Carb cycling for fat loss - constant insulin use on medium and high days?

[Unluckyscience]

Right. Okay when you are in a caloric deficit for long enough you become glycogen depleted regardless of the amount of carbs you're consuming that's why carb cycling works well.
You will deplete muscle and liver stores. Glycogen is the bodies preferred energy source. It will use glycogen first. Then it will start converting amino acids to use as glycogen. This happens because in a deficit you're not storing energy.

You don't think people on keto can train hard?

They can because amino acids and fats can be converted to glucose to replenish glycogen. There is always a balance. It’s impossible to have zero of something in your body.
When you eat carbs you secret insulin. The insulin shuttles the glucose through all of the cells. Liver cells too where it is then converted to glycogen but far less than on a normal diet. All i am saying is that you never run out of glycogen.

 

[Unluckyscience]

Also when you excersie for a long time or at a high intensity, your body uses more glycogen and switches over to anaerobic metabolism which increases the levels of lactate. The lactate itself is converted back to glycogen in the liver after exercise and even without any carbs digested after the workout

 

[intensevolume1]

They can because amino acids and fats can be converted to glucose to replenish glycogen. There is always a balance. It’s impossible to have zero of something in your body.
When you eat carbs you secret insulin. The insulin shuttles the glucose through all of the cells. Liver cells too where it is then converted to glycogen but far less than on a normal diet. All i am saying is that you never run out of glycogen.

I never said you could run out of glycogen just that you're not really storing it in a deficit. I even posted that it would use aminoacids through gluconeogenisis.
If you were storing in a deficit then on low to no carbs there would be no need for the amino acid conversion. It's converting for the body to use

 

[bbxtreme]

I never said you could run out of glycogen just that you're not really storing it in a deficit. I even posted that it would use aminoacids through gluconeogenisis.
If you were storing in a deficit then on low to no carbs there would be no need for the amino acid conversion

So if you’re in a deficit and have bodyfat to lose and you’re eating enough protein, low fat and low carb you don’t believe the body will store any of that glycogen in the liver or tissues…

If this is the case how in the world would we ever lose the bodyfat. When does that get burned as “energy”. And when that’s taking place where do you think the glycogen is at…

I get what you’re trying to say (I think), but you’re losing the tree in the forest here IMO. The body will always store glycogen and find ways to do so. The amount may vary depending on upon how much you’re eating and your bodyfat, exercise expenditure etc.

That’s all I’ve got today as my body’s glycogen stores are very low as I’m cutting, but they’re not depleted.

 

[Fleezy]

That’s all I’ve got today as my body’s glycogen stores are very low as I’m cutting, but they’re not depleted.

What your macros look like rn?

 

[bbxtreme]

What your macros look like rn?

On a low day 350g protein / 120g carbs/ 20g fat- rough estimates. For someone like me with my metabolism that’s low. Especially at 60 min of cardio and 80mg of clen which we had to back off this week.

 

[b-boy]

Your body can’t store glycogen in a deficit. How does that not make sense? lol

First thing that pops up in a Google search .... "can you store glycogen in a calorie deficit"?

 

[juggy38]

Huh? glycogen can’t stored in a deficit?

The only instance I can think of this happening in human physiology is a type 1 diabetic.

Guss what happens?!! They fucking die in a few days

I’ve never seen someone really fat die of starvation, so I think our understanding of metabolism and physiology needs a tune up

 

[b-boy]

So if you’re in a deficit and have bodyfat to lose and you’re eating enough protein, low fat and low carb you don’t believe the body will store any of that glycogen in the liver or tissues…

If this is the case how in the world would we ever lose the bodyfat. When does that get burned as “energy”. And when that’s taking place where do you think the glycogen is at…

I get what you’re trying to say (I think), but you’re losing the tree in the forest here IMO. The body will always store glycogen and find ways to do so. The amount may vary depending on upon how much you’re eating and your bodyfat, exercise expenditure etc.

That’s all I’ve got today as my body’s glycogen stores are very low as I’m cutting, but they’re not depleted.

 

[need4tren]

First thing that pops up in a Google search .... "can you store glycogen in a calorie deficit"?
View attachment 201418

a quick google is not very accurate. No intense exercise is gonna burn 2000 calories in 90-120 minutes.

