Bloodwork While on my Blast

[Phidias]

Leukocytosis (increase in WBC) is a common positive acute phase reactant from exersice. I wouldn't put too much emphasis on this in particular.

:yeahthat:

OR, if RMTT wasn't indeed an athlete that just exercised, we could also suspect his high neutrophils and moncytes to be a sign of infection... just to clarify, buddy, have you felt a bit sick recently? Like a cold or something?

Anyways, if I were you I'd get my blood drawn after three or four full days of rest (not even cardio... know it's gonna be hard for you ), this way we could put an end to all those speculations about your kidneys' status...

 

[rmtt]

:yeahthat:

OR, if RMTT wasn't indeed an athlete that just exercised, we could also suspect his high neutrophils and moncytes to be a sign of infection... just to clarify, buddy, have you felt a bit sick recently? Like a cold or something?

Anyways, if I were you I'd get my blood drawn after three or four full days of rest (not even cardio... know it's gonna be hard for you ), this way we could put an end to all those speculations about your kidneys' status...

Just typical allergy issues. Other than that...I rarely ever get sick (Knock on Wood).

I am scheduled for next Monday to see my PCP. He has all my files...and I will take him a print out of this test and we can see if there is a trend anywhere.

I do know that early last year when I tore that small muscle along my ribs....they did some extensive testing on me. Started with gall bladder and then progressed from there. But I did have a CT and ultra-sound of pretty much everything in my upper torso I'm sure. Plus extensive blood tests.

My Dr. specializes in Internal Medicine. I also got my Mom and Dad in with him...so he knows a lot more about my family history than just me seeing him alone.

And I had a general physical with him last September with blood work....and at follow up he said everything was good although I didn't see specific numbers.

I've always been a healthy person in general.

But I will admit seeing that post did kind of shake me up. I see and take all the things to heart that other members on here have gone through (Maldorf, NotHuman,etc).......and I take it seriously.

But just cruising along on my TRT and then doing small "blasts" that sometimes barely amounted to what some people actually consider cruising doses....I figured I was being as safe as I possibly could while still reaping the benefits of what these drugs do for us.

Always been faithful with getting labs, making sure to keep things like BP under tabs...watching lipid values.......and then it's like am I not doing enough?

But like I said...I will keep the thread updated. If he tells me to take a week off of everything and get retested..I'm fine with that.

I just want to know that I am trying to be as responsible as I can in this game...and doing things correctly.

 

[RamboStallone]

Before you start throwing supps and junk at this, I recommend you retake bloodwork with at least 48hrs post any training. I don't know how Bun/creatinine works, but if it rises temporarily from training, then the values we are reading above are skewed.

 

[suppdude]

I’m willing to bet the BUN creatinine is elevated due to higher protein. If you drop protein, re-test, it’ll drop.

But if you’ve got a 24 hour clearance test and it came back fine, you should be fine.


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[nothuman]

Does everyone always see a higher BUN and creatinine after training? I've gotten bloods even one day after training and I've never seen an elevation in either. I know it's common though.

 

[rmtt]

Before you start throwing supps and junk at this, I recommend you retake bloodwork with at least 48hrs post any training. I don't know how Bun/creatinine works, but if it rises temporarily from training, then the values we are reading above are skewed.

I agree. Thinking about this last night....I planned out today's meals as I normally would and left protein amounts alone. Not going to change anything other than seeing how he wants to approach it.

I only want to remove one variable at a time and if getting "bloods" with no exercise time involved and being truly fasted is the first step...then it's what I will do.

You know I don't honestly remember ever having labs done under those conditions. I always figured get them done while in my routine so I can better judge what is going on. I want to be tested during the worst case scenario so I can see what is really happening.

I'm pretty sure I could fast for 2-3 days with nothing but water and see some significant changes to the results.

 

[Elvia1023]

I was in a pretty good mood waking up this morning, but unfortunately it didn't last past your post... reading you did nothing but cast a gloom over my day.

Is there really a need to be so DRAMATIC?

I mean... couldn't it just be the truth that having labs done on a stressed/ non rested/ just trained/ feed a high protein diet body can indeed lead to increased kidney markers TOO? Not denying what you're seeing on a daily basis with your patients and the actual dangers of AAS, but listening to you it's like 100% of those who've touched a ml of test once in their life will end up put on dialysis... a little bit KILLJOY...

x10

Fuck me that guy has no common sense at all. I am the last to go yeah buddy you are fine it's all part of the game. But that blood work is not bad and RMTT you are not going to be on dialysis in a few weeks :banghead:

RMTT as you already know you need to montior things and get blood work again soon following the suggestions (non trained, hydrated etc) others have posted. Then get those results and go from there always having regular blood work done to monitor any possible issues.

