Anabolics Vs. Androgens What's truely need?

[cryptasm]

I've een reading his stuff latley...what do you do 500IU at the last two days b4 yur next inj? or do you just use small amounts throught the cycle like 250IU every couple days??
I still don't get how if you have 500-600mgs test in your body how your sex drive can be be in the shitter, even if your shut down you still have alot odf test floating around...whats the deal with taht??

 

[Paul Bunyan]

I don't know why it works, it just does. And that's from my own personal experience. There comes a point where I could inject an entire 10cc bottle in one sitting and still have no sex drive. I think Swale notice that at the 12wk mark of HRT guys were starting to lose their sex drive. I'm sure he explained it somewhere but I can't tell you where.

PB

 

[cryptasm]

I don't know why it works, it just does. And that's from my own personal experience. There comes a point where I could inject an entire 10cc bottle in one sitting and still have no sex drive. I think Swale notice that at the 12wk mark of HRT guys were starting to lose their sex drive. I'm sure he explained it somewhere but I can't tell you where.

PB

I'm busy going thru all his posts here and over at Meso so I'll find it somewhere..Thx PB

 

[mike ross]

magnum and edge are on their shit...nice read...if you guys remember some old skool research from the crazy USSR days, i believe the russians did research with androgen vs. anabolic ratios. i have to dig up the articles i know i have them at work somewhere, but if i remember correctly they found that most athletes gained the most mass running cycles using 70% anabolics and 30% androgens. if you read magnum's response to a previous cycle question, you will see he stated using roughly 600-900mg deca/wk and 250mg test/wk....this works out to roughly that 70/30 ratio...figure midway point of deca is 750mg which is roughly 70% and 250mg test is roughly 30% for a total of about 1g of gear per week....

on another note i really agree with this... i have gone to 750mg of test/wk cycles the last 3 cycles and have gotten really subpar results...back in college i used mostly deca/eq with about 250-500mg sust/wk and 40-50mg dbol and got way better results than i did with 600mg of deca and 750mg test per week...so for me anabolics respond better...also i always lose more body fat using lower test doses like 50-100mg of prop every other day with some fina that using the higher doses...

gh to me is something to be used when all else fails...i have never seen anyone become a freak off this stuff, and i have seen my fair share...use it if you need to recover faster, have low igf-1 levels, are over 40, etc...dont use it to use it.....send me your money instead i'll invest it for you and you'll thank me later...igf, i already stated my opinoin on it in past posts and its honestly not worth the money, just eat better and rest more...some results

 

[Coopie]

Awesome post - thanks to all and especially magnum and edge...

One question for you magnum - you stated that test should be the "base" of any cycle and I have always done this as that's how I learned to use AAS from the start. So, does that mean that test dose in any cycle should be higher than the deca or tren or eq or primo (etc...) dose?

For example, I always believed that a test base meant you run, for example, test cyp at 750 mg / week and eq at 600 mg / week. Am I wrong here? Shouldn't the test always dominate the cycle?

 

[big_byrd52]

I have always run total anabolics higher than test. usually EQ and Deca, but i dont want get any bigger right now... GASP! My main concern is strength and still looking good. But the talk about test destroying tissue scares me. How long is neccecary to regenerate connective tissue and cartlilege with eq or other. i dont want to use deca since i may be doing some tested meets and i dont want that in my system.

 

[Coopie]

I have always run total anabolics higher than test. usually EQ and Deca, but i dont want get any bigger right now... GASP! My main concern is strength and still looking good. But the talk about test destroying tissue scares me. How long is neccecary to regenerate connective tissue and cartlilege with eq or other. i dont want to use deca since i may be doing some tested meets and i dont want that in my system.

I've always done just the opposite - I have run test as 60% - 75% of my total mg's. I've always taken the approach that test is like the bottom of the pyramid and anything else I use is on top of the test and in smaller amounts than the test.

 

[cryptasm]

Awesome post - thanks to all and especially magnum and edge...

One question for you magnum - you stated that test should be the "base" of any cycle and I have always done this as that's how I learned to use AAS from the start. So, does that mean that test dose in any cycle should be higher than the deca or tren or eq or primo (etc...) dose?

For example, I always believed that a test base meant you run, for example, test cyp at 750 mg / week and eq at 600 mg / week. Am I wrong here? Shouldn't the test always dominate the cycle?

hey Coopie ..How are ya bud?? Yer girl learnin to kick some butt??

to awnser this question..by the posts he has on here Magnum is suggesting using only enuff test to cover your base test needs ie:250-300mg pw everything else is anabolics with low androgens...

 

[big_byrd52]

yes for size. i dont want to gain any weight, i have weight class restrictions.

 

[Coopie]

hey Coopie ..How are ya bud?? Yer girl learnin to kick some butt??

to awnser this question..by the posts he has on here Magnum is suggesting using only enuff test to cover your base test needs ie:250-300mg pw everything else is anabolics with low androgens...

Hey cryp - all is good, thanks!
I'll PM you about my girl and the fighting stuff...

