Building Big legs with Bad knees

[Brock456]

Sleeves and wraps are totally different.

Sleeves are for small amount of support. Wraps come from powerlifting and are to help you lift more weight. Sleeves are slid on over the lower leg; wraps are literally wrapped around the leg from below to above the kneecap. With wraps on you can't bend your knees until you're using substantial weight.


What evidence do you have?

I've used wraps every week for 10 years - never had any knee pain and I have one of the best sets of legs on here.

Which ones are better for knee pain? Sleeves or wraps?

 

[strongsafety41]

My apologies if I missed it…. But if you haven’t tried PT why not give it a go? You can go long enough to learn the techniques/exercises and then drop PT if you like. You can continue the routine on your own.

 

[danieltx]

Which ones are better for knee pain? Sleeves or wraps?

Knee sleeves.

But really you shouldn't be doing movements that cause pain, period. Not with light weights not with sleeves, nothing. @TheOtherOne55 nailed it in his post. Thinking you're tough and pushing through on sets is just damaging it more. You really should take his advice and lay off quads for a while, hit it with BPC, etc.

Will you have a great home if you build it on a damaged foundation? No. And you'll never have great legs if you try to build them on damaged infrastructure.

 

[Doitagain]

What evidence do you have?

I've used wraps every week for 10 years - never had any knee pain and I have one of the best sets of legs on here.

Post #17

 

[RepZZ]

My knees suck and found belt squats to be amazing. Give them a try...

 

[TheOtherOne55]

Post #17

Correct me if I’m wrong @danieltx
You don’t back squat anymore do you?
If I’m correct then post 17 is irrelevant to this discussion.

 

[Doitagain]

Correct me if I’m wrong @danieltx
You don’t back squat anymore do you?
If I’m correct then post 17 is irrelevant to this discussion.

The increased mechanical output + altered technique compromises the integrity of the knee joint when doing the back squat for sure. It may or may not in other compound leg exercises. Probably not with machines, probably yes with free weights movements.

 

[Brock456]

If someone had debilitating elbow tendinitis and couldn’t bench…I’d tell them to hit some hard sets of flies and fix that damn elbow. This exact same thing happened to me and I had to lay off pressing for 3-4 weeks. But for whatever reason, everyone is giving tips on cool exercises that stillll fuck your knees lol

Stop doing any knee flexion/extension exercises for a month. Blast those knees hard and heavy with BPC. Stick to hamstrings only (99% of guys have lacking hamstrings) and wait it out. Finding a new different exercise isn’t going to solve your problem. Fix your knees.

I see what you’re saying brother and you have helped me so many times. But I’ve been working around this injury by only doing hamstrings for so long.

I’ve read mixed reviews on BPC. Guys say as soon as you stop using it, the pain comes back.

 

[goback2013]

I see what you’re saying brother and you have helped me so many times. But I’ve been working around this injury by only doing hamstrings for so long.

I’ve read mixed reviews on BPC. Guys say as soon as you stop using it, the pain comes back.

Couple weeks ago I hurt my knee playing basketball. Could barely walk.
I picked a box of tb and bpc. For the last couple weeks I've been shooting 3 vials a week of each.
While me knee is still janky I can run on pavement with no problems. Been running on the sidewalk and road every day this week.
The only thing that messes me up is when I have to do a lunge in boxing cardio class(shit is a killer.. but love it)

 

[TheOtherOne55]

I see what you’re saying brother and you have helped me so many times. But I’ve been working around this injury by only doing hamstrings for so long.

I’ve read mixed reviews on BPC. Guys say as soon as you stop using it, the pain comes back.

Don’t trust any of those reviews.
TB and BPC are not pain masking peptides, they are for healing. Both have several studies showing this. Type either one in pubmed. Every serious BBer and PLer I know has BPC in their bag of tricks for those annoying nagging injuries.

 

[blackjack]

Don’t trust any of those reviews.
TB and BPC are not pain masking peptides, they are for healing. Both have several studies showing this. Type either one in pubmed. Every serious BBer and PLer I know has BPC in their bag of tricks for those annoying nagging injuries.

I'll second this. BPC eliminated a nagging hammy I had struggled with for over a year. Coming off it didn't come back. Way too many people on this forum read one user anecdote from someone who has a 1000 posts and think it's gospel.

 

[danieltx]

Correct me if I’m wrong @danieltx
You don’t back squat anymore do you?
If I’m correct then post 17 is irrelevant to this discussion.

The increased mechanical output + altered technique compromises the integrity of the knee joint when doing the back squat for sure. It may or may not in other compound leg exercises. Probably not with machines, probably yes with free weights movements.

I haven't back squatted in many years. I did for a long time and it did nothing for leg hypertrophy. I truly believe back squats are one of the worst exercises for hypertrophy for most guys, particularly those with long legs.

All I've done for years is Hack squat machines. But I can still stay for certain that when I back squatted with knee wraps I had no knee issues.

 

[gauge22-v2]

Try TKEs out

 

[5Noles]

What evidence do you have?

I've used wraps every week for 10 years - never had any knee pain and I have one of the best sets of legs on here.

