CHINA laws MEGATHREAD

NovaPharma · Jan 2, 2020

K1 said:
It sucks that there can't be tiers in this business...But then again, the new guys would offer fuck all for pricing which they already do, pulling the profit from the trusted guys...The trusted guys don't make the profit to keep things running smoothly and have to drop their prices to compete.

Remember when the homebrewers started popping up...They cut the prices in the market right in half almost overnight. NONE of those guys are still in business but the trusted sources had to follow suit and in good business those same guys didn't want to go back up on their prices, so it remained the same. Then many of those same bum sources have come back time and time again under different names, continuing to cut the prices out from under the trusted guys, only to run out or product, burn members or get themselves busted for handling business stupidly.

Look at the testing...You have guys bitching when results come back underdosed. You ask them what they paid for the vial and they're like $25-$30 bucks...WTF did you expect?! You let these guys come in an control the market so that you could get more vials for your dollar...Now all your vials add up to what you would have paid to that trusted source for 1-2 vials with money to spare lol!

You aren't the only one I've seen make the comment I originally quoted over the years...But it has become such the norm that people don't realize anymore that yes the cost was higher years back, but the quality was consistently better and those trusted guys were able to handle business more efficiently. Now everyone has to pump out more product quicker for less profit to be able to give out more free shit and keep up with the handful of new guys that pop up with a pretty label each week. So it becomes a lower profit margin, lesser quality and more risk to little reward.

I’m dreading the 35$ Vial due, I would be ok with test but god Tren E things like this are double dosage of A & Same price & I’ve seen guys wanting for 30$ It’s insane.

It usually ends up good product, good rep, then everything goes to shit, scamming, disappearing.

NovaPharma · Jan 2, 2020

And I’m not trying to tell BIGA how to run his board due to clutter etc.

If anything i would like to see this bigger and better and more business for him, as if it wasn’t for him and this board and the opportunities created by him none of us would be around.

The scrolling through forums is a little much at times.

K1 · Jan 2, 2020

get it in ya said:
K1 knows more than any of us, I agree with every word.

I wouldn't say that man...But there was a good stretch of years when I made it a point to know who was behind the sourcing name and who they were actually getting their product from. Wanting to find out as much as I could about what goes on behind the scenes in this game...A lot of which most will never know!

Matsuo Munefusa said:
I want to meet the guy that chips in to pay his source's lawyer fees. That guy is Ghandi....on steroids!

I've seen it a couple of times only...I have even seen an instant where a source helped out their competiton after a bust. No other reason for either other then except that they could.

Maverick said:
as much as these new sources are to blame for undercutting older verteran sources such as a certain chinese source on this board with their 10.00 for tren ace and 5.00 a vial for test enanthate 300 you have to put some blame as well on the forum owners....

i realize that forums owners are here to make money selling banners and ad space but if they didnt let all these newbies advertise on thier forums with these crazy low prices and no history then veteran sources having to lower prices wouldnt be as big of an issue either....

pro muscle is a great forum... ive been here for almost 17 years.... but the number of sponsors on this forum alone has exploded.... other forums are the same... this place is as big a source board as the old meso-rx was back int he day when it was the wild west...

everybody cant be a source... yet everybody seems to be trying to be....

people say the pie is big enough for everybody to get a piece.... is it really...? doesnt seem so any longer... the big pond seems pretty clogged up...

I slightly agree with this...Only to the point of the forum owner "could" police what the new sources are allowed to price their products at (not their responsibility though, even in the slightest). But it doesn't matter at the end of the day because the customer/member makes the choice, which is why these sources have gotten out of hand. To say that an owner shouldn't allow new sources to sponsor makes no sense...If that were the case only the same 2-3 sources would have only been available and everyone else would be getting their shit from the gyms for $150/vial. Everyone from member to source starts at the bottom and has the opportunity to build a reputation.

No one said that back in the day members had to use all of these new sources popping up...Many of those guys were Vets, Mods, VIP's, etc from all over the community, so they already had solid reps and decided to break into sourcing for some extra cash. Most of which are no longer in business and several of those guys are the reason for the homebrewing prices (one I can think of really heavily pushed the movement under a few different names over some years and every single one of his names ended up scamming customers because he couldn't manage his business properly and always ended up in the hole with his customers and suppliers). But by your post, it is the forum owner's fault because he should have never allowed those guys to source but others should be allowed?! What would be the conditions?! Where do you draw the line?!

