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Can you make good size gains off 250-350 mg test per week?

7asssa7

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Can you get decently big on 250mg-350mg test per week with a good diet and training. I am thinking of a 12 week test only cycle at such a moderate dosage to avoid using AI and minimising side effects. Do you think you can make good gains on such dose?
 

musclemoose

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50% of the guys at my gym are on trt dosages of 200-300mg a week. Im in florida so its quite common down here since their is a wellness center in every town. if they are making gains i dont see it. they look exactly like they did 5 years ago. some even worse. it's all up to you and your diet and your training. normally im at no less than 500-600mg per week year round. only time i lower it down to 150-200mg is when i add eq (i go 600-800mg eq with low dose test). Eq gains are quite similar to test without the water retention. so spring and summer months when im leaning down high eq and low test works for me. There is actually a very good widely published study out there that showed 600mg test was better at burning fat and building muscle (and no difference in side effects) than 400 and 200 mg test per week. That study is why i run 600mg year round (when im not doing my spring/summer eq stack).
 
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nothuman

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If this is your first cycle, yes

If you are Jay Cutler, no
 

brutus69

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look up the study where they gave normal men varying doses of test.
the 300 and 600mg a week groups gained the most.
the 300 a week gained an average of 19 pounds of fat free mass if my memory serves.
thats doing no training at all.
in fact, they gained more muscle mass in that 20 week study than natty lifters did training during that time,
so if u cant get gains on 250-300 a week, u are doing something wrong.
 

Bio

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Can you get decently big on 250mg-350mg test per week with a good diet and training. I am thinking of a 12 week test only cycle at such a moderate dosage to avoid using AI and minimising side effects. Do you think you can make good gains on such dose?
Define "decently big."
 

[email protected]

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look up the study where they gave normal men varying doses of test.
the 300 and 600mg a week groups gained the most.
the 300 a week gained an average of 19 pounds of fat free mass if my memory serves.
thats doing no training at all.
in fact, they gained more muscle mass in that 20 week study than natty lifters did training during that time,
so if u cant get gains on 250-300 a week, u are doing something wrong.
most ppl forget that even a "low" TRT (lets say a lvl of 500) will yield to better results than a natty lifter will have.
You have a steady level or your hormone, no matter if life is stressful, you have low sleep ...
it is way suprerior to being natty in all bodybuilding aspects.
(for me it is tremendous because i had very low test lvls prior to starting my gel TRT, it is night and day in energy department, nutrition partioning, fat loss in my current cutting phase compared to the past etc etc)
 

NEMSZ

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50% of the guys at my gym are on trt dosages of 200-300mg a week. Im in florida so its quite common down here since their is a wellness center in every town. if they are making gains i dont see it. they look exactly like they did 5 years ago. some even worse. it's all up to you and your diet and your training. normally im at no less than 500-600mg per week year round. only time i lower it down to 150-200mg is when i add eq (i go 600-800mg eq with low dose test). Eq gains are quite similar to test without the water retention. so spring and summer months when im leaning down high eq and low test works for me. There is actually a very good widely published study out there that showed 600mg test was better at burning fat and building muscle (and no difference in side effects) than 400 and 200 mg test per week. That study is why i run 600mg year round (when im not doing my spring/summer eq stack).
I don’t know what part of FL you’re in but I’m in south FL and I can tell you I know people who are not only on TRT but GRAMS of gear and they look like shit and don’t ever make progress etc... As well as I know guys on TRT who look phenomenal...

But the guys who are taking loads of shit or anything at all and not getting results usually fall into the category of people who are constantly partying/drinking and doing drugs 5x a week etc... This place is such a shit show... I can think of so many people off the top of my head that I know personally who are on gear and do that, I even know people who aren’t on gear and who have respectable careers (nurses, doctors, lawyers etc) who drink and do blow like they’re in “Wolf of Wall Street.” Lol

Shit, we’re still one of the few places where they script you Opiods like candy for no reason at all... lol
 

musclemoose

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I don’t know what part of FL you’re in but I’m in south FL and I can tell you I know people who are not only on TRT but GRAMS of gear and they look like shit and don’t ever make progress etc... As well as I know guys on TRT who look phenomenal...

