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Avoiding getting carried away with NAC, +boosting glutathione

im gona paste something below that i posted in a different thread, maybe it will help shed some lite on the idea of too much anti ox.

normal person vs sick person gets very different results.

stew, tons of info on kinda this subject in rats, navey seals and all kinds of other places in terms of oxygenation of the brain n all that.

sick, even mental sick is very different then normal and why maybe a "normal" person may be able to achieve oxidation with antiox and why they do not have that effect in sick people.

keep in mind, just like the cancer thing, antiox is a stupid big word that has vast/broad applications one may kill you the other may save you!

so here is my previous ramble.


something ill share on this...

when i get bad "freak outs" i know super scientific medical term here but works for many things. so when my head is seriously fucked, one of the biggest sensations that i get/identify is that it feels like my brain is both short circuting ( like lighting bolts ) and that im suffocating. not literally, more like it feels like my brain is sufficating/dying/starved for oxygen maybe...

hard to describe and not always talking about anxiety, really anxiety is much less then this sorta thing, the severity varries but can be from anxiety to full fuck me psycosis, like i am a dangers screaming foaming at the mouth psycotic fuck.

:D

horrible, and the feeling after is even worse, like a hangover.

now i am not suggest "can" for the op here, what i want to do is try to enlighten you a lil. see in that state, can really helps me. well not usually in that moment, nothing will. but "can" makes that suffocating feeling go away, its like my head can breath. i know it may sound wierd but that the best way i can tell you, like going from drowning to breathing from an oxygen mask.

to the point of when back to more normal state im in tears cus of how horribley fucked up n violent i was. its shameful, feeling.

now there have been a lotta ppl trying to figure out, well if" can" is sooooo bad (;) ie govt lies ) then why does it help sick people so much?

good question right.

you guys see me talk all this bs about antiox n how important i feel they are, well what i think is really going on here in my case is the "can" is acting as a super powerful antiox, particularly for the brain.

now, that is my "feeling" but there is some science behind it. the fedfuks hold a patent on canabinoids as neuroprotective agents.

understand that mother fuckers???
big bro been lyin his mother fucking ass off all these years cashin in on your suffering and waiting to cash in more!

so "canycan" is not the devil but, it is one of the strongest antiox you can find particularly for brain health. i am happy to discus the details of that more with anyone interested but i dont wana side track this or get this deleted cus this is about antioxidants in general and how they impact brain/health and emotion.

so emotion. emotions are drugs mother fuckers!!!
emotion usually we talking dopamine! fight or flight!
serotonin comes into play too but i think for many cases really the jacking of dopamine drops serotonin and can become part of systemic innflamation, cortistol also super important here.

anywho... this shit is jacking you metabolizm and creating all kinds of voodoo chemtistry in your body that heavily increases oxidation.

your body is unable to deal with the excess stress this sorta deprives you of o2( kinda sorta but potentially im talking on funky super micro level, mitochondria n shit ) of so, the basis of YOU can not handle the work load n this shit leads too all kinds of unpleasant ness.

i am not necesarily saying that antiox are gona fix all your mental problems. what i am saying is for those who have higher oxidation levels, higher stress, higher emotions you guys are suffering because your body can not get rid of toxins.

this is giant! im not talking about little stuff. sick people react much better to antioxidants then healthy people in my experience.

that is something to think about when we start asking about too much antiox.
maybe a "normal" person could encouter something like that. but a sick person whos body is swimming in there own waste is suffering n this leads too all kinds of bad things down the line. very serious diseases n shit;

G mentions the glut, and 100% after my first time there i had that wave of clarity feeling, like fresh air on my brain, sorta like the "can" effect.

as i keep telling most, very few understand the antioxidant part of "can", really how many can afford to use at the level required? thats being done for a reason. just like so many other things that have a negative impact on your health.

just some food for thought for ya.

;)

also why more drugs is not gona = better you

now time for next round of antiox so i stay... was goan say sane but.... who am i kidding. lol

:headbang:
:sta:-wars
 
I thought this subject has been beaten down already?
Obviously "antioxidants" (despise that term) can have a negative impact on health.

Personaly I have issue with that so-called "meta" study. Aside from Vit C, Vit E that demonstrate a pro-antioxidant activity at normal to high levels and as growth inhibitors, ALA, Co Q 10, ALC, and Creatine promote mitocondrial biogenesis. Is there even a debate on their use and safety even at reasonably high doses?

Others in the "study," substances such as curcumin, resveratrol, ptero, etc. are ppar a, ppar g, pgc1-a, AMPK agonists, or inhibit factors like NF-kB and other pro-inflamatory factors. Their use and function has nothing to do with being an "antioxidant."

Endo enzymatic antioxidants like glut, SOD, catalase are not like Exo antioxidants and can become depleted especially under high levels of stress. I wouldn't even compare NAC and any other precursor to a "pro-oxidant."

Elevating pgc-1a, AMPK, suppressing NF-kB would have a greater overal benefit to health, longevity, etc. than the potential reduction in skeletal muscle growth personally.

