at what dosage does hgh start causing deformaties?

[doitright]

didnt Titus mouth off about seeing changes in Jay's facial structure?

 

[Rich_B]

well i didnt want to throw out names or anything but i live in las vegas..the athlete is actually a famous comedian Carrot Top ...he looks great other than the facial changes..ive seen him live and there is for sure a change in his face...he is a great dude and i mean no disrespect

Yeh I know Carrot Top, I always stay at the Luxor when I'm in Vegas, he was one of the resident acts the last couple of times I was there.

Saw some really dodgy photos of his physique a while back, he'd obviously been overdoing the Synthol.

 

[123cctv]

ive heard 10 ius is safe what are your thoughts

It has nothing to do with a particular amount of GH, i.e. so many IU per se.

Actually the changes are bone related which is a direct result of inflated levels of IGF-1. Though GH will create sectretion of IGF-1, it in itself (GH) is not the direct cause.

 

[123cctv]

well i didnt want to throw out names or anything but i live in las vegas..the athlete is actually a famous comedian Carrot Top

Carrot Top has been on juice, not just GH.

 

[123cctv]

you WILL NOT get facial deformaties from taking GH unless your allready predisposed to this condition

Au contraire!

"PHARMACY & THERAPEUTICS COMMITTTEE - DRUG CLASS REVIEW
HUMAN GROWTH HORMONES

"Overproduction of growth hormone leads to increase in insulin-like growth factor 1 (IGF-1) by the liver and other tissues. IGF-1 causes such symptoms as soft tissue swelling, joint disorders, enlargements of hands, feet, and jaw, visceral overgrowth,..."
www.clinpharm.com/services_samples/dcr_hgh_0206.pdf

However I wouldn't waste my time arguing that an enlarged jaw bone might not be considered a deformity, though it is certanly a major change to ones face.

 

[123cctv]

Usually individuals prone to acromegaly do not have isolated enlargement of certain areas of their head, hands, feet, or chest. It's global.

Not w/IGF-1. It will cause "isolated enlargement" "of hands, feet, and jaw".

See previous post for the source of this summation.

 

[james555]

Im guessing these results stay permanent after yoou get off to?? Everyone I know doesn't look different but they don't look the same

 

[68 firebird]

Not w/IGF-1. It will cause "isolated enlargement" "of hands, feet, and jaw".

See previous post for the source of this summation.

Read your own study. You inserted the words "isolated enlargement". The study mentions nothing about isolated enlargement. I scan for pituitary adenomas and am well aware of the patient populous directly that it affects. In 20 years, I have never seen "isolated enlargement" in acromegaly patients which is what I referenced.
68

 

[123cctv]

Read your own study. You inserted the words "isolated enlargement". The study mentions nothing about isolated enlargement.

First off, I"ve read the study and those individually referenced. Though it's not my "own study". It's the "PHARMACY & THERAPEUTICS COMMITTTEE - DRUG CLASS REVIEW" summation regarding 20 rHGH studies findings.

Secondly, I used two quotations in my previous response to you. I used your words and theirs, note the "_" & "_".

To be certain, if you recall you said,
"Usually individuals prone to acromegaly do not have isolated enlargement of certain areas of their head, hands, feet, or chest. It's global."

Thus my response to you was direct and on target,
Not w/IGF-1. It will cause "isolated enlargement" "of hands, feet, and jaw".

So your words along with theirs "of hands, feet, and jaw" applies perfectly here as the hands feet and jaw are in themselves "isolated" areas which you said doesn't happen. You said it was "global" and I'm telling you it's not when it's "caused by overproduction of growth hormone" as the Drug Class Review stated.
Further, study or not, I personally have experienced all of the above.

I scan for pituitary adenomas and am well aware of the patient populous directly that it affects. In 20 years, I have never seen "isolated enlargement" in acromegaly patients which is what I referenced.
68

And? You're scanning for "pituitary" tumors? This is means you've seen it all? If so, I'm telling you that you obviously haven't. Further, perhaps this is why you were unfamilar these facts? You're looking for (scanning) for the tumor/syptom and not the "causes"? By the way, if I were you I'd not expect anyone to show up at my doorstep due to overuse of GH resulting in enlarged hands, feet or jaw bones (IGF-1 via liver secretion and not "pituitary").

Guy goes to the Doctor. Doctor says, "What seems to be the problem?" The guy says, "Doc, my arm hurts when I twist it this way!!" The Doctor says, "Look idiot, STOP twisting your arm that way!!".

Is GH or IGF-1 causing symptoms you don't like?? Well then??

 

[68 firebird]

First off, I"ve read the study and those individually referenced. Though it's not my "own study". It's the "PHARMACY & THERAPEUTICS COMMITTTEE - DRUG CLASS REVIEW" summation regarding 20 rHGH studies findings.

Secondly, I used two quotations in my previous response to you. I used your words and theirs, note the "_" & "_".

To be certain, if you recall you said,
"Usually individuals prone to acromegaly do not have isolated enlargement of certain areas of their head, hands, feet, or chest. It's global."

Thus my response to you was direct and on target,
Not w/IGF-1. It will cause "isolated enlargement" "of hands, feet, and jaw".

