albuterol / clenbuterol

[drkodiak100]

Being an RRT i should probably know this answer but between the mundane tasks of vent checks, breathing tx's, suctioning, IS and etc you forget specific science. My question is i recently know somebody who is taking albuterol MDI QID/PRN and recently decided to start taking clenbuterol he noticed that the clen whch was from a very reputable source and manufacturer has yet to produce any results or common side effects like shaky hands etc with dosages up to 120mcg to no effect, now I was thinking that by taking both concurrently will the albuterol MDI render the clen ineffectve as a result of say a beta 2 agonist ceiling effect combined with some sort of competitive inhibition effect any ideas because i cant figure out why the clen wont work or i should say produces any common sides and results

 

[drkodiak100]

could someone let me know if im on track in my thinking or way off base

 

[Allday]

could someone let me know if im on track in my thinking or way off base

I'd love to help man but I have no idea. You sound on track, but I studied non-scientific things in college so this is not in my wheelhouse.

Very interested in hearing some opinions who have some knowledge in this though.

Honest guess from a non-scientific perspective is that it's a bad batch. I mean you said the source was legit. If it's straight from the manufacturer, that'd be tough because of the quality control the pharm companies have. But if there are middlemen/many middlemen, it's definitely a possibility.

Just an idea as to a possibility

 

[Tom]

Not sure why inhaled albuterol would have any effect on clen. There is such little systemic absorption as it is taken up topically in the lungs. The clen could be bogus.

 

[b_cornelius]

With the Albuterol, there could have been some receptor "down regulation" or some further form of homeostasis.

An instant competitive-inhibition of receptors probably isn't the model we're looking for. Cross-tolerance is more likely the word for it, over a period of time, if the patient has been taking Albuterol for a period of time.

Some common side effects may not be noticeable, but 120mcg of Clenbuterol certainly should have some sort of semblance of an effect. Heart rate? Temperature?

You can't just competitively inhibit an overdose of a beta agonist with another beta agonist. In fact, these ligands aren't entirely selective; it's merely probability regarding affinity and concentration. Meaning, a selective Beta-2 agonist can also be a Beta-1 agonist if the concentrations are high and there are no receptors of a higher affinity.

Also, If the patient is already taking Albuterol, said-patient may want to look for other pathways to exploit before adding more Beta-2 Agonists. If this is for fat-loss, you could even attempt a Selective Beta-3 Agonist such as Mirabegron.

 

[GettingBackIn]

My wife has terrible asthma and has been on albuterol most of her life. As a result clenbuterol has almost no negative effect on her when she runs it. No shakes or accelerated heart rate. As for me, if I take the smallest dose, I feel like I'm dying.

 

[Nabz]

With the Albuterol, there could have been some receptor "down regulation" or some further form of homeostasis.

An instant competitive-inhibition of receptors probably isn't the model we're looking for. Cross-tolerance is more likely the word for it, over a period of time, if the patient has been taking Albuterol for a period of time.

Some common side effects may not be noticeable, but 120mcg of Clenbuterol certainly should have some sort of semblance of an effect. Heart rate? Temperature?

You can't just competitively inhibit an overdose of a beta agonist with another beta agonist. In fact, these ligands aren't entirely selective; it's merely probability regarding affinity and concentration. Meaning, a selective Beta-2 agonist can also be a Beta-1 agonist if the concentrations are high and there are no receptors of a higher affinity.

Also, If the patient is already taking Albuterol, said-patient may want to look for other pathways to exploit before adding more Beta-2 Agonists. If this is for fat-loss, you could even attempt a Selective Beta-3 Agonist such as Mirabegron.

:yeahthat: