Bodybuilding and type 2 diabetes HELP

[mrcat]

Will apparently I've got it. The doc confirmed. Anyway, the doc was a real *** about lifting. Told me I needed to loose weight, including muscle. I told him I planned to gain at least 10 pounds muscle in the next 6 months. He started to tell me the dangers of steroids. I cut him off and said they were illegal LOL.. Anyway I'm looking for a forum or article or anthing on the net. I haven't would much so far.

Not all bad in that I think this explains why I couldn't gain weight, despite eating like a horse on my last cycle.....

 

[Fullybuilt]

How did you get it? Could it have been from insulin use? Too much HGH? Or just genetic?

 

[mrcat]

How did you get it? Could it have been from insulin use? Too much HGH? Or just genetic?

I blaim it totally on genetics. My dad got it when he was a year older than me. Others in the family have. I also tend to have had a poor, high sugar, diet. I have used HGH/Slin, but don't blaim either at all. I hope to keept using at least HGH. I am desperate for information, if anyone can point me somewhere, the doc wasn't a lot of help. I may consult with some other docs at some point...

 

[fsm]

When my son was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes I learned more about diabetes than I ever wanted to know. I also found out that both my parents had type two, so I get checked. So far so good. My son was 18 at the time he was diagnosed and pretty depressed about it, so one of the things they did to help buck him up was tell him about all the successfull people, athletes included who were diabetics. As I recall several of them were body builders. The only name that comes to mind (not from those lists) from an article in one of the muscle mags, is Mike Mentzer. I think it said that he or his brother or both of them were diabetic. You can contact the American Diabetic Society, or google diabetic bodybuilders. Type two is largely controllable by diet and excercise (up to a point) so there is hope.

FSM

 

[BigBoyJ]

I actually have a client at work who is working on her masters degree. She proposed a research study on the effects of hypertrophic weight training and maintenance of blood glucose levels. The proposal was picked up and research is currently under way. I have also researched this topic thoroughly and used my diabetic clients as guinee pigs. I am being used as a reference in her study. So far, here's what the two of us have gathered. Increases in muscle fiber stimulation and muscular hypertrophy have helped in stabilizing blood sugar levels. The more muscle mass you have, of course, the more blood sugar you use. The heavier weight you lift, the more fibers you stimulate, so the more blood sugar you use. It is possible for a surge of stored liver glycogen to raise blood sugar levels during exercise, so blood sugar levels should be checked before and after exercise. Juice, or something sugary should be kept close by in case of hypoglycemia and insulin should be kept nearby in case of hyperglycemia. In most cases though, after a period of time, through proper diet (VERY IMPORTANT) and exercise (yes, even heavy weight training) blood glucose levels can be very well maintained and the use of drugs to control blood glucose can often be avoided. Honestly, I don't really think you'll find a doctor who knows the effects of an overly muscular physique on diabetes symptoms. But, in my experience, being muscular is a good thing, not bad for diabetes. Fat weight will affect the symptoms much differently than muscle weight. All I can do is say, experiment carefully and see what's best for you.

 

[Snarf]

I think most endocrinologists would agree that exercise, including weight training is beneficial to maintaining strady blood sugar levels.

Also, I would think that the additional muscle mass most of us carry would also be helpful. The glycogen stores act as a sugar resevoir that the body can draw on when needed.

I am not sure hGH is a good idea to conitnue to use but it may be manageable.

 

[cryptasm]

Will apparently I've got it. The doc confirmed. Anyway, the doc was a real *** about lifting. Told me I needed to loose weight, including muscle. I told him I planned to gain at least 10 pounds muscle in the next 6 months. He started to tell me the dangers of steroids. I cut him off and said they were illegal LOL.. Anyway I'm looking for a forum or article or anthing on the net. I haven't would much so far.

Not all bad in that I think this explains why I couldn't gain weight, despite eating like a horse on my last cycle.....

Suck's that you got it but, its not the end of the world..If you learn to controll your blood sugar by eating less refined carbs, and using insulin corectly..It could make alot of things better for you..So the first thing to do is not listen to that Doctor!!! get yer insulin and find out the real way you should eat and use the slin...you don't eat a bunch of carbs and then use the slin to compensate...you learn thru trial and error what foods make your blood sugar go up and how much...85-100 is the best range...Dr.s will telll you like up to 120 or so is good but its not!! Eat correctly and you wont have any bad side effects ..but if you dont learne the correct way to eat (for you) based on eating and taking a blood sugar test to see how high the food raised you so you know ahead of time that if you eat an apple with some natural penut butter its going to raise blood sugar by 20 points and your already at 100 then you either eat no carbs just protein and fat or eat the carb and take some slin..here's a good website for you to start your process..
http://www.rajeun.net
A few thing there to start with are
1. My First Fifty Years As a Diabetic, by Dr. Richard K. Bernstein
2. The Amazingly Useful Carbohydrate Thermometer
3. The Anti-Diabetic Anti-Aging Diet:
4. The Glucose Theory of Aging

