Cardarine for lowering RHR

[traininsane11]

Has anyone had any experience with it for this purpose?

I’d never heard of it before but troponinIQ suggested it at 10-20mg per day to lower RHR by upto 20bpm

Nebivolol doesn’t seem to do anything for me

 

[luki7788]

If I’m honest, I’ve never heard a bigger nonsense. Cardarine has no mechanism that could directly lower resting heart rate. Zero. This compound works through PPAR-δ and all it really does is shift your fuel preference from glucose to fatty acids and slightly improve your lipid profile. That’s it.
If someone claims that “Cardarine lowers resting heart rate”, they’re mixing things up. It might help indirectly over a long period of time, but only because your endurance goes up, your lipid profile gets a bit better and you start training harder. When your conditioning improves and bodyfat drops, resting heart rate can go down. But that’s your training and your overall metabolic health improving not Cardarine itself.

So there is absolutely no direct effect. For me this claim is completely made up.

 

[traininsane11]

If I’m honest, I’ve never heard a bigger nonsense. Cardarine has no mechanism that could directly lower resting heart rate. Zero. This compound works through PPAR-δ and all it really does is shift your fuel preference from glucose to fatty acids and slightly improve your lipid profile. That’s it.
If someone claims that “Cardarine lowers resting heart rate”, they’re mixing things up. It might help indirectly over a long period of time, but only because your endurance goes up, your lipid profile gets a bit better and you start training harder. When your conditioning improves and bodyfat drops, resting heart rate can go down. But that’s your training and your overall metabolic health improving not Cardarine itself.

So there is absolutely no direct effect. For me this claim is completely made up.

I’d never heard of it either tbh this is what he says specifically

Cardarine lowers your RHR by improving your heart's efficiency and enhancing fat oxidation at the cellular level. Let me be straight with you - it's not just masking the problem like some other compounds might, it's actually making your cardiovascular system work better.

Here's the deal: Cardarine activates something called PPAR-delta receptors, which basically tells your body to become more efficient at using fat for fuel instead of relying heavily on glucose. When your heart and muscles can tap into fat stores more easily, your cardiovascular system doesn't have to work as hard to meet energy demands. Think of it like upgrading your engine to run more efficiently - same power output, less strain on the system.

The key insight from coaching enhanced guys is that Cardarine works at the mitochondrial level to improve how your cells produce and use energy. This takes some of the burden off your heart because your tissues become more efficient at extracting what they need from each heartbeat.

The bottom line: It's making your cardiovascular system more efficient rather than just suppressing heart rate artificially.

 

[traininsane11]

I am open to other suggestions for guys who don’t respond to Nebivolol btw

Cardio and steps are already in and consistent

 

[luki7788]

So basically thinking the same way I did, because cardarine doesn’t directly affect resting heart rate. But in my opinion and this is only my opinion, nobody has to agree it doesn’t make sense. You can get the exact same effect just by adding some interval training twice a week, instead of stuffing another drug into your stack. I think that’s the logical and reasonable approach.

And there are no people who do not "respond to nebivolol". Probably your dose is too low or there are other reasons - e.g. sleep apnea, and the question is whether you have it and if so, whether you use CPAP.

 

[traininsane11]

So basically thinking the same way I did, because cardarine doesn’t directly affect resting heart rate. But in my opinion and this is only my opinion, nobody has to agree it doesn’t make sense. You can get the exact same effect just by adding some interval training twice a week, instead of stuffing another drug into your stack. I think that’s the logical and reasonable approach.

And there are no people who do not "respond to nebivolol". Probably your dose is too low or there are other reasons - e.g. sleep apnea, and the question is whether you have it and if so, whether you use CPAP.

100% agree adding cardio over drugs is a much more logical approach to achieve the same outcome the less things we can take realistically the better in my opinion

This could well be true I remember reading on here a few people saying they were none responders essentially.

My Nebivolol dosage has always been 5-10mg and can’t say I noticed much effect on RHR from either dose not to say the other positive effects weren’t in effect though I’m sure they were

I got tested quite some time ago and had mild sleep apnea but I could never get used to the machine at all as I have a deviated septum and often can only breathe through the one side so even with the full face mask it made it exceptionally hard to breath .