Your body can’t store energy it doesn’t have, glycogenesis is impossible when your in a deficit which means the body is going to use Gluconeogenesis. That is what the body knows it’s gonna need to perform, and it obviously still can. But you will not store 50g of carbs into glycogen while your on 1300 calories while your maintenance is 2500-2800

 

[Pull Freak]

a quick google is not very accurate. No intense exercise is gonna burn 2000 calories in 90-120 minutes.

Your body can’t store energy it doesn’t have, glycogenesis is impossible when your in a deficit which means the body is going to use Gluconeogenesis. That is what the body knows it’s gonna need to perform, and it obviously still can. But you will not store 50g of carbs into glycogen while your on 1300 calories while your maintenance is 2500-2800

a quick google is not very accurate. No intense exercise is gonna burn 2000 calories in 90-120 minutes.

Your body can’t store energy it doesn’t have, glycogenesis is impossible when your in a deficit which means the body is going to use Gluconeogenesis. That is what the body knows it’s gonna need to perform, and it obviously still can. But you will not store 50g of carbs into glycogen while your on 1300 calories while your maintenance is 2500-2800

Hold 330 watts on a bicycle for 120 min and see how many calories you burn.

 

[Pull Freak]

You could not complete a grand tour if you could not store glycogen in a deficit. Just a example.

 

[intensevolume1]

Huh? glycogen can’t stored in a deficit?

The only instance I can think of this happening in human physiology is a type 1 diabetic.

Guss what happens?!! They fucking die in a few days

I’ve never seen someone really fat die of starvation, so I think our understanding of metabolism and physiology needs a tune up

It will only replenish what you put back in and then it will convert what it can from amino acids. Muscle will not deplete less than around 10%.
There is threshold of how low the body will go for survival. This was never in question though
We are utilizing it, it takes time for carbs to be digested and turned into glycogen for our body utilize. It takes time for it to be shuttled into cells.
No it's not just burned up as soon as it's consumed.
Glycogen contains calories the body cannot defy thermodynamics.
I think our understanding of physics need a tune up

 

[bbxtreme]

Fundamentals of glycogen metabolism for coaches and athletes

The ability of athletes to train day after day depends in large part on adequate restoration of muscle glycogen stores, a process that requires the consumption of sufficient dietary carbohydrates and ample time. Providing effective guidance to athletes ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[intensevolume1]

You could not complete a grand tour if you could not store glycogen in a deficit. Just a example.

The grand tour I'm assuming is a marathon. With that assumption they are not starting it in a deficit and they are not doing it without consuming carbohydrates during. You're correct you could not complete a grand tour without storing glycogen to use

 

[Pull Freak]

The grand tour I'm assuming is a marathon. With that assumption they are not starting it in a deficit and they are not doing it without consuming carbohydrates during. You're correct you could not complete a grand tour without storing glycogen to use

Tour de France. I think 21 day with only 2 days rest. On rest day they still do ride. Depending on how many time trial, generally no more than two. They are on the bike for around 6 hours a day. There is no way they can eat enough calories over the 3 weeks.

 

[intensevolume1]

Tour de France. I think 21 day with only 2 days rest. On rest day they still do ride. Depending on how many time trial, generally no more than two. They are on the bike for around 6 hours a day. There is no way they can eat enough calories over the 3 weeks.

They're replenishing though. Also the body will convert amino acids into glycogen if needed. They don't just burn up the calories as soon as they consume them. There's a lot that takes place in the body with digestion and utilization. They're not storing calories They're consuming them and then after digestion the body is using them.
The body has protective mechanisms that take place because you need glycogen. It shuttles it to where it is used. It however is not storing anything in a caloric deficit.
The body doesnt just stop using calories or glycogen

 

[SouthernMuscle]

Just wanna give a quick thank you to @Fleezy for starting an absolute banger of a thread

 

[Fleezy]

Just wanna give a quick thank you to @Fleezy for starting an absolute banger of a thread

 

[m302_imola]

I believe luki has covered this but if your in a calorie deficit it won't stall fatloss

I’d be curious to hear more about this since exogenous insulin turns off lipolysis while the slin is active.