theres a ton of info there that will help you..
My Mom is type 2, and the shit her Dr. tells her she can eat is a fuckin joke...so she listens to them and takes her metformin and eats all these bad carbs that her Dr. and Dietician at the office tell her she can eat and always wonders why she can't get her sugar steady...I tell her how she can do it and that her Dr. don't know shit about nutrition but she chooses not to listen.. So for you "learn what works for you and do it" as long as you keep your blood sugar in check you'll live a Long ...Healthy..Muscular Life!!!
Good luck Mrcat, lemme know how you do..ok??\

 

[mrcat]

Thanks everyone...So far I'm doing OK. Bloodsugar isn't stabel, but at least the symptoms are way way down. I eliminated soda and candy from my diet, but it still needs work, as sugar seems to be in a lot of stuff...

I had though muscle wasn't bad also. In fact, my dads doctor told him that. Anyway, I will consult another doc, as I really think this one thought I was on juice and just wasn't going to help me with anything. I'm not really very big, only about 210 at 5"9. Coleman would likely give the guy a heart attach LOL...

cryptasm, thanks much for the link, lots of stuff I need to read there....

 

[manboy270]

Mrcat-if you don't mind me asking, what were your symptoms? My dad is diabetic too BTW.

 

[terryd5150]

Big A, would glucophage (Metformin) help with type II diabetes? I know you have made mention of the two before but I can't remember exactly what it was.

 

[mrcat]

Mrcat-if you don't mind me asking, what were your symptoms? My dad is diabetic too BTW.

The symptoms I didn't really connect to diabetes until I had a blood sugar test at 286. I had excessive bathroom visits, thirst, hunger. But damn, those are generic. I knew they were symptoms of diabetes, but they are also easily pined to other stuff until you get a blood sugar reading. I was always like well of course I was thirsty, I worked out and sweated. Bathroom visits I just figure protein drinks. Hunger, well I figured the more I ate the more I grew.

If you have ANY question, get a blood sugar test. Your dad likely has a meter you could use.

Metformin is good. I probably will increase my intake of it. For me and most type 2s they also need a drug that increases insulin release (sorry I'm at work and forget the name of it...)..

 

[manboy270]

Thanks for the info man.

 

[Ethan James]

Big A, would glucophage (Metformin) help with type II diabetes? I know you have made mention of the two before but I can't remember exactly what it was.

Type II diabetes is actually what Glucophage is made for. In a Type II diabetic the pancreas does not produce enough insulin to effectively use blood sugar for energy. Glucophage makes the body more sensitive to insulin so that only smaller amounts are needed.

Maybe someone can answer my question. If someone had a lot of fat storage from a high sugar / simple carb diet would glucophage help them lose the weight? In effect making the body produce less insulin to deal with carbohydrate intake? Maybe my gansta homeboy BBJ can answer that...

 

[KillerStack]

mrcat, how old are you? Sometimes type 2 diabetes can be reversed by losing weight etc but you don't sound fat at 210lbs. Did I read you correctly, you also weren't on any steroids at the moment? Some steroids can cause resistance, some can help glucose disposal (nandrolone).

 

[cryptasm]

type II means you pancrease is burning out, or you are insulin resistant...either way the pancrease cannot do its job...If you are insulin resistant you are typically hyperinsulemic, cause the pancrese keeps pumping isulin becuase it is still seeing high sugar levels...Either way if it were me I would go on the right diet and use insulin instead of metformin/glocophage it hard on the liver and in the end you will need insulin anyway..so why noot give your pancrease a break and never become a diabetic...use insulin now and learn how to keep you blood sugar stable at 85-90 and never have to deal with diabetic issues..Using insulin on a daily basis isnt the bad part of diabetes, it the disease progression of unmanaged sugar ( that the dr's could easily resove by learning and teaching the correct way to eat) which they don't know but are too pompus to admit that they don't know..also The AMA which also dosen't know has guidlines for diabetic nutrition, so even if its wrong which it is...the Dr. will spout off this AMA approved dietary guidlines and if someone dies hhes not responsible because he followed the approved giudlines...But God forbid a Dr. give you good dietary advice that is not AMA approved, he could go to jail..even if its the best nutional advice in the world ..if it snot approved ny the AMA he could be in a world of shit..What do think matters more to him??? You or his practice, income and freedom???
I wouldt bother w/ the pills shoot for the Insulin its better for you...

