All this flat bench talk, of course this would happen.

[w8tlifterty]

I have been training the flat bench pretty hard as of late after not doing it for close to two years... (lots of decline and dips only). I have been getting into pl for the last year or so and competing for the fun of it. Working my way up to pretty good wgt for my size, and two weeks ago I felt a 'hinge' in my right shoulder. Never have had any problems in the past with any movement, form is pretty tight on everything. Now, I don't think I've done serious damage nor do I even think its tore, but it's been tender now for 2 weeks. Any pressing movement is OUT. As soon as I unrack, a sharp pain shoots through my front delt and stays for some time. I've been relying on dips, if I do them super strict with a very slow eccentric and concentric movement it's not too bad. Usually any setbacks I've ever had heal up quick and I'm back on track in a couple days I guess that's why I'm a bit worried. This is a dull, constant ache is the best way I can put it... Any tips or advice, I haven't taken more than a week of from training in probably 8 years or so.. I really don't want to if I don't have to, I'd just like a way to train around it. I've been doing legs 3 times a week in place of my chest work for now.. Also, oddly enough, I have no problems w/ side laterals only pressing movements. Any suggesstions?

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Oh man

I have been training the flat bench pretty hard as of late after not doing it for close to two years... (lots of decline and dips only). I have been getting into pl for the last year or so and competing for the fun of it. Working my way up to pretty good wgt for my size, and two weeks ago I felt a 'hinge' in my right shoulder. Never have had any problems in the past with any movement, form is pretty tight on everything. Now, I don't think I've done serious damage nor do I even think its tore, but it's been tender now for 2 weeks. Any pressing movement is OUT. As soon as I unrack, a sharp pain shoots through my front delt and stays for some time. I've been relying on dips, if I do them super strict with a very slow eccentric and concentric movement it's not too bad. Usually any setbacks I've ever had heal up quick and I'm back on track in a couple days I guess that's why I'm a bit worried. This is a dull, constant ache is the best way I can put it... Any tips or advice, I haven't taken more than a week of from training in probably 8 years or so.. I really don't want to if I don't have to, I'd just like a way to train around it. I've been doing legs 3 times a week in place of my chest work for now.. Also, oddly enough, I have no problems w/ side laterals only pressing movements. Any suggesstions?

You know that routine I had you on? It was to prevent stuff like this..........I have been there and done that many times over.....It is not IF it is WHEN will you get injured......be safe

 

[maldorf]

I used to get shoulder trouble like that, but mine was in the rear. I think one of the rotator cuff muscles like the supraspinatus- who knows. I would go to the machines and usually I could find one chest exercise that I could do without any pain.

I am surprised you can do dips now. If you can do dips without pain then I guess thats ok. My rule was if it hurts at all, and we all know the difference between a natural burn and injury pain, then dont do it at all. Just let your body be the guide. That usually worked for me. Occasionally I would get sore days after doing a chest exercise when injured, even when it didnt hurt at the gym. In cases like that I would either drop that exercise and find another or drop the weight/and or # of sets. I would stick with lighter weight, 15-20 reps if I were you for awhile. Then of course over the course of a month or more you gradually work yourself back into pressing. Somtimes you can do dumbell presses and not barbell. Especially if you do the dumbell presses with palms facing each other(parallel).

Just my expereince on what worked for me.

 

[w8tlifterty]

You know that routine I had you on? It was to prevent stuff like this..........I have been there and done that many times over.....It is not IF it is WHEN will you get injured......be safe

One of those 'I told you so's' haha. I know Phil, I actually haven't veered off the path you set, just substituted the flat bench for the other chest exercise to work on strengthening the movement itself for competition purposes. However, I am quickly realizing that the flat bench is not suitable for me. Lessons learned the hard way, unfortunately that is the only way I seem to learn

Maldorf, thanks for the tips. I know you've studied the human body pretty extensively and I appreciate your advice. I haven't tried them as of yet, but I was thinking maybe d.bell floor presses with palms facing eachother? Or at a slight angle? Keep the shoulder out as much as possible.

 

[jalsmiley]

agree with ya on the dumbells...i hurt the chest not too long ago and recovery and rehabbed it with dumbells light and built up..palms not totally facing eachother but almost..sort of a elbow 45degrees off your side...you say yours is more the shoulder, but dbs should help with that also since you not locked into position on a bar....good luck

 

[NTobler]

This may sound crazy but I've done the same thing while in college, and before I lifted I put a heating pack on my pec and on the inside of my armpit, to loosen it up. I would then go LIGHT on bench, but of course do it on decline. Stop when it hurts. Take tylenol and ibuprofin (sp?) hope it helps...

 

[Nikopapp]

Another one succumbs to the flat bench!

I haven't flat benched since starting DC training 3 years ago, and my shoulder's thank me for it.

It IMHO is def the most overrated exercise out there, the "ego lift".