Sent from my VS880 using Tapatalk
 
I thought this subject has been beaten down already?
Obviously "antioxidants" (despise that term) can have a negative impact on health.

Personaly I have issue with that so-called "meta" study. Aside from Vit C, Vit E that demonstrate a pro-antioxidant activity at normal to high levels and as growth inhibitors, ALA, Co Q 10, ALC, and Creatine promote mitocondrial biogenesis. Is there even a debate on their use and safety even at reasonably high doses?

Others in the "study," substances such as curcumin, resveratrol, ptero, etc. are ppar a, ppar g, pgc1-a, AMPK agonists, or inhibit factors like NF-kB and other pro-inflamatory factors. Their use and function has nothing to do with being an "antioxidant."

Endo enzymatic antioxidants like glut, SOD, catalase are not like Exo antioxidants and can become depleted especially under high levels of stress. I wouldn't even compare NAC and any other precursor to a "pro-oxidant."

Elevating pgc-1a, AMPK, suppressing NF-kB would have a greater overal benefit to health, longevity, etc. than the potential reduction in skeletal muscle growth personally.

Sent from my VS880 using Tapatalk

It is sure good to see you posting here again! What do you suggest as far as mixing antioxidants around workouts go? I was under the impression they should only be avoided around training. And which ones would you avoid specifically?
 
It is sure good to see you posting here again! What do you suggest as far as mixing antioxidants around workouts go? I was under the impression they should only be avoided around training. And which ones would you avoid specifically?
C and E

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
 
C and E

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk



Ok that’s good since those were the only two supplements I’ve been avoiding around training.
 
It is sure good to see you posting here again! What do you suggest as far as mixing antioxidants around workouts go? I was under the impression they should only be avoided around training. And which ones would you avoid specifically?
To tell the truth, I was tired of the drama. Went back to lurking for a time, but missed it.

I'd ask knight9 that question.



Sent from my VS880 using Tapatalk
 
I thought this subject has been beaten down already?
Obviously "antioxidants" (despise that term) can have a negative impact on health.

Personaly I have issue with that so-called "meta" study. Aside from Vit C, Vit E that demonstrate a pro-antioxidant activity at normal to high levels and as growth inhibitors, ALA, Co Q 10, ALC, and Creatine promote mitocondrial biogenesis. Is there even a debate on their use and safety even at reasonably high doses?

Others in the "study," substances such as curcumin, resveratrol, ptero, etc. are ppar a, ppar g, pgc1-a, AMPK agonists, or inhibit factors like NF-kB and other pro-inflamatory factors. Their use and function has nothing to do with being an "antioxidant."

Endo enzymatic antioxidants like glut, SOD, catalase are not like Exo antioxidants and can become depleted especially under high levels of stress. I wouldn't even compare NAC and any other precursor to a "pro-oxidant."

Elevating pgc-1a, AMPK, suppressing NF-kB would have a greater overal benefit to health, longevity, etc. than the potential reduction in skeletal muscle growth personally.

Sent from my VS880 using Tapatalk
**broken link removed**


**broken link removed**
 
I saw Vit C talked about in earlier posts in this thread, so I think this post is appropriate....

I dont know what youre guys protocols or philosophies regarding Vitamin C.... but for the longest I was under the impression that 3-5g of Vit C should be taken postworkout to reduce cortisol and 3-5g before bedtime isnt a bad idea either for again, reducing cortisol and, if I recall correctly, preventing you from getting up in the middle night of having to go piss.

It seems like I've been hearing more recently, from various sources, my protocol for Vit C is trash, that I shouldnt be taking this much Vit C.

Also on 2-a-days I double the Vit C, so its 10g.

I've also heard of people doing occasional Vit C IV drips...

Whats your guys thoughts on Vit C dosage? DO you take it, when, why? Do you do the IV drips?

Knight9, whats current your protocol on NAC now? Any new beliefs on NAC? Have you done the IV glutathione yet?
 
I saw Vit C talked about in earlier posts in this thread, so I think this post is appropriate....

I dont know what youre guys protocols or philosophies regarding Vitamin C.... but for the longest I was under the impression that 3-5g of Vit C should be taken postworkout to reduce cortisol and 3-5g before bedtime isnt a bad idea either for again, reducing cortisol and, if I recall correctly, preventing you from getting up in the middle night of having to go piss.

It seems like I've been hearing more recently, from various sources, my protocol for Vit C is trash, that I shouldnt be taking this much Vit C.

Also on 2-a-days I double the Vit C, so its 10g.

I've also heard of people doing occasional Vit C IV drips...

Whats your guys thoughts on Vit C dosage? DO you take it, when, why? Do you do the IV drips?

