Any experienced Lantus users?

sma · Mar 8, 2013

Goody said:
Following that protocall when do would you pin GH then? b4 bed?

Yes.

My first dose is at 6 10iu Humalog then at 8-8:30 10iu Humalog

Pin Gh around 11:30 or 12

I tried every possible way Gh with slin pre workout / then tried it post workout (I'V) / then lantus am .... Best results are my current protocol just immediate recovery , strength and size with little to no fat gain

I am also doing some am fasted cardio and use Metformin every 4 hours on my 1 off day

Thinking ahead I'm trying to figure what the best thing todo when I stall (ofcourse more food) < but I want my body to utilize that food ill have it figured out b4 that happens

Adonis89 · Mar 8, 2013

sma said:
Yes.

My first dose is at 6 10iu Humalog then at 8-8:30 10iu Humalog

Pin Gh around 11:30 or 12

I tried every possible way Gh with slin pre workout / then tried it post workout (I'V) / then lantus am .... Best results are my current protocol just immediate recovery , strength and size with little to no fat gain

I am also doing some am fasted cardio and use Metformin every 4 hours on my 1 off day

Thinking ahead I'm trying to figure what the best thing todo when I stall (ofcourse more food) < but I want my body to utilize that food ill have it figured out b4 that happens

Do you get sluggish with the pre workout slin?

What did you find unfavorable with taking GH + Slin together PWO?

Great feedback

jayl19 · Mar 8, 2013

Adonis89 said:
The sponsor in my sig has lantus

Thank you

Would you say hgh was a must while on lantis

I tried humalog, 4iu 20min IM after every carb meal, recon I was gainin fat though, never takin hgh before

Coming to end of a cut and wanna bulk, not sure weather to use slin in case I go fat and dieted for nothing

sma · Mar 8, 2013

Adonis89 said:
Do you get sluggish with the pre workout slin?

What did you find unfavorable with taking GH + Slin together PWO?

Great feedback

No with 40gram vitargo + 30 gram whey hydro + a 50/70/12 meal 1:30min earlier I feel fine (I am also taking dbol/adrol with the meal)

Gh and slin together I found I needed less carbs and if I tried to push carbs they'd just sit in my stomach (I guess from the fgh making me resistant)

That feeling was uncomfortable and I noticed it from all ways of inject I'V / IM and sub q

Once I moved Gh away from slin my stomach was flat even after pounding carbs (i guess my body was storing them away)

That's what I've noticed and I'm in the camp of do things the best way to get the best result so I have no problem trying 100 methods because I know when I find the right one it will save me time in the long run

Adonis89 · Mar 9, 2013

sma said:
No with 40gram vitargo + 30 gram whey hydro + a 50/70/12 meal 1:30min earlier I feel fine (I am also taking dbol/adrol with the meal)

Gh and slin together I found I needed less carbs and if I tried to push carbs they'd just sit in my stomach (I guess from the fgh making me resistant)

That feeling was uncomfortable and I noticed it from all ways of inject I'V / IM and sub q

Once I moved Gh away from slin my stomach was flat even after pounding carbs (i guess my body was storing them away)

That's what I've noticed and I'm in the camp of do things the best way to get the best result so I have no problem trying 100 methods because I know when I find the right one it will save me time in the long run

I've noticed the same thing when taking GH and slin together pre workout with intra workout nutrition. It just sat in my stomach and made me bloated. Metabolically, this makes sense with the GH and slin being active at the same time in peaking amounts.

When I used GH and slin PWO, I would not need a shake, other than some BCAA and maybe a gatorade if really depleted. Mainly because GH and insulin antagonize each other. I would let the two hormones work, then I'd go home and eat a regular meal. This worked pretty well.

For whatever reason, I have my best results with a basal insulin and 2x/day GH dosing. Everyone is different.

relentless4287 · Mar 9, 2013

What about using lantus am and log pre or post and gh away from eachother

Adonis89 · Mar 9, 2013

relentless4287 said:
What about using lantus am and log pre or post and gh away from eachother

That's a good idea once you plateau from one or the other. One of the two BIG guys that I know (IFBB) is a heavy slin and GH user. He uses 50-100iu Lantus AM and maybe 1-2 shots of Humalog daily - usually pre and/or post workout.