 

[johnjuanb1]

x10

Fuck me that guy has no common sense at all. I am the last to go yeah buddy you are fine it's all part of the game. But that blood work is not bad and RMTT you are not going to be on dialysis in a few weeks :banghead:

RMTT as you already know you need to montior things and get blood work again soon following the suggestions (non trained, hydrated etc) others have posted. Then get those results and go from there always having regular blood work done to monitor any possible issues.

Elvia is growing new kidneys off the back of a mouse in his secret laboratory.
Ears were just the beginning in Elvia’s secret experimentation. You should see the cock he grew. That mouse could barely jog on it’s treadmill lugging that big thing around.

 

[rmtt]

x10

Fuck me that guy has no common sense at all. I am the last to go yeah buddy you are fine it's all part of the game. But that blood work is not bad and RMTT you are not going to be on dialysis in a few weeks :banghead:

RMTT as you already know you need to montior things and get blood work again soon following the suggestions (non trained, hydrated etc) others have posted. Then get those results and go from there always having regular blood work done to monitor any possible issues.

I don't hold anything against him though. In his line of work...I'm sure it gets frustrating seeing this kind of stuff.

But if he knew me and what my typical dose amounts were....his response may have been different.

Just the other day I was reading about a guy who was starting his blast...and the compounds and amounts of stuff he was going to be using just boggled my mind. I was thinking to myself....man you have a lot of "hurt" coming if you keep that up.

Next thing you know...I'm the one making a thread about these issues!

 

[rmtt]

Elvia is growing new kidneys off the back of a mouse in his secret laboratory.
Ears were just the beginning in Elvia’s secret experimentation. You should see the cock he grew. That mouse could barely jog on it’s treadmill lugging that big thing around.

So that's the new experiment he's been hinting about the last couple of days.

 

[johnjuanb1]

So that's the new experiment he's been hinting about the last couple of days.

He’s going to add another cack for his girl.

 

[Elvia1023]

I don't hold anything against him though. In his line of work...I'm sure it gets frustrating seeing this kind of stuff.

But if he knew me and what my typical dose amounts were....his response may have been different.

Just the other day I was reading about a guy who was starting his blast...and the compounds and amounts of stuff he was going to be using just boggled my mind. I was thinking to myself....man you have a lot of "hurt" coming if you keep that up.

Next thing you know...I'm the one making a thread about these issues!

I am sure he means well in his posts but I have seen him post too many times like that. Everyone should be careful and monitor everything but I am sorry his post is borderline ridiculous. That post is so dramatic I had to comment. Some guys could have kidney issues on 400mg and others are fine on 2g but everyone should be monitoring things. But trying to scare people because their creatinine is slightly elevated is over the top.

I am sure your diet and training has effected your number more than the bit of primo you added. You even posted your doses but he bypassed that and started going on about abuse. Again a lack of common sense and reading comprehension which he should have considering his job. No mention of lower protein etc just it has to be the drugs. Again use common sense and drugs may come into it but don't act like you will be on dialysis soon if you don't stop your "abuse". You know what to do and I (and I imagine most on here) are sure you will be fine. If you have to lower the drugs I know you will. You are smart with this stuff and are not abusing things. You got checked mid cycle for good reason so you know what to do.

So that's the new experiment he's been hinting about the last couple of days.

I will definitely post about that very soon. Probably tomorrow now

 

[danieltx]

On daily protein intake - mine is the lowest its ever been and my physique and performance is at its best. Right now growing at ~220lbs. and get ~240 - 260 grams of protein a day. I'll even go below body weight in protein when dieting and have no issues, and I do CKD year-round.

The high amounts of protein the industry has pushed for years really aren't necessary.

 

[Flex500]

Reviewing patients blood work is something I do in the clinic daily. The creatinine level is something that goes from 1.4. to 1.5, to 1.6 to 2.0 and dialysis pretty quickly. These are the numbers my patients have before needing to be hooked to a machine 3 x a week for hours at a time. Your body is telling you to stop.