But the guys who are taking loads of shit or anything at all and not getting results usually fall into the category of people who are constantly partying/drinking and doing drugs 5x a week etc... This place is such a shit show... I can think of so many people off the top of my head that I know personally who are on gear and do that, I even know people who aren’t on gear and who have respectable careers (nurses, doctors, lawyers etc) who drink and do blow like they’re in “Wolf of Wall Street.” Lol

Shit, we’re still one of the few places where they script you Opiods like candy for no reason at all... lol
maybe those guys were using underdosed gear. have you seen the test results on anasci? big difference if you are taking underdosed crap where some dont even have what the bottles says it contains. Then these guys taking 1g a week are eating like a pig thinking they will grow and burn fat and turn into slobs. lots of factors play into this. if you take a gram of gear a week (real properly dosed gear) and train 5 days a week you will grow. if not its the gear. i ate like shit when i was younger, partied like a rock start and took grams a week of gear and a was a ripped beast (when it was alot harder to buy fake UG gear. everything was EU and US Pharma back then). and my boys were the same way and looked just as good as i did. eat that same way with no gear (or underdosed fake bunk garbage), go train 4-5 days a week and watch how quickly you look like pile of dog poo. i guarantee 70% of the guys on gear are taking underdosed product and/or its not really what the label says it is. anasci has clearly proven that.
 
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NEMSZ

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maybe those guys were using underdosed gear. have you seen the test results on anasci? big difference if you are taking underdosed crap where some dont even have what the bottles says it contains. Then these guys taking 1g a week are eating like a pig thinking they will grow and burn fat and turn into slobs. lots of factors play into this. if you take a gram of gear a week (real properly dosed gear) and train 5 days a week you will grow. if not its the gear. i ate like shit when i was younger, partied like a rock start and took grams a week of gear and a was a ripped beast (when it was alot harder to buy fake UG gear. everything was EU and US Pharma back then). and my boys were the same way and looked just as good as i did. eat that same way with no gear (or underdosed fake bunk garbage), go train 4-5 days a week and watch how quickly you look like pile of dog poo. i guarantee 70% of the guys on gear are taking underdosed product and/or its not really what the label says it is. anasci has clearly proven that.
I agree with that 100% but there’s also extremes, and majority of people here are extreme.. I’m not sure how you partied or how old you are but being in my late 20’s and just getting out of that whole scene myself about a year and a half ago there’s not much time for eating good or training 5x a week when you party all the time... Down here we have 24 hour clubs and the earliest some places close is 5am even on weeknights... Doing blow till 8am 5x a week or going on a 3 day binge (staying up 3 days straight doing drugs) doesn’t really leave a whole lot of room for proper nutrition let alone training... Gear doesn’t make up for all that, I don’t care who you are or what you’re taking...

People will literally go to the gym 1-2x a week and train like school girls blasting gear but then go out and stay up til 7am partying and go straight to work and do coke all day to function etc etc...

I can only think of maybe, MAYBE a handful of guys who party some but they make their food and gym a #1 priority...

Like right now is spring break down here/March madness/WMC week/Ultra etc so it’s a fucking show.. It’s a “Fuck you me first” and “Party all day” city.. Literally, 24/7 365 you can party here.. On Christmas, thanksgiving, you name it, there’s an event going on..
 

xpoc

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look up the study where they gave normal men varying doses of test.
the 300 and 600mg a week groups gained the most.
the 300 a week gained an average of 19 pounds of fat free mass if my memory serves.
thats doing no training at all.
in fact, they gained more muscle mass in that 20 week study than natty lifters did training during that time,
so if u cant get gains on 250-300 a week, u are doing something wrong.
I cant find this study, but it sounds interesting. Any idea of where it can be located?
 

xpoc

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Can someone decipher the following from the study:

"Changes in leg press strength, leg power, thigh and quadriceps muscle volumes, hemoglobin, and IGF-I were positively correlated with testosterone concentrations, whereas changes in fat mass and plasma high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol were negatively correlated."