First, you definitely have some of the best quads on PMF.
Second, I also did heavy barbell squats for many years with zero knee issues.
I really don’t have a strong opinion about knee wraps. I switched from knee wraps to sleeves after reading several articles like the one below.


A recent study in The Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research found that squatting in knee wraps leads to a nearly 20 percent decline in quad muscle activation. That’s because the wraps essentially “take over,” doing the job of your quads.

That decrease in muscle activation actually makes your workout less effective from a muscle growth and fat loss standpoint, says Kechijian.

“You should also generally train in a way that’s specific to your sport,” says Kechijian. “You’d never wear knee wraps out on the court, course, or field. So why train in them?”

In fact, habitual use of them could even set you up for injury.

“Wearing wraps all the time could potentially cause you to lose some of the stability you’d normally have in your knee,” he says. “Then when you don’t wear the wraps and do something athletic, that knee stability isn’t there and you could get injured.”

(Learn The Secrets to the Perfect Squatto avoid injury and build more muscle.)

So unless you’re training for a weightlifting competition, don’t use wraps. Even if you are training for a competition, make sure to cycle in some squats where you don’t use them, to help maintain stability in your knee joint.

 

[danieltx]

First, you definitely have some of the best quads on PMF.
Second, I also did heavy barbell squats for many years with zero knee issues.
I really don’t have a strong opinion about knee wraps. I switched from knee wraps to sleeves after reading several articles like the one below.


A recent study in The Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research found that squatting in knee wraps leads to a nearly 20 percent decline in quad muscle activation. That’s because the wraps essentially “take over,” doing the job of your quads.

That decrease in muscle activation actually makes your workout less effective from a muscle growth and fat loss standpoint, says Kechijian.

“You should also generally train in a way that’s specific to your sport,” says Kechijian. “You’d never wear knee wraps out on the court, course, or field. So why train in them?”

In fact, habitual use of them could even set you up for injury.

“Wearing wraps all the time could potentially cause you to lose some of the stability you’d normally have in your knee,” he says. “Then when you don’t wear the wraps and do something athletic, that knee stability isn’t there and you could get injured.”

(Learn The Secrets to the Perfect Squatto avoid injury and build more muscle.)

So unless you’re training for a weightlifting competition, don’t use wraps. Even if you are training for a competition, make sure to cycle in some squats where you don’t use them, to help maintain stability in your knee joint.

I'm not an anti-science guy - it definitely has its place in bodybuilding and can lead to good insights. But my real-world experience shows the science here is not the case for everyone. I mean seriously, would I have legs like Tom Platz if I didn't use knee wraps? Very doubtful.

I'd venture that most guys lose quad activation when using knee wraps because they use it to ego lift - they throw on a bunch more weight than they can normally handle and drop down quick to get a rebound from the bottom. That is not how you train for bodybuilding. Training for bodybuilding is about slow, controlled movements that put maximum tension on the muscle. That's how I train my legs and why they're so good. Most of this board couldn't hang with me training legs and I don't mean that in the sense of weights used, I mean it in the sense of training intensity and taxing the muscle.

Many guys are going to read that science swear off knee wraps because science says so. That's now how you become a great bodybuilder. You become a great bodybuilder by testing things out for yourself because we're all different - nothing works exactly the same in each of us.

Again, for the record - I've used knee wraps on my heavy sets of Hack squats and leg press every single week for 6+ years. I have great quads and have never had any injury in the leg or knee. I'm proof knee wraps do not hinder development for everyone. Try it yourself and see how it works for you.

 

[Golden]

I wrap my knees firmly, I like the added support that they give over knee sleeves but I don’t wrap so tight I cut the blood off!

Years ago when squatting heavy, a power lifter from our gym offered to wrap my knees to show me how they do it. He stretched the life out of the wraps as he was wrapping my knees, seemed like he got many extra wraps around my knees. By the time he was finished, I had literally no way of bending my knees whilst walking to the bar, infact my knees wouldn’t allow me to squat deep until I had around 315 on the bar! Lol

 

[5Noles]

I think I’ll add knee wraps to my heavy leg day.

Danieltx just curious, do use use knee wraps for knee protection? Or like wrist wraps do you believe knee wraps cause greater hypertrophy?

 

[Love_to_Bodybuild]

Lots of volume, including reps. I do Ieg at a time on leg extensions, pyramiding up in weight, getting killer pump I. Quads , after a few sets, where ,at the time, the burn in quads , has me walking different.

Sissy squats are killer. I use a trx band on them, to pull myself up.

Cable squats are good, gets breathing heavy. I superset quads and hams so I go back and forth.

 

[danieltx]

I think I’ll add knee wraps to my heavy leg day.

Danieltx just curious, do use use knee wraps for knee protection? Or like wrist wraps do you believe knee wraps cause greater hypertrophy?

Both.

I wrap tight like a powerlifter so it's definitely protective. And if you'll do slow, controlled movements with them - just like you'd do without wraps - you can get great hypertrophy benefit since it's helping you lift a bi more. Wraps aren't an excuse to go as heavy as possible, drop down in the blink of an eye, and rebound up. They're a tool to put more stress on the muscle through the same lifting tempo you always use.

 

[gavinroster]

Is there a big legs with bad back thread?? I had a lumbar fusion and I can’t lift shit anymore with being stove up for days