People on this site will tell you don't worry it's your training, your an athlete, or dehydration. This minimizes the issue and is denial. Repeatedly high creatinine is a huge warning sign. A study of elite, I repeat ELITE athletes showed they had a slightly higher creatinine level, but none of them were even over 1.33.

Diabetics and elderly with high blood pressure have always been the most common dialysis patients. Nowadays, anabolic steroid abusers are the fastest growing group of young people needing dialysis. The nephrologists I work with are the top in the field and all see the link between the hugh spike in drug use with the trend. It's not worth it for another inch on your bicep. The former abusers I see 3 x a week wish they never touched gear.

This is absolutely ridiculous. You always go from one extreme of “don’t worry” to dialysis talk.

Your remarks are way off base reading a one time post/bloodwork from the OP. How about a middle ground of investigate further?

I’ve had creatinine of 1.5-1.6 since I was 20 (I’m 35) You know what’s wrong with my kidneys? Nothing.

Cystatin C a constant 0.62
24 hour urine screen 100% perfect
Ultrasound perfect
Every spot urine screen also all good
Stable creatinine for 15 + years

I am Uber paranoid about health so I pay OOP each year to get these tests done because I have no medical necessity to get them done (so insurance won’t pay).

I waited to respond to your post as I had a nephrologist appt today (paid $500 OOP for him to go through my labs...all look perfect).

His response was this....

“You have to look at the entire clinical picture. Any well muscled person with perfect blood work but elevated creatinine is likely ok and you can verify that with a few extra tests. I see large men all time time with creatinine over 1.4 yet rarely over 1.7 and what I look most for is the trend over time. If the patient has an elevated creatinine with other markers off like bun, lipids, liver values, electrolytes my level of concern rises but, again, we can easily get it figured out with additional testing”.

My doc loves cystatin c. 24 hr urine is a pain but awesome. A little nugget is my nephrologist always orders c reactive protein as he said there is growing evidence that may be a secondary indicator of impending kidney issues.

My qualifications? Majored in biology, sold dialysis equipment (worked on the clinical side so had to understand all this stuff) and have been going to a neurologist for 15 years.

I will say this...my doctor told me if you pulled the general population of his patients and did creatinine on 100 of them it may somewhat align with what you are saying because they’d likely be people with actual kidney issues, other health issues, and not have a reason for higher levels like muscle mass and as mentioned they’d have other markers that are off.

Your posts are way off base and alarmist and that’s coming from a guy who has easily spent $15,000 OOP on kidney tests I don’t need because I’m paranoid.

 

[old timer]

Regarding your HDL, how many days a week do you workout with weights and do you do any cardio on those or other days? My HDL used to be mid-40's, but when I upped my cardio (even just brisk walking) my HDL increased significantly (recent bloodtest had it at 74 with a total of 207). That may have also coincided when I started eating sunflower seeds which is also known to raise HDL. Seeds in the shell are my go-to snack, because you can "eat" for a half hour and still not consume 200 calories LOL.

 

[needthepump]

I don't hold anything against him though. In his line of work...I'm sure it gets frustrating seeing this kind of stuff.

But if he knew me and what my typical dose amounts were....his response may have been different.

Just the other day I was reading about a guy who was starting his blast...and the compounds and amounts of stuff he was going to be using just boggled my mind. I was thinking to myself....man you have a lot of "hurt" coming if you keep that up.

Next thing you know...I'm the one making a thread about these issues!

When I use to work ER we would get drug overdoses all the time. It was extremely frustrating seeing people destroy their lives over and over again until ultimately dying. Shifting to dialysis I am seeing relatively younger guys destroy their bodies with performance enhancement drugs. I am trying to get the message out to people here where they could be headed. I am hated for this and that is okay. People get very defensive when their lifestyle is threatened. Even when there are many, many people on this board with heart issues and kidney issues directly linked to their drug use. There is also the fact that many posters who use to frequent this board are dead. Denial is a powerful thing.

"It can't happen to me" is the mentally......until it does. Will the big muscles matter then? Because they will be gone when reality hits you hard...if you manage to live through it. Ignore my posts at your own peril. I see the end result of the chemical warfare many on this site put their bodies through up until the day they no longer can.