 

[Armageddon]

Wow I'm glad I'm one of those the GH works well for. But just like everything else I don't do crazy amounts. Just 2iu's everyday and sometimes I'll go 5on and 2off. I mainly use it to help keep the fat away and it seems to work and it was great at maintaining condition when I stopped training for awhile. When I continued to use and not train I could eat whatever and be alright.

Now that were into this discussion I want to add a twist to it. Alot of people have used DC blast methods and have gotten good results, including myself. This is a good way to stay on long term or longer than most and still maintain some kind of balance. How would you go about longer cycles with low test and higher anabolics. Short of just contiuously upping the dose? With doing the blast's I could get away with the same mg's for awhile. This way it seems like it would be constant progression.

What do you guys think about loading with androgens and then switching to and anabolic? Kind of like 250mg's sust for 4-5 wks and then switching to Eq for a couple more weeks? You could probably with alittle bit of work make the 70%-30% ratio work with this with playing around with the dose, since sust stays in your system for so long.

 

[edge250]

one thing i have noticed and others i have spoken with.....keeping test no higher than 600mg per week keeps the sex drive pretty high, get up around a gram and more and the sex drive become so-so. oh by the way guys magnum got a haircut the other day and stopped by and...and well its just beautiful

 

[Magnum]

one thing i have noticed and others i have spoken with.....keeping test no higher than 600mg per week keeps the sex drive pretty high, get up around a gram and more and the sex drive become so-so. oh by the way guys magnum got a haircut the other day and stopped by and...and well its just beautiful

Smart ass. When I come to visit you in the hospital I'm going to bring pizza with me.

 

[Vespa103]

First I would like to say thanks to Magnum for the info on the tendons and effects of different compounds on them

Secondly I have to agree with Fast and furious why take test and 3 other compounds to fight its sides when just one anabolic will do the same thing

Magnums info on equipose and tendon strength further makes me think test is not for me

great read

 

[MAINEVENT]

Edge and Magnum

Bump for a great post.

Edge & Magnum: Have your guys views on this changed in the past few months?

 

[Magnum]

Bump for a great post.

Edge & Magnum: Have your guys views on this changed in the past few months?

Yes, I now realize that bodybuilding is foolish and I have taken up chess and eating donuts. I am much happier now.

I was always under that impression from the info that I could gather that the guys back in the 70's an 80's did not either use test or didn't use much of it. Recently I got to ask a guy who used to train with Sergio (on another board) what Sergio took. I asked him thru pm as I did not want him to post it on the board thinking that he might not be comfortable. Anyway, He didn't seem to mind telling everyone so I will relay that info. He said that back in the 70's Sergio did not use test, just as I thought. He mentioned Deca and D-bol. No big surprise here. He didn't get into doses. He then said that Sergio used sust. A-50 and other types of test in the 80's. I always thought that Sergio looked his best in the early 70's as he didn't quite seem to have the freaky fullness in the 80's as in the 70's. I realize that age could very well play a factor in this. IMO Sergio do not get huge from taking a couple of Dbol and 200-400mg of deca a week, but that's just me.

I guess you could take this as proof that you do not need test to get huge. In this day and age test is cheap and easy to come by so you see many taking it in high doses. Personally, I would stick to what I said before and use test as a base if you have access and can afford other anabolics. Guys like Sergio and Arnold only competed once a year later in their careers so I am assuming if they had any sexual side effect they just stuck it out and waited for their system to return to normal.

Think about it, back in the 70's there weren't many guys who competed like there are today, but it is still hard to find guys like Sergio, Arnold, Robinson, Padilla ect. Yes, they did have great genetics, but with so many more guys competing today (thousands) you still do not see these types of physiques. I think the answer to this is not just one specific thing that guys today are doing or not doing, but many things. Years ago you never saw too many guys come into shows flat, spilled over or holding water. There are far too many drugs being used today that are completley useless and actually make a persson look far worse than what they could have looked like the day of the show.

 

[TooPowerful4u]

So in your opinion (and some opinions of others with experience who like anabolics more) which anabolics seem to pack on the beef the best? Im talkin injectables though, not orals.

 

[manboy270]

HHmmnn.... Very good read.

 

[edge250]

i tried this approach, on paper it looks good in reality it does not pack on the mass as running a higher test base coupled with an anabolic. i feel the biggest mistake you can make is running test by itself, your connective tissue will suffer greatly. as far as dosing what i have found over 10 years is the bigger you get the more you need. yes it would be great if you could stay at 600mg test with 300mg deca and continue to grow but it aint gonna happen. everyone is different though but from EXPERIENCE, not speculation, this is what i have found true.

 

[MAINEVENT]

i tried this approach, on paper it looks good in reality it does not pack on the mass as running a higher test base coupled with an anabolic. i feel the biggest mistake you can make is running test by itself, your connective tissue will suffer greatly. as far as dosing what i have found over 10 years is the bigger you get the more you need. yes it would be great if you could stay at 600mg test with 300mg deca and continue to grow but it aint gonna happen. everyone is different though but from EXPERIENCE, not speculation, this is what i have found true.

When you talk about MASS, are you talking overall size? What about quality gains from the lower dose test?

I know your more interested in your health, blood profile, etc. Do you still feel the higher test goes along with a healthier approach?