I am about 20-30lbs less in bodyweight than then though and have to say I don’t notice the sleep apnea anywhere close to or even at all that I did when I was heavier


For reference as they can often be linked it seems my BP is quite good at 112/71

 

[luki7788]

you have the answer - you will not treat apnea = don't be surprised that your resting heart rate is elevated

 

[massephase]

but I could never get used to the machine at all as I have a deviated septum and often can only breathe through the one side so even with the full face mask it made it exceptionally hard to breath .

I am about 20-30lbs less in bodyweight than then though and have to say I don’t notice the sleep apnea anywhere close to or even at all that I did when I was heavier

Bro, try and get used to sleeping with the machine. I don't know if you are being treated by a doctor - if not, you can download the OSCAR software for free and evaluate the data the machine collects pretty easily and make adjustments on your own. There's a lot of info on the net on how to do that. If you're interested, I can send you a good YT-video that goes in depth on how to set up the machine in accordance with your data.

And what do you mean by notice? How do you notice sleep apnea? I never noticed anything other than that I somtimes woke myself up laying on my back by snoring. But my AHI was at 38 when I went and got tested. That's 38 apneas an hour.
I only noticed something serious was going on when it was so bad that my brain stopped funcitoning at work.

Nowadays, I can feel the difference in my daytime performance when I have a night with 1 event per hour vs 0.3 events per hour. Even a "little" apnea can fuck you up. It only takes one event to disrupt a whole sleep cycle.

 

[Massive G]

you have the answer - you will not treat apnea = don't be surprised that your resting heart rate is elevated

I would be a miserable fking human if I slept without my cpap. Been over 15 years and an absolute game changer to me. I remember the morning after my sleep study long ago and I felt like a superhuman after that session. 320 and couldn't tell you how many events I had it was so bad they hooked me up an hour into the sleep study. Never looked back since then. Is it a royal pain in the ass to sleep with a mask on.. yea..but you get used to it quickly.

 

[Massive G]

Bro, try and get used to sleeping with the machine. I don't know if you are being treated by a doctor - if not, you can download the OSCAR software for free and evaluate the data the machine collects pretty easily and make adjustments on your own. There's a lot of info on the net on how to do that. If you're interested, I can send you a good YT-video that goes in depth on how to set up the machine in accordance with your data.

And what do you mean by notice? How do you notice sleep apnea? I never noticed anything other than that I somtimes woke myself up laying on my back by snoring. But my AHI was at 38 when I went and got tested. That's 38 apneas an hour.
I only noticed something serious was going on when it was so bad that my brain stopped funcitoning at work.

Nowadays, I can feel the difference in my daytime performance when I have a night with 1 event per hour vs 0.3 events per hour. Even a "little" apnea can fuck you up. It only takes one event to disrupt a whole sleep cycle.

My PCP identified it. I went to him because I was waking up like 10 times a night to go pee. Thought I had prostate problems and he said I think you have apnea that is waking you up which was true. When I would wake I noticed my HR was very elevated evidence that I wasn't getting enough 02 and the heart was trying to compensate. I also have a deviated septum but adapted quickly.
The new machines don't really require sleep studies just set to auto and it adjusts.

 

[CorgisOnTren]

I use 10-20mg a day. It’s never effected my RHR on or off.

 

[traininsane11]

Thanks guys seems like the probable sleep apnea may be the root of the issue

I have quite a good machine it’s an auto one and has an app to give you feedback

I think it certainly makes sense to really persevere with trying to get used to it and see if it helps which I’m sure it probably will

At its worst I would wake up and feel like I couldn’t breath and had to fall asleep sitting up but since being lighter in bodyweight I’ve not noticed anything but that’s not to say I don’t still have it

Will try and get used to it from today and hopefully it works out and helps lower my RHR

 

[traininsane11]

Not truly reflective of RHR as post stimulants (caffeine, t3/t4) and after being active but usually often in the 90’s so not far off

18 episodes per hour I averaged on my sleep test so looking at all the data most likely is sleep apnea

Mask goes on tonight

 

[traininsane11]

To late to edit but I’m also going to drop
The t3 and just keep the t4 at 100mcg
And hope it’s enough until I get bloods done soon (was using it as part of the higher gh experiment) but I’ve noticed since adding it RHR has gone up

So dropping that and the cpap should have me sitting at a better number

 

[iron lifter]

What is your resting heart rate? How are you tracking it all day long? (Do you wear an Apple Watch?) Your BP is on the lower side of things, and typically the heart compensates when BP drops that low HR can go up to compensate, not suggesting that is whats happening to you here, as it could be many things.