Post is not directed at you op

 

[rmtt]

When I use to work ER we would get drug overdoses all the time. It was extremely frustrating seeing people destroy their lives over and over again until ultimately dying. Shifting to dialysis I am seeing relatively younger guys destroy their bodies with performance enhancement drugs. I am trying to get the message out to people here where they could be headed. I am hated for this and that is okay. People get very defensive when their lifestyle is threatened. Even when there are many, many people on this board with heart issues and kidney issues directly linked to their drug use. There is also the fact that many posters who use to frequent this board are dead. Denial is a powerful thing.

"It can't happen to me" is the mentally......until it does. Will the big muscles matter then? Because they will be gone when reality hits you hard...if you manage to live through it. Ignore my posts at your own peril. I see the end result of the chemical warfare many on this site put their bodies through up until the day they no longer can.

Post is not directed at you op

No hard feelings. Highest doses I've ever taken were just slightly above 2x the same amount as some people are scripted for TRT.

So I figured I was at least being a responsible "abuser".

But I have my appointment tomorrow....and will go over previous labs and my history.

I've said it numerous times on here....I tell my doc everything I take....always have. Figured being up front with him would make his job easier....but he is a personal friend.

I will update as I can....maybe something I can learn from such as training and eating right before labs can be misleading....or that my body can't even handle those amounts even if they seem small.

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[thethinker48]

When I use to work ER we would get drug overdoses all the time. It was extremely frustrating seeing people destroy their lives over and over again until ultimately dying. Shifting to dialysis I am seeing relatively younger guys destroy their bodies with performance enhancement drugs. I am trying to get the message out to people here where they could be headed. I am hated for this and that is okay. People get very defensive when their lifestyle is threatened. Even when there are many, many people on this board with heart issues and kidney issues directly linked to their drug use. There is also the fact that many posters who use to frequent this board are dead. Denial is a powerful thing.

"It can't happen to me" is the mentally......until it does. Will the big muscles matter then? Because they will be gone when reality hits you hard...if you manage to live through it. Ignore my posts at your own peril. I see the end result of the chemical warfare many on this site put their bodies through up until the day they no longer can.

Post is not directed at you op

You aren't hated for it bro.

It's just that not every guy with muscles has failing kidneys.

You can be jacked, and healthy if you have a brain and patience in this game.

And rmtt is probably one of the most conservative users on this board. I don't even think he runs orals or tren even sparingly. Super health oriented, 100 mgs of trt!

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[Elvia1023]

You aren't hated for it bro.

It's just that not every guy with muscles has failing kidneys.

You can be jacked, and healthy if you have a brain and patience in this game.

And rmtt is probably one of the most conservative users on this board. I don't even think he runs orals or tren even sparingly. Super health oriented, 100 mgs of trt!

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Exactly. Plus needthepump this has nothing to do with living in denial or being very defensive when the truth comes out. The truth is your post was highly dramatic and lacked any real common sense when accessing the whole situation. Bodybuilders are dying all the time mainly due to heart issues and we need to be careful with our health. But if a guy who trains hard, eats lot's of protein and is full of muscle has a slightly elevated creatinine level in one blood test let's be realistic and monitor things and take the needed steps to lower that number if it's even needed.

Of course being safe than sorry and stopping everything works but in the grand scheme it's not very realistic to do that if a few things are slightly out of range but all could be caused by training and dietary habits. Most people walk round with certain blood work markers off from time to time and that includes all non aas users as well. RMTT is super health conscious so he will drop all aas if he needs to do but not over a slightly elevated number that probably has very little to do with the tiny bit of test and primo he added onto his trt. His current training and diet probably have more to do with that number in this case. If it is aas related I am sure from his posts he will go back on trt.

 

[nothuman]

When I use to work ER we would get drug overdoses all the time. It was extremely frustrating seeing people destroy their lives over and over again until ultimately dying. Shifting to dialysis I am seeing relatively younger guys destroy their bodies with performance enhancement drugs. I am trying to get the message out to people here where they could be headed. I am hated for this and that is okay. People get very defensive when their lifestyle is threatened. Even when there are many, many people on this board with heart issues and kidney issues directly linked to their drug use. There is also the fact that many posters who use to frequent this board are dead. Denial is a powerful thing.

"It can't happen to me" is the mentally......until it does. Will the big muscles matter then? Because they will be gone when reality hits you hard...if you manage to live through it. Ignore my posts at your own peril. I see the end result of the chemical warfare many on this site put their bodies through up until the day they no longer can.

Post is not directed at you op

I know people are saying you're extreme but I value your knowledge and hope you keep posting