Knight9, whats current your protocol on NAC now? Any new beliefs on NAC? Have you done the IV glutathione yet?
The current thinking these days is that heavy doses of antioxidants around workout (specifically C & E) can inhibit some of the natural adaptation processes needed for maximal response to the stimulus. As such, I take my NAC early AM with 1 gram of vitamin C (and other non fat soluble stuff I take in morning). Take C with your NAC (search for reason why). I train in the evening at 6pm and don't take antioxidants post workout. It's fine to take antioxidants like C and NAC, just space them farther away from training if possible (4-5 hours). I also think all you really need in regard to C is 2-3g max per day. Unless doing IV treatment, your just going to piss the excess out most likely. Huge doses like 8-10g isn't going to hurt you per se. But you're likely just wasting your money.

The general shift is thinking has been that when it comes to antioxidants, MORE is not always better. Everything in an optimal BALANCE.
 
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I'm obviously not Knight, but this is what I have been doing for over a year straight: 1000 mg vitamin C and 600 mg NAC prior to retiring for the night.

I don't know why but I find NAC interesting. I have not had an asthma attack since using NAC….believe me when I tell you I was really bad. If this is a placebo, than this is the best thing to ever happen to me.
 
Last edited:
Those taking more than 500mg at a time aren't doing yourself any favors as its been shown that the plasma saturation dose is 500mg and anymore, you're wasting it. Anything above 1g has been shown to be pro-oxidant.
 
I usually take 600-1200mgs ed
Been two years now
Liver values always in range (were always elevated prior)
I haven't used my symbiocort asthma inhaler in over a year( used to take twice a day, every day) and I very very rarely even catch a cold anymore, maybe a little sniffles here and there but it never turns into full blown cold any more, love the stuff,
 
I saw Vit C talked about in earlier posts in this thread, so I think this post is appropriate....

I dont know what youre guys protocols or philosophies regarding Vitamin C.... but for the longest I was under the impression that 3-5g of Vit C should be taken postworkout to reduce cortisol and 3-5g before bedtime isnt a bad idea either for again, reducing cortisol and, if I recall correctly, preventing you from getting up in the middle night of having to go piss.

It seems like I've been hearing more recently, from various sources, my protocol for Vit C is trash, that I shouldnt be taking this much Vit C.

Also on 2-a-days I double the Vit C, so its 10g.

I've also heard of people doing occasional Vit C IV drips...

Whats your guys thoughts on Vit C dosage? DO you take it, when, why? Do you do the IV drips?

Knight9, whats current your protocol on NAC now? Any new beliefs on NAC? Have you done the IV glutathione yet?

I think Vitamin C dosage should be in the 2-4g range. No real new beliefs on NAC...but I do not run it year round. I likely am running it approx half the year or possibly a bit more but I do take breaks. I try to take 500-600 3x daily when I use it. I usually don't take 1000-1200mg at once but occasionally I do. I haven't done IV Glutathione...or even IM yet. I do try to match the amount of Vitamin C with NAC and take them together....apparently just NAC can cause problems.

Those taking more than 500mg at a time aren't doing yourself any favors as its been shown that the plasma saturation dose is 500mg and anymore, you're wasting it. Anything above 1g has been shown to be pro-oxidant.

I am not sure if this is 100% proven across the board factual information. Can you provide anything to make me think this is actually set in stone? I did switch to 500mg caps and rarely take 1g at a time anymore. (I would only do this if I felt a cold coming on or if I was trying to match and cover an NAC dose.)
 
Those taking more than 500mg at a time aren't doing yourself any favors as its been shown that the plasma saturation dose is 500mg and anymore, you're wasting it. Anything above 1g has been shown to be pro-oxidant.

If you have a ref for this I'm interested.
 
Thanks for the input guys

One of my first sources of information regarding fitness, nutrition, supps and working out was Charles Poliquin. I still like to hear what hes got to say or put out.

As you all know its challenging to stay up to date with the most current information

Poliquin, based on what Ive seen, has received some significant criticism for some of his PAST (dont know what his MOST current philosophies are) dosage recommendations:

25-50g of BCAAs intra-workout
30-45g of fish oil per day (in some cases)
3-5g of Vit C post workout
2 large doses of Vit D per week

But with time, more studies, more results come out. I'm just trying to stay on top of the data as best I can. Its fun, Im savoring the physical enhancement journey as best as I can while also optimizing myself as best I can
 
I am not sure if this is 100% proven across the board factual information. Can you provide anything to make me think this is actually set in stone? I did switch to 500mg caps and rarely take 1g at a time anymore. (I would only do this if I felt a cold coming on or if I was trying to match and cover an NAC dose.)

If you have a ref for this I'm interested.

Let me see if I can find it.
 
NAC + Vitamin C

So, am I doing it wrong taking 1000 mg NAC and 1 mg of Vitamin C. I can't seem to find a yes or no answer. I'm asthmatic, so I was thinking the extra NAC is necessary.

Anyone point me in the right direct.
 
So, am I doing it wrong taking 1000 mg NAC and 1 mg of Vitamin C. I can't seem to find a yes or no answer. I'm asthmatic, so I was thinking the extra NAC is necessary.

Anyone point me in the right direct.
No that's fine. You could probably use less C but it's not going to hurt anything.
 
No that's fine. You could probably use less C but it's not going to hurt anything.

Can you explain why you recommend using less? I'm just more interested more than anything.
 

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