At the end of the day, the old school sources should have banded together and keeping their pricing consistent to whether the storm, because like I said, where are all those sources now, gone! Instead they took the bate that these fly-by-nights put out there and it has gone down hill since. Shit many of them spent time trying to undercut each other to steal business away...Very few have shown the mentality that the pie is big enough for everyone to get a piece.

Like I said, it would have been cool to have price tiers that maybe people voted sources into...Obviously would never happen but different check points like: Quality, Communication, Shipping T/A, Customer service, etc. Where a source ranks is what they should be allowed to offer their price range. But again, the same as you and I already know, guys will use a source that doesn't communicate well or has slower delivery because his pricing is much cheaper then the next guy and then just bitch to the Mods when he has to wait a month or more for his order, crying scam.

Crazy_jay · Jan 2, 2020

Maverick said:
as much as these new sources are to blame for undercutting older verteran sources such as a certain chinese source on this board with their 10.00 for tren ace and 5.00 a vial for test enanthate 300 you have to put some blame as well on the forum owners....

i realize that forums owners are here to make money selling banners and ad space but if they didnt let all these newbies advertise on thier forums with these crazy low prices and no history then veteran sources having to lower prices wouldnt be as big of an issue either....

pro muscle is a great forum... ive been here for almost 17 years.... but the number of sponsors on this forum alone has exploded.... other forums are the same... this place is as big a source board as the old meso-rx was back int he day when it was the wild west...

everybody cant be a source... yet everybody seems to be trying to be....

people say the pie is big enough for everybody to get a piece.... is it really...? doesnt seem so any longer... the big pond seems pretty clogged up...

I actually wont order from the sources on this board because they will allow shit sources as long as they pay board fees. I come from a private board where all members and sources were vetted. No donations were accepted from anyone and at the slightest hint of something shady going on, the source or the member was banned, along with an explanation as to why. I have seen here where a source was selling shit and the only recommendation was, donate money to see the lab results thread, never that the source was removed to retain integrity. I come here for other reasons than a source. I have paid good money to sources who were very much respected as I've seen several guys ripped off. Unfortunately, it seems the best know when to hang it up. As the saying goes, if it's too good to be true, it probably is and some of the sources around here have some ridiculously cheap prices.

NovaPharma · Jan 2, 2020

WADA and China sign ground-breaking agreement to eliminate illegal manufacture and supply of PEDs
Partnership follows recent DEA steroid and PED operation in which majority of substances originated from Chinese laboratories

WADA and China sign ground-breaking agreement to eliminate illegal manufacture and supply of PEDs (22 September 2015)

Partnership follows recent DEA steroid and PED operation in which majority of substances originated from Chinese laboratories The World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) and the General Administration of Sport of China (GASC) have signed a Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) that will help track and...

www.wada-ama.org

from 2015 same bs

chadwick · Jan 2, 2020

obviously few here give a hoot regardless of the heavy metal contaminants found in Chinese Raw's which all UGLs supply

K1 · Jan 2, 2020

Crazy_jay said:
I actually wont order from the sources on this board because they will allow shit sources as long as they pay board fees. I come from a private board where all members and sources were vetted. No donations were accepted from anyone and at the slightest hint of something shady going on, the source or the member was banned, along with an explanation as to why. I have seen here where a source was selling shit and the only recommendation was, donate money to see the lab results thread, never that the source was removed to retain integrity. I come here for other reasons than a source. I have paid good money to sources who were very much respected as I've seen several guys ripped off. Unfortunately, it seems the best know when to hang it up. As the saying goes, if it's too good to be true, it probably is and some of the sources around here have some ridiculously cheap prices.

I love when guys pop in and talk about "private boards" like it's something special and secretive?! In all my years I've never seen a single one any different then any open forum...Aside from sensitive topics being more freely discussed. Source wise, no difference in the vetting process, none! Would you like a countless list of "trusted" and "vetted" members and sources over the years from many "private boards" that turned out to be scammers?!