When using that much slin I suggest having a decent amount of GH in your system...however I don't recommend using that much slin!!!

relentless4287 · Mar 9, 2013

No i agree def cant jump back into it that high so you both sma and adonis agree that gh away from slin ho did you do slin when runnin lantus gonna mabe do it for a go

Adonis89 · Mar 9, 2013

relentless4287 said:
No i agree def cant jump back into it that high so you both sma and adonis agree that gh away from slin ho did you do slin when runnin lantus gonna mabe do it for a go

Lantus doesn't peak so running GH away from it doesn't make sense, or work. I took 5iu Am and 5iu PM of GH with about 50iu AM of Lantus

highdrum · Mar 9, 2013

Adonis,
Since slin levels were therefor elevated all day, did you notice any increase of fat storage? Or were you eating a particularily low-fat diet at that time? From most of the humalin protocols I read, using it pre wo, all the intra workout and 1st post workout nutrients should be fat free to prevent it from going into storage. I have never tried slin, and figure lantus would be the safest route for a first time user, I was given a humalin protocol by shelby but was never able to get any fast slin for it. Sounds like lantus is readily available.

Adonis89 · Mar 9, 2013

highdrum said:
Adonis,
Since slin levels were therefor elevated all day, did you notice any increase of fat storage? Or were you eating a particularily low-fat diet at that time? From most of the humalin protocols I read, using it pre wo, all the intra workout and 1st post workout nutrients should be fat free to prevent it from going into storage. I have never tried slin, and figure lantus would be the safest route for a first time user, I was given a humalin protocol by shelby but was never able to get any fast slin for it. Sounds like lantus is readily available.

Their "elevated" but not NEARLY as elevated as they would be with bolus insulin.

here's the thing people confuse: The Lantus doesn't cause peaking. Plasma concentrations are not HIGH like they are for a peak after a bolus insulin. So while very prolonged use may lead to insulin sensitivity issues and fat gain, it's less likely than with using a lot of peaking insulin. Lantus is also an analogue - it's not the same as your body's basal insulin. It has IGF-1 cross binding properties making it more anabolic than you're own body's basal insulin.

Think about it - when an insulin is peaking and reaching such high concentrations in the blood, fat gain is far more likely.

highdrum · Mar 10, 2013

As always, a pretty insightful and well thought out answer from adonis......

muhkuh123 · Mar 10, 2013

Adonis, I bet you also read UK Muscle and those boards ...therefore you should know max.

What do you think about his opinion regarding nutritional fat during slin being active ...he says that it won't be stored ...that this is just some kind of myth.

I guess he's just blaming too much carbs for fat storage. Thoughts?

Adonis89 · Mar 10, 2013

muhkuh123 said:
Adonis, I bet you also read UK Muscle and those boards ...therefore you should know max.

What do you think about his opinion regarding nutritional fat during slin being active ...he says that it won't be stored ...that this is just some kind of myth.

I guess he's just blaming too much carbs for fat storage. Thoughts?

I occasionally peruse UK muscle and the other UK board and I've heard the name "maxititer" mentioned a few times in context of Lantus. Then I found an few posts on RXmuscle where he talked about insulin. He's correct about the pharmacodynamics of basal vs bolus insulin. Some of his other recommendations seem a bit iffy.

I don't think there's an advantage to eating more fat than necessary for health and plastic needs when eating like a bodybuilder- especially when on hormones. Some guys have super fast metabolisms and need the extra calories, however.

I eat 50-75g/Day. When I increase my fat higher, I need to lower carbs quite a bit or I store fat. Carbs are the better energy source for BBer during most times, IMO/IME. We have bigger than average muscles, which have the ability to store a lot more than average amounts of glycogen. That can only efficiently come from starch in the diet.

If I don't train for a while, I reduce my carbs just enough to keep my glycogen levels close to full and increase my fats a bit.

Diesed · Mar 10, 2013

Adonis89 said:
I occasionally peruse UK muscle and the other UK board and I've heard the name "maxititer" mentioned a few times in context of Lantus. Then I found an few posts on RXmuscle where he talked about insulin. He's correct about the pharmacodynamics of basal vs bolus insulin. Some of his other recommendations seem a bit iffy.

I don't think there's an advantage to eating more fat than necessary for health and plastic needs when eating like a bodybuilder- especially when on hormones. Some guys have super fast metabolisms and need the extra calories, however.

I eat 50-75g/Day. When I increase my fat higher, I need to lower carbs quite a bit or I store fat. Carbs are the better energy source for BBer during most times, IMO/IME. We have bigger than average muscles, which have the ability to store a lot more than average amounts of glycogen. That can only efficiently come from starch in the diet.

If I don't train for a while, I reduce my carbs just enough to keep my glycogen levels close to full and increase my fats a bit.

What would your feelings be on running lantus WITHOUT any GH?? What if one were to use GH frag along with the lantus?