So your words along with theirs "of hands, feet, and jaw" applies perfectly here as the hands feet and jaw are in themselves "isolated" areas which you said doesn't happen. You said it was "global" and I'm telling you it's not when it's "caused by overproduction of growth hormone" as the Drug Class Review stated.
Further, study or not, I personally have experienced all of the above.



And? You're scanning for "pituitary" tumors? This is means you've seen it all? If so, I'm telling you that you obviously haven't. Further, perhaps this is why you were unfamilar these facts? You're looking for (scanning) for the tumor/syptom and not the "causes"? By the way, if I were you I'd not expect anyone to show up at my doorstep due to overuse of GH resulting in enlarged hands, feet or jaw bones (IGF-1 via liver secretion and not "pituitary").

Guy goes to the Doctor. Doctor says, "What seems to be the problem?" The guy says, "Doc, my arm hurts when I twist it this way!!" The Doctor says, "Look idiot, STOP twisting your arm that way!!".

Is GH or IGF-1 causing symptoms you don't like?? Well then??

First....Why the rant? I answered someones questions with real world experience. I never claimed to have seen it all, but working in large teaching institutions allows me to see more than most. My work allows me to interact with varying specialties and specialists (physicians) that provide insight that one study cannot.
I'm not trashing you or the article you provided. I simply stated that the article does not specify the growth anomalies to be isolated. It stated that it can occur in any one of the areas and do occur in all, but to say that enhanced cheekbones (as Plang) indicated is secondary to elevated IGF-1 is reaching.
68

 

[taslajrisi]

carrot top just doesn't know how to use anything properly and very bad SEO injections lol

Barry Bonds shoe size went up a couple sizes I believe. If you look at his face early days vs later its defanately different. Not bad, just different.

 

[plang]

I can't just attribute the growth to gh as I've used about 5mgs of igf-1 lr3 over the past year....I admit it's been a while since ie been in school...I saw nothing about isolated enlargement from igf-1 in the article...

 

[123cctv]

First....Why the rant? I answered someones questions with real world experience. I never claimed to have seen it all, but working in large teaching institutions allows me to see more than most.

There was no rant - merely an honest reply. Your experiences over the "20 years" implied you knew what you were talking about. If not, then not only do I appologize but am at a loss as to why you qualified your knowledge with "years".

I'm not trashing you or the article you provided.

To be clear - nor have I trashed you.

I simply stated that the article does not specify the growth anomalies to be isolated.

And here is where I and the studies beg to differ. Hands, feet and jaw are in themselves "isolated". For instance, is the "jaw" the cranium? Nope. Are the hands separate (isolated) from the arm? Certainly. How about the feet? Aren't they separate (isolated) from the rest of the leg or body? You bet they are. Yet you initially stated that isolation of growth does not occur, but instead is global.

but to say that enhanced cheekbones (as Plang) indicated is secondary to elevated IGF-1 is reaching.
68

If "enhanced cheekbones" is what you initially said, I wouldn't have bothered replying to you. The problem is - that's not what you intially said. You intially commented with "head, hands, feet" of which I offered a review w/specifics yielding similar wording to the contrary.

 

[123cctv]

Im guessing these results stay permanent after yoou get off to??

Correct.

 

[123cctv]

I admit it's been a while since ie been in school...I saw nothing about isolated enlargement from igf-1 in the article...

Sorry bud, but I guess it's my fault for not making myself clear. If you are referring to the Review "article" I offered, yes you are correct. It said nothing about "isolated enlargement". The words "isolated enlargement" were intially 68 firebird's. He intially said, "acromegaly do not have isolated enlargement of certain areas of their head, hands, feet," and because he said that, I in turn decided to show his err via quoting him using his own words, further citing a Review that stated "enlargements of hands, feet, and jaw" do occur! I mean, isn't a hand, jaw or foot "isolated"?

I sincerely hope this is making sense...

 

[68 firebird]

Sorry bud, but I guess it's my fault for not making myself clear. If you are referring to the Review "article" I offered, yes you are correct. It said nothing about "isolated enlargement". The words "isolated enlargement" were intially 68 firebird's. He intially said, "acromegaly do not have isolated enlargement of certain areas of their head, hands, feet," and because he said that, I in turn decided to show his err via quoting him using his own words, further citing a Review that stated "enlargements of hands, feet, and jaw" do occur! I mean, isn't a hand, jaw or foot "isolated"?

I sincerely hope this is making sense...

It's not but I see where you're coming from. It's a difference in interpretation. I'm not about to get into a pissing match over semantics.
68

 

[Cosmicdrifter]

Getting back to the original question, is there any information about the use of GH at levels that cause problems?

Continuous use without breaks? Total daily use? Is it genetics that complicates prediction? Age?

There must be several hundred thousand posts on the internet from bodybuilders about the use of GH and negative symptoms; some senior BB here must have an educated guess.

 

[ChuteBoxer]

Acromegly is a side effect of gh. Gh affects everyone differently. If you take it there is a risk.

 

[123cctv]

Getting back to the original question, is there any information about the use of GH at levels that cause problems?

While ChuteBoxer also answered your question, if you noted this was already answered in the original study linked it used the words "overproduction of growth hormone" led to the increase in IGF-1 which caused the "enlargements of"...

The concern here is "overproduction" and that means anything above normal HRT levels.

 

[123cctv]

.