's effectiveness on collagen synthesis that it's due to the increase of igf-1 (or something to that nature). If this is the case I wonder if adding igf-1 to hgh will have any significance.

I haven't read any science backing up testosterone's loss of effectiveness on collagen synthesis when used beyond a certain dosage. I have though read studies showing stronger tendon repair by many folds when their androgen receptors are activated by testosterone. So if that's the case, I can't make any logical deduction that higher than 200 mg/week of test will necessarily negate its effectiveness on collagen synthesis. Whoever created this rumor never bothered citing it's source. I'd love to see more science behind it though either way.

Look into using BPC-157. I and many others here in the peptide forum have used it to heal elbow tendinitis that wouldn't heal on its own regardless of time.
Administer 250-500mcg into the injury site everyday with a slin pin until it's better. Both of my elbows took a month to heal using this method.

Sounds painful! I'd be interested and will look it up and read up on it although I've injected a variety of substances already to no avail. Glad it worked for you bud

Look up PRP, prolotherapy, proteiolytic enzymes, infrared lasers and graston technique. Some of these things are promising for ligament and tendon repair.

Been there, done that. They're all BS

Effect of selective estrogen receptor modulator/raloxifene analogue on proliferation and collagen metabolism of tendon fibroblast. - PubMed - NCBI

As someone prone to severe elbow tendonitis I have found raloxifene really helps. Also not overdoing it on AIs.

there are different kinds of collagen synthesis... Your body can make weak and brittle collagen (Winstrol can trigger this) or supple elastic collagen. That whole article that recommends eq and anavar for collagen synthesis is oversimplifying things. If you dose var high you could end up dropping cortisol too much and create more pain (why do you think cortisone shots reduce pain?)

What would you consider high dose of anavar and do you have the article saying high dose anivar will create pain, or drop cortisol levels?

I've read a study that AI's actually increase igf-1 and have promoted collagen synthesis

Thanks, I'll definetly be looking up raloxifene!

I injected bpc directly in my elbow. Did nothing except hurt like hell. One point I went into the funny bone had numb hands till next morning

That was my experience with PRP and Prolotherapy as well


Has anyone read any science backing up trenbolone's effectiveness on promoting collagen synthesis?

 

[Goody]

I'd second JJ's post,,, look into bpc-157 and Tb 500
Really helped me

 

[Knight9]

Injecting IGF doesn't raise IGF. Not sure if it's because there is hardly if any real igf on the market these days or it just doesn't work that way. Either way, it's obviously not the correct action to take when there are sure-fire ways to elevate it with peptides or GH...or GH and slin.

 

[Knight9]

Nandrolone
EQ
Var
Primo

All said to supposedly help collagen synthesis. Test at a low or reasonable dose, GH, aromasin and or perhaps nolva.

Remember Vitamin C also plays a role in collagen building.

As for Var, 40-60mg of good ugl Var would probably be a reasonable dose.

 

[b_cornelius]

I thought that Stanozolol was the go-to for collagen?
And GH being the best?

Obviously, BPC-157 and TB-500 are the most important co-factors to get the job done.

 

[ugadawg91]

Winstrol works great for the collagen or my skin but definitely not my joints and tendons that's for sure!!! EQ and HGH are incredible though together

 

[Scarface]

Yeh, just waiting on buddy to confirm my goods. I'll be upping the GH to 8iu daily for a few weeks. I believe that's the dose studies showed.

 

[BigDM]

Look into using BPC-157. I and many others here in the peptide forum have used it to heal elbow tendinitis that wouldn't heal on its own regardless of time.
Administer 250-500mcg into the injury site everyday with a slin pin until it's better. Both of my elbows took a month to heal using this method.

jj, can you give more details on the injection proccess? The area I struggle with is on the top of my forearm below the elbow. How deep do you inject? What about hitting a tendon?

 

[One1]

Your best option is legit pharma HGH. AAS such as EQ, deca and anavar don't have the necessary science to back certain claims regarding collagen synthesis

 

[One1]

Peptides are a secondary option as well. Reason they are secondary option instead of a first line option is obviously they are produced by an UG lab and consistent legitimacy is a big concern

 

[b_cornelius]

Various Androgens have been proven to increase types of collagen production.

That's not the problem. The issue is the ordering and structuring of the collagen. You can have brittle tendons due to the fact that the collagen isn't linked properly. You can have scars on your skin, and scars are concentrated collagen. There you go; that's collagen for you, a nice scar.