 

[traininsane11]

What is your resting heart rate? How are you tracking it all day long? (Do you wear an Apple Watch?) Your BP is on the lower side of things, and typically the heart compensates when BP drops that low HR can go up to compensate, not suggesting that is whats happening to you here, as it could be many things.

I have a Fitbit but the numbers are all over the place so far it’s ranged from 70-105 today. I prefer using the BP machine and different intervals as it’s much more
Consistent

This is the lowest my BP has been actually and I think it may be the additional health supps (niacin, increased
Omegas and magnesium) as that’s the only change. Usually it sits at around 110-120/65-75

 

[iron lifter]

I have a Fitbit but the numbers are all over the place so far it’s ranged from 70-105 today. I prefer using the BP machine and different intervals as it’s much more
Consistent

This is the lowest my BP has been actually and I think it may be the additional health supps (niacin, increased
Omegas and magnesium) as that’s the only change. Usually it sits at around 110-120/65-75

Interesting, the only thing you listed that can move BP numbers is magnesium, but only if balanced with proper ratio of potassium. Keep monitoring things hope you figure out what is causing RHR to be that high.

 

[romo]

So basically thinking the same way I did, because cardarine doesn’t directly affect resting heart rate. But in my opinion and this is only my opinion, nobody has to agree it doesn’t make sense. You can get the exact same effect just by adding some interval training twice a week, instead of stuffing another drug into your stack. I think that’s the logical and reasonable approach.

And there are no people who do not "respond to nebivolol". Probably your dose is too low or there are other reasons - e.g. sleep apnea, and the question is whether you have it and if so, whether you use CPAP.

This is what i was thinking, nebivolol WORKS

 

[bbxtreme]

High test, other anabolics, and stimulants all can elevate sympathetic tone and resting HR.

With high dosages and stimulants you have reduced parasympathetic (vagal) tone meaning Your body can’t “brake” the HR increase.

If the nebilvol isn’t working for the RHR (it is the BP) then your issue is likely central sympathetic drive, not just peripheral β-receptor signaling.

Ivabradine would get the RHR down or Clonidine (α2-agonist). I prefer Ivabradine and not big fan of Clonidine as you’d also have to back off Nebilivol to use it with your BP so low.

But the BEST solution is to cut all stims out for a while and fix your sleep (recovery and apnea).

 

[traininsane11]

High test, other anabolics, and stimulants all can elevate sympathetic tone and resting HR.

With high dosages and stimulants you have reduced parasympathetic (vagal) tone meaning Your body can’t “brake” the HR increase.

If the nebilvol isn’t working for the RHR (it is the BP) then your issue is likely central sympathetic drive, not just peripheral β-receptor signaling.

Ivabradine would get the RHR down or Clonidine (α2-agonist). I prefer Ivabradine and not big fan of Clonidine as you’d also have to back off Nebilivol to use it with your BP so low.

But the BEST solution is to cut all stims out for a while and fix your sleep (recovery and apnea).

Thanks for this I understand most of it just about

I did look into Ivabradine but seems quite tricky to get here in the UK I can only just about get Nebivolol through the pharmacies

I am doing the latter of today which I believe is just t3 as I don’t take any other stimulants outside of a coffee or 2 and then make myself stick to using the cpap. I’m really hopeful that over time the cpap should make a noticeable difference to overall health and specifically RHR and the dropping the t3 should hopefully see quite an immediate drop in RHR if only small hopefully between the 2 I can get it into the 70’s

Would you say that’s a realistic goal?