Does positively correlated mean, it had a positive impact (good impact), whereas negatively correlated mean it had a bad impact?

Or does positively correlated mean it had an impact (either good OR bad), and negatively correlated mean it did not have any impact whatsoever?
 

danieltx

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Can someone decipher the following from the study:

"Changes in leg press strength, leg power, thigh and quadriceps muscle volumes, hemoglobin, and IGF-I were positively correlated with testosterone concentrations, whereas changes in fat mass and plasma high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol were negatively correlated."

Does positively correlated mean, it had a positive impact (good impact), whereas negatively correlated mean it had a bad impact?

Or does positively correlated mean it had an impact (either good OR bad), and negatively correlated mean it did not have any impact whatsoever?
Positively correlated = they went up

Negatively correlated = they went down

The people got stronger on the leg press, their quad muscle volume increased, they lost body fat, and their HDL went down.
 

xpoc

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Positively correlated = they went up

Negatively correlated = they went down

The people got stronger on the leg press, their quad muscle volume increased, they lost body fat, and their HDL went down.
Got it. Thanks. So bascially more test is good... except for lowering HDL which is bad and raising hemoglobin which could be bad. Thanks again.
 

fitzchivalry

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Fat free mass does include water weight as well is my understanding so I would take that into account with that study.

Regardless, as others have posted 300mg is a good dose. Just really depends on what size/look you are going for.
 

Cito33189

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you can make gains naturally if you really wanted to
 

TheOtherOne55

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If this is your first cycle, yes

If you are Jay Cutler, no
Nothuman hit it on the head.
If this is your 4th cycle, probably not going to make amazing gains.
If this is your 1st, have fun and get big.

The less gear you take, the MORE your nutrition and training need to be dialllleeedddd in. Dante talks about it when he discusses going low dose for offseason....food and weights should be your progression and then when you DO add in some chemicals, you can explode.
 

musclemoose

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I agree with that 100% but there’s also extremes, and majority of people here are extreme.. I’m not sure how you partied or how old you are but being in my late 20’s and just getting out of that whole scene myself about a year and a half ago there’s not much time for eating good or training 5x a week when you party all the time... Down here we have 24 hour clubs and the earliest some places close is 5am even on weeknights... Doing blow till 8am 5x a week or going on a 3 day binge (staying up 3 days straight doing drugs) doesn’t really leave a whole lot of room for proper nutrition let alone training... Gear doesn’t make up for all that, I don’t care who you are or what you’re taking...

People will literally go to the gym 1-2x a week and train like school girls blasting gear but then go out and stay up til 7am partying and go straight to work and do coke all day to function etc etc...

I can only think of maybe, MAYBE a handful of guys who party some but they make their food and gym a #1 priority...

Like right now is spring break down here/March madness/WMC week/Ultra etc so it’s a fucking show.. It’s a “Fuck you me first” and “Party all day” city.. Literally, 24/7 365 you can party here.. On Christmas, thanksgiving, you name it, there’s an event going on..
Yes i lived in miami for 8 years. I know the scene. lots of guys go from big and ripped to fat and soft real quick. i was never like that. i worked 5 days a week. worked out even harder those 5 days and then weekends was pool parties, nightclubs and afterhours with a power nap somewhere in between. work hard party harder. but weeknights and weekdays i would not do. m-f was for normality.
 

Delt123

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Fat free mass does include water weight as well is my understanding so I would take that into account with that study.

Regardless, as others have posted 300mg is a good dose. Just really depends on what size/look you are going for.
Iirc they checked the waterretention with a deuteriumthinningsanalyser (apparently that's what they use to check it) and found no waterretention, or at least not significant.
 

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