So by your logic, there should be a 1 strike rule...Sorry to break it to you, then there would probably be no sources left for use. Whether it was SRCS, Amrit, Jano or any of the other testing services used over the years, most every single sources has tested off at one time or another, save a few. And even those that never failed, many tested over, which would still classify a fail because it was off from the label claim. If someone fails a test they should be given the opportunity to correct the shit...Especially if they're willing to do so and make things right.

Countless sources have been removed for scamming, countless names/addies have been posted over the years...Doesn't matter because a source can easily pop up under a different name and get their supplier, a Mod, a Vet, a VIP to vouch for them...It's the nature of the business. Your "private board" is absolutely no different, as there is only so much "vetting" that can be done...At the end of the day they're still putting out product and the members are still placing orders.

It makes me laugh when guys throw out the word "integrity", much like those that use the word "love", it's comical...As-in this board's integrity is compromised because the amount of sponsors Big A allows to advertise here?! Like always, the forum should hold everyone's hand throughout the entire process to assure that you don't have to do anything for yourself. The forum owner checks to assure that the person offering their services are legit...It's the members responsibility to do his own vetting as well to assure the sponsors is providing quality. There is no one way street in this game. Even if a forum owner paid out of pocket to send a new source's products in to be tested, how does that guarantee the next batch and the batch after that and the batch after that. Your private forum rheteric is nonsense.

chadwick said:
obviously few here give a hoot regardless of the heavy metal contaminants found in Chinese Raw's which all UGLs supply

Not a lot of options for these guys is there...Kind of a moot point even bringing up, no?!

Matsuo Munefusa · Jan 2, 2020

we're lucky to have you K1. You've always kicked major fucking ass at breaking shit down for everybody.

Not trying to ass kiss here, just stating my appreciation brother.

Bleed · Jan 2, 2020

The black market will always come with risks.

As a customer ive been burned.

Im also one of those guys who had run-ins with LE based on a sources issues.

This is all a dangerous game regardless of your role.

LE sees everybody as a participant. To them there are no spectators here.

Like all my cop buddies say regarding everything they do from writing tickets to arresting 22 year old kids for an eighth of cannibas, without a hint of irony or self awareness, "revenue is revenue"

If the system can make a meal of you, It will.

Deleted member 121863 · Jan 2, 2020

You guys really know how to take things off topic. I understand people`s complaints but you don`t try and tell dad how to run his house. If you don`t like it, you move out.

Calm all the speculation of scarcity, prices doubling, none of that will happen. Some sources might try, scammers will emerge, that is on the buyer to weed through but there will still be plenty of supply at reasonable prices by multiple sources.

grizzly978 · Jan 2, 2020

johnjuanb1 said:
I agree 100%. There are too many sponsors here for one or two to Jack prices up, and still get customers. Now, if all sponsors raise prices then it’s safe to assume there’s a shortage in the raws market.

I don’t care if anyone raises prices personally! The f*cking source risks their as* for us. I’ve been on this board for almost a decade and using gear for over a decade. They put themselves on the line , so if they need to make their cash, so be it. Can’t afford higher prices? Then that’s not the sources problem, that’s a YOUR MONEY PROBLEM. If the dvds are good, I’ll pay more. It’s all about quality and if more risk now comes to keep the quality high thus raising prices, so be it.
Dvds are never going away, prices may go up, big deal... my fricken health insurance goes up every year, gas goes up, prices don’t just stay the same in any industry.
sorry for the rant, but these sources aren’t anything close to being labeled as shady or bad if they want to make more cash. It’s their business and if you don’t like it, go elsewhere and pay less to get some crap bunk in a bottle.
JJB- this rant isn’t directed at you either fyi.

grizzly978 · Jan 2, 2020

hogan86 said:
You guys really know how to take things off topic. I understand people`s complaints but you don`t try and tell dad how to run his house. If you don`t like it, you move out.

Calm all the speculation of scarcity, prices doubling, none of that will happen. Some sources might try, scammers will emerge, that is on the buyer to weed through but there will still be plenty of supply at reasonable prices by multiple sources.

Hogan if the source has to up their price, fair game!!! I’ll donate extra for quality and due to market issues.
I’ve been in B2B sales for a large corporation for years and years, our prices go up all the time. Our service and products rock, so we up rates, if someone complains , they can go get lowballed by competition And get treated like shit and have a crappier product , then a few months later they come crawling back.

Deleted member 121863 · Jan 2, 2020

grizzly978 said:
Hogan if the source has to up their price, fair game!!! I’ll donate extra for quality and due to market issues.
I’ve been in B2B sales for a large corporation for years and years, our prices go up all the time. Our service and products rock, so we up rates, if someone complains , they can go get lowballed by competition And get treated like shit and have a crappier product , then a few months later they come crawling back.

Agreed 100%. I had a member here get a free sample of sdrol then have the balls to ask if he can get a "discount because he is on a fixed income". MOFO maybe you don`t need sdrol and tren. Not my problem if a person can`t afford gear. Those people are always the biggest pain in *ss and its the same guys on all the freebie threads. There should be a private forum for sponsors only to black list people like that! Vent, complete. Went back to low carbs today and have a headache, sorry.
P.S. Prices for gear have stayed the same if not come down over the last 5-10 years!

Isovet · Jan 3, 2020

the market will always be the market... we as sellers have to adjust or die... its that simple... everybody has a right to compete... strong will survive... rest will die off... its that simple.

qbkilla · Jan 3, 2020

hogan86 said:
Agreed 100%. I had a member here get a free sample of sdrol then have the balls to ask if he can get a "discount because he is on a fixed income". MOFO maybe you don`t need sdrol and tren. Not my problem if a person can`t afford gear. Those people are always the biggest pain in *ss and its the same guys on all the freebie threads. There should be a private forum for sponsors only to black list people like that! Vent, complete. Went back to low carbs today and have a headache, sorry.
P.S. Prices for gear have stayed the same if not come down over the last 5-10 years!

That guy who asked that, that is completely pathetic. People who can't afford anabolic don't deserve anabolic. If someone can't afford a cycle, hell, even a large cycle, they should stop going to the gym and develop some skills so they can have a stable job or career. Stupid people (like that guy) are a risk to everyone so I agree they should be blacklisted.

Maverick · Jan 3, 2020

K1 said:
I wouldn't say that man...But there was a good stretch of years when I made it a point to know who was behind the sourcing name and who they were actually getting their product from. Wanting to find out as much as I could about what goes on behind the scenes in this game...A lot of which most will never know!

I've seen it a couple of times only...I have even seen an instant where a source helped out their competiton after a bust. No other reason for either other then except that they could.

I slightly agree with this...Only to the point of the forum owner "could" police what the new sources are allowed to price their products at (not their responsibility though, even in the slightest). But it doesn't matter at the end of the day because the customer/member makes the choice, which is why these sources have gotten out of hand. To say that an owner shouldn't allow new sources to sponsor makes no sense...If that were the case only the same 2-3 sources would have only been available and everyone else would be getting their shit from the gyms for $150/vial. Everyone from member to source starts at the bottom and has the opportunity to build a reputation.

No one said that back in the day members had to use all of these new sources popping up...Many of those guys were Vets, Mods, VIP's, etc from all over the community, so they already had solid reps and decided to break into sourcing for some extra cash. Most of which are no longer in business and several of those guys are the reason for the homebrewing prices (one I can think of really heavily pushed the movement under a few different names over some years and every single one of his names ended up scamming customers because he couldn't manage his business properly and always ended up in the hole with his customers and suppliers). But by your post, it is the forum owner's fault because he should have never allowed those guys to source but others should be allowed?! What would be the conditions?! Where do you draw the line?!

At the end of the day, the old school sources should have banded together and keeping their pricing consistent to whether the storm, because like I said, where are all those sources now, gone! Instead they took the bate that these fly-by-nights put out there and it has gone down hill since. Shit many of them spent time trying to undercut each other to steal business away...Very few have shown the mentality that the pie is big enough for everyone to get a piece.

Like I said, it would have been cool to have price tiers that maybe people voted sources into...Obviously would never happen but different check points like: Quality, Communication, Shipping T/A, Customer service, etc. Where a source ranks is what they should be allowed to offer their price range. But again, the same as you and I already know, guys will use a source that doesn't communicate well or has slower delivery because his pricing is much cheaper then the next guy and then just bitch to the Mods when he has to wait a month or more for his order, crying scam.

ill try to address as may points here as i can... im on limited time...

i agree with some of what you say as well but ill say this...

when i said it was also on the forums owners for allowing too many guys to source.. i was referring to the fact the pond has gotten so small now compared to years past that everybody cant be a big fish... you cant have a town of 1000 people and have 10 walmart, 5 targets, 8 costcos, and 20 sams clubs.... not enough people for all those business to thrive... same thing here... you cant have a thriving source forum of the 100 sources and only have 500-1000 of the same members online at one time.... 5 -10 guys making orders for each source spending pennies isnt good business except for the forum owner collecting ad fees... thats all im saying. the guy making all the money in this situation is the board owner charging 300,500,1000,2000 or whatever a month for forum space.... im all for the forum owner making as much money as he can.... if i was a forum owner i'd be doing the exact same thing... dont care if the source sells 1 vial or 1000. not my problem... everything i said was merely from a speculation standpoint...

now you said my point about a forum owner not allowing new guys to source here makes no sense because then the same 2-3 guys would be making all the money.... thats basically what the outcome would be with your price tiers you always talk about... forcing sources the price their products at a certain price because of their T/A, communication speed, etc... eventually you would have the same 2-3 guys making all the money because they would have the lowest prices.... becuase they have met all the qualifications... how would sources with a 5-7 day T/A make any money over a guy with 2/3 days T/A? what if the mail is slow where the source is stationed at.. is he going to get penalized for external things outside his control...? Do international guys get screwed for being in europe vs the USA? it would be a perpetual prison/purgatory some sources could never get out of and the same handful of guys would make all the money because they have the lowest prices based on the tier scheme you mentioned.

in the end if everybody kept thier prices the same.. then what seperates once source from another...? pretty labels? brown vials vs clear ones? in the end this is a business. everybody is trying to sell the most the can to make the most the can... in the time they have available here...

you say the old school sources should have just kept thier prices the same.. why? they lose money doing that? bodybuiders are notoriously cheap... i mean so cheap they want you to give them free gear AND money back too and thats still too expensive.... that cheap. do you really expect those old school sources to stand by and watch the new guys pop up with the lower pricing and steal all the customers away and do nothing...? thats wishful thinking... nobody wants to lose business... and thats exactly what happens...

i think in the end with my comment about the board owners not letting so may guys source... and you with your price tiers... the end result is the same...

certain people who take all the risks should be rewarded the heaviest... and i agree with that...

ill come right out and say it... i dont care. i have no ball in the game... im on the sidelines.... i just watch but... its an illegal business... you can lose you life and liberty for this.. if you're an old school source who has been here for 10-20 years like marsell, or rbb, or alin, or IP gear... if im them.. im pissed.... im used to making a certain amount of money because the competition was smaller and now every broke ass with 1000.00 extra can buy a kilo ov test and make a quick buck takes money out of my pocket....

and you know the guys im talking about... the ones that get busted.. the redneck in west virgina in his trailer... or the meth addict looking husband and wife that get busted with a lab in thier apartment... or the group of college douchebags who band together because the watched the movie "blow" or scarface one too many times and think they can be the tony montana of steroids.... those guys ruin it for the real sources... guys who used to really risk liberty for reward vs what we have today... china guys having USA remailers so no customs worry no nothing. just buy, bake , and sell...

at the very least... these china guys should be told to stick to selling just powder... thats it... these china guys with thier 5.00 for a bottle of test enanthate 300.. na na... outta here with that... if the forum owners told them stick to powders... it might go a long way to helping out... but as a source how do you compete with 5.00 for a bottle of test 300 when it costs 3.00 to make it?

maldorf · Jan 4, 2020

Maverick said:
at the very least... these china guys should be told to stick to selling just powder... thats it... these china guys with thier 5.00 for a bottle of test enanthate 300.. na na... outta here with that... if the forum owners told them stick to powders... it might go a long way to helping out... but as a source how do you compete with 5.00 for a bottle of test 300 when it costs 3.00 to make it?

Wow, that cheap!? That is very hard to beat. Certainly becomes a numbers game then to make any profit. From the viewpoint of a customer that is pretty great, as long as quality is good. Id worry about shortcuts being taken to keep price down. I had no idea there are places selling it that cheap.

qbkilla · Jan 4, 2020

Is that even true, people sell bottles for $5? Anyone who buys that I hope they enjoy their cycle of straight olive oil. I would advise anyone who wants results to use a reputable established source with a solid reputation who doesn't sell their gear at 1/6th of market value.