 

[dabeast75]

supraspinatus

Who knows bro, get and MRI, but like MALDORF said it sounds like you injured your supraspinatus. Its a common shoulder injury associated with the flat benchpress. i had it myself several years ago, also thanks to the same exercise. You can train every other body part you want but until you know exactly what it is, all pushing movements with any real amount of weight should be avoided.

If it is a partial tear, it will heal in about a month or so, maybe a bit longer or shorter depending on how much you rest etc.

I have been staying more or less clear of the flat bench press like many other people on this board. I still do it from time to time but I much less often than i used to and I can tell when its "too much".

 

[DicedSix]

I know we are all built differently but in general what chest exercises can we get a consensus on that are relatively safe?

Dips, Flys, Smith machines, Hammer Strength machines, Dumbells,?

 

[BigDaddy_554]

Take some time off!

"Sometimes you have to take a step back to take two forward" (Dorian Yates). If you continue to push through this you will injure yourself worse period. You can effectively take the time off to let it heal and when you comeback make more progress in the long run. I speak from experience as many others do here. I too did a little PL earlier on. I have had both shoulder operated on a total of four times and a bicep re-attached because I tried to push through it and did not listen to my body. I do not wish this for anyone and wish I had the wisdom then that I do now. RICE(rest, ice, compressions, and elevation) with a little ibuprofen will work wonders. I post this with your health in mind and with respect for you as a brother of the iron.

 

[btech]

The layoff

Sometimes when I read about someone getting hurt from the bench, someone else will point out that the guy mentioned that he had recently picked the bench back up after a long hiatus of no flat benching.

I wonder why that is.

 

[w8tlifterty]

"Sometimes you have to take a step back to take two forward" (Dorian Yates). If you continue to push through this you will injure yourself worse period. You can effectively take the time off to let it heal and when you comeback make more progress in the long run. I speak from experience as many others do here. I too did a little PL earlier on. I have had both shoulder operated on a total of four times and a bicep re-attached because I tried to push through it and did not listen to my body. I do not wish this for anyone and wish I had the wisdom then that I do now. RICE(rest, ice, compressions, and elevation) with a little ibuprofen will work wonders. I post this with your health in mind and with respect for you as a brother of the iron.

Thanks BigD

 

[scott riz]

I haven't done flat bench in over 2 yrs. Since I started with Phil the only pressing I only do is decline, DB floor presses and dips for chest. Also for shoulders presses have been out. NO more shoulder problems. Not lacking size either.

 

[Newman]

You know, the one thing I don't understand is why it's okay to do dips & incline/decline bench, but not flat bench?

I mean, they're all pressing movements, so why wouldn't they all expose the chest to similar dammage risk?

I can see what depending on how dips are done, the lats could be assisting the lower pec, so that may account for the accepted belief that dips are safer, but why would incline/decline press be considered safer?

Any ideas?

 

[klowndog]

DEcline Bench

Is the way to go, you can go heavy, and it involves the pec more, and takes the delts out of the equation.

 

[klowndog]

You know, the one thing I don't understand is why it's okay to do dips & incline/decline bench, but not flat bench?

I mean, they're all pressing movements, so why wouldn't they all expose the chest to similar dammage risk?

I can see what depending on how dips are done, the lats could be assisting the lower pec, so that may account for the accepted belief that dips are safer, but why would incline/decline press be considered safer?

Any ideas?

DOing a flat bench with bar makes your hands have a flat grip, which rotates your shoulder a bit in the wrong way. Thats why its okay to do dumbell presses because you can use a neutral hammer grip and avoid twisting your shoulder which is dangerous under heavy weights.

 

[Newman]

DOing a flat bench with bar makes your hands have a flat grip, which rotates your shoulder a bit in the wrong way. Thats why its okay to do dumbell presses because you can use a neutral hammer grip and avoid twisting your shoulder which is dangerous under heavy weights.

So, the risk of injury is mostly related to the interface beetween the bar & the hands gripping it?

I mean, the fact that a straight bar makes us keep our thumbs facing in/down is what rotates our shoulder into a more vulnerable position?

The reason I ask is that if that's truly all there is to it, then I'm wondering how well a pair of dumbells can safely simulate a full length straight barbell for its ability to load heavy weight for striking deep into the muscle belly? I'm sure you know about how intense weight (in proper form) activates more muscle fibres than lesser weight.

I've always doubted the intensity of dumbells to give intensity in the flat bench position, but if you guys say it works for you, then I should probably give it a try.

 

[intensed]

Decline

I was a big fan of decline bench before I tore my Pec Major. After surgery and 3-4 months rehab I started back in the gym doing light flat bench for awhile. My strength increased and my injury started to feel better. I tried throwing some weight on the decline bench and I got shooting pains where the injury happened. The decline movement put that much stress on the pec major for me. My opinion is that decline bench puts just as much stress if not more on the pec major. I still do flat bench on occasion but stay relatively light.

 

[ddcmdb]

Like the others said, if it's your supraspinatus your shoulder may "pop" or make a clicking noise when you do bench. If it does that's your shoulder being put in a bind rubbing on this notch at the top of your humerus. If that's the case then your own individual structure is definitely not designed to do this movement.