 

[KillerStack]

type II means you pancrease is burning out, or you are insulin resistant...either way the pancrease cannot do its job...If you are insulin resistant you are typically hyperinsulemic, cause the pancrese keeps pumping isulin becuase it is still seeing high sugar levels...Either way if it were me I would go on the right diet and use insulin instead of metformin/glocophage it hard on the liver and in the end you will need insulin anyway..so why noot give your pancrease a break and never become a diabetic...use insulin now and learn how to keep you blood sugar stable at 85-90 and never have to deal with diabetic issues..Using insulin on a daily basis isnt the bad part of diabetes, it the disease progression of unmanaged sugar ( that the dr's could easily resove by learning and teaching the correct way to eat) which they don't know but are too pompus to admit that they don't know..also The AMA which also dosen't know has guidlines for diabetic nutrition, so even if its wrong which it is...the Dr. will spout off this AMA approved dietary guidlines and if someone dies hhes not responsible because he followed the approved giudlines...But God forbid a Dr. give you good dietary advice that is not AMA approved, he could go to jail..even if its the best nutional advice in the world ..if it snot approved ny the AMA he could be in a world of shit..What do think matters more to him??? You or his practice, income and freedom???
I wouldt bother w/ the pills shoot for the Insulin its better for you...

Yeah I have read that docs are putting more newly diagnosed type 2s on insulin right away nowadays to avoid organ damage etc. Sometimes they are able to drop the insulin once they have lost weight.

 

[mrcat]

mrcat, how old are you? Sometimes type 2 diabetes can be reversed by losing weight etc but you don't sound fat at 210lbs. Did I read you correctly, you also weren't on any steroids at the moment? Some steroids can cause resistance, some can help glucose disposal (nandrolone).

I'm 41. At the time of the first test, I was on 45mg var for a couple months. By the time I went to a doc I was off var around a week. I tested lower, but still too high. I had eliminated soda at that point. I'm around 15% body fat. I seem to carry most my fat in the midsection, a lot under my abs, organ fat I think its called. I'm not sure if this is associated with type 2 or just the way it is. My dad is thinner than me, but w/o much muscle. So maybe there is something about the gentics that don't require a ton of fat for me/him.

cryptasm, I'm going to read more on the link and consider slin. I have used it in the past, w/o monitoring, and actually felt better than normal....

 

[KillerStack]

I seem to carry most my fat in the midsection, a lot under my abs, organ fat I think its called. I'm not sure if this is associated with type 2 or just the way it is.

It's called visceral fat and is definitely associated with insulin resistance, "syndrome X", and type 2 diabetes.

 

[MikeS]

First off AAS should have no impact on your condition. Your diet is big. Being a weight training athlete, Im suprised your diet is so poor and high in sugar. You need to fix that. Wont getting on insulin further lower your insulin sensitivity? Id imagine it would. Glucophage is for Type II, as a better alternative to insulin which I always though was a last resort and after you start that the condition becomes basically irreversable. With improved diet, exercise, and gluco, maybe you could manage you condition and hopefully go medicine free in time. The gh is a no. It lowers insulin sensitivity-you can actually feel it sometimes. IGF1! Try that! In fact it may be possible to use that instead of gluco. Just a thought, nothing Ive ever heard before, but it could have the potential, by raising insulin sensitivity.

Crypt you seem to know alot about this. Are you TypeII?

 

[KillerStack]

First off AAS should have no impact on your condition. Your diet is big. Being a weight training athlete, Im suprised your diet is so poor and high in sugar. You need to fix that. Wont getting on insulin further lower your insulin sensitivity? Id imagine it would. Glucophage is for Type II, as a better alternative to insulin which I always though was a last resort and after you start that the condition becomes basically irreversable. With improved diet, exercise, and gluco, maybe you could manage you condition and hopefully go medicine free in time. The gh is a no. It lowers insulin sensitivity-you can actually feel it sometimes. IGF1! Try that! In fact it may be possible to use that instead of gluco. Just a thought, nothing Ive ever heard before, but it could have the potential, by raising insulin sensitivity.

Crypt you seem to know alot about this. Are you TypeII?

I have to disagree with steroids not possibly affecting the condition. I remember something about dianabol and winstrol specifically causing resistance. Nandrolone increased glucose disposal. Let me see if I can dig up some of those studies. I have a friend who is type 1 diabetic and testosterone and dbol both increased his insulin requirements.

Regarding the insulin, it will quickly bring BG under control (obviously). It's the high blood sugar that damages the pancreas and other organs so if a patient comes in with a high BG insulin will stop further damage quicker. Insulin itself is not toxic.