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Coming off for good ??? Advice ?

hollaatyaboyy1

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What’s up guys. Decided it’s finally time to give it up. I’ve been at this shit a long time never gave it my all, abused my body and . My heart isn’t in it anymore ....at this time my health is the most important thing to me and it’s become increasingly hard to get my bloodwork in check even coming down to very low trt for a while .

i haven’t been completely off in many years. I’ve been on no more then 200mg for over a year and a half I’m in the worst shape of my life. I know my natural test will prob never come back and it’s going to be hard on my body not having any production but I have to get to the root of of bloodwork issues without any other variables at play.

my plan is hcg
week 2-4 -250 iu x2 week
Weeks 4-5. 50mg clomid
Weeks 5-8. 20mg novadex

and then test levels in 3 months after that.

with all that said. I really want to lose fat. I know it will be an uphill battle that prob won’t work. But if you were in this position and HAD TO COME OFF how would you be dieting and training. Please keep in mind that my body is beat to fuck. I have a torn labrum and a host of other injuries that prevent me from training balls to the wall like I used to. Right now
I’m 5’7 209. With plenty of fat. I’ve been psychologically addicted to gear for a very long time but this needs to happen and I’m just looking for some guidance. Thanks
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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To add to it over the last 6-9 months I’ve been on around 50-90mg test not 150-200
 

goback2013

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re: losing body fat

why not just give it some time ? say a year or so..
as far as work outs... maybe switch to more running and body weight exercises.
a la david goggins..
start with MURPHs then modify accordingly..
i've seen natural guys at the playground with more muscle and if not more cut then gym rats on grams of gear.
you may not reach that playground physique with lower test, but over time, you can look fit and athletic.
if you end up on trt, maybe look into adding some proviron to the mix.. while still focusing on bodyweight workouts ..
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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Most likely TRT for life.
I am fine with that but. I really need to get my bloodwork in check and I’m willing to suffer with low levels for a while to see the root cause of everything.
I keep tanking my ferritin levels and causing a rebound in my rbc hematocrit and hemoglobin I cannot get my numbers down. What I’m thinking is if I’m off all exogenous test for a while the numbers will come down naturally while I build up enough ferritin. Once I get to an adequate level. I can donate without any exogenous test pushing my numbers higher. And get my ratio to a much better spot. So that when I get back on trt. I can do regular donations. And be ok HOPEFULLY
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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re: losing body fat

why not just give it some time ? say a year or so..
as far as work outs... maybe switch to more running and body weight exercises.
a la david goggins..
start with MURPHs then modify accordingly..
i've seen natural guys at the playground with more muscle and if not more cut then gym rats on grams of gear.
you may not reach that playground physique with lower test, but over time, you can look fit and athletic.
if you end up on trt, maybe look into adding some proviron to the mix.. while still focusing on bodyweight workouts ..
Thank you for the support this is exactly what I’m thinking. I’m worried about the diet because 1 I have hardly any self control and 2 I’ve always dieted like a geared bodybuilder. So I don’t know the first thing about dieting correctly for health and not pounding protein
 

Ruhlfreak55

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weird. So you have low iron but high hematocrit and red blood cells?
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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weird. So you have low iron but high hematocrit and red blood cells?
My iron levels are always good but the ferritin gets ranked and goes low. From what I understand. Ferritin is not the iron itself. But the actual storage (reserves) of iron you have in your body
 

ripriot

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If you have been on steroids for what sounds like a decade or longer. I think you are mistaken that your body's hormone levels will harmonize in 3 months. If they will at all.

Your body will have unhealthy testosterone levels which could make you have additional health problems.

Are you not able to find a doctor that can figure this out while you’re on the lowest synthetic dose of test possible? Are you going to come off testosterone everytime you have a health issue?
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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If you have been on steroids for what sounds like a decade or longer. I think you are mistaken that your body's hormone levels will harmonize in 3 months. If they will at all.

Your body will have unhealthy testosterone levels which could make you have additional health problems.

Are you not able to find a doctor that can figure this out while you’re on the lowest synthetic dose of test possible? Are you going to come off testosterone everytime you have a health issue?
No I cannot find a doctor that’s well versed enough to know what to do.

Would I like to get my natural test back - Yes.
Have I ever tried -no
Do I think it’s going to work -no
Am I hopeful -yes
 

ripriot

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No I cannot find a doctor that’s well versed enough to know what to do.

Would I like to get my natural test back - Yes.
Have I ever tried -no
Do I think it’s going to work -no
Am I hopeful -yes
An endocrinologist couldn't help you?
 

TheOtherOne55

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If you're dead set on coming off relatively soon, please scrap the idea of trying to get in good shape AS YOU COME OFF.
You're going to be disappointed.

You also said your "head isn't in it anymore." IF that's true, then it shouldn't be worried about looking like you're in shape. Those seem to be 2 conflicting ideas right now. If you're not into it and your off, your off. Try to restart the system for a couple months, rest your body, THEN dial up training and diet as a natural. But doing two at the same time seems like a quick way to have you wanting to jump back on gear again AND/OR being really disappointed in your body.
 

Biggerp73

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250 hcg isn't going to cut it if your balls have been shutdown for years

Try 1500-2500

And don't use Clomid, use Nolva

As far as losing fat, stick to lean meats, fruits, and veggies. Get most your food intake from them. You won't have to suffer as you can eat as much as you like within reason and you should still lose weight.


As others have said, start running. I'd advise sprints, especially uphill or up bleachers if you can. But definitely start being more active. Go play a couple hours of pick-up basketball at a local court a few times a week. Or pick up cycling, or tennis, or even golf (walk, don't ride).
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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250 hcg isn't going to cut it if your balls have been shutdown for years

Try 1500-2500

And don't use Clomid, use Nolva

As far as losing fat, stick to lean meats, fruits, and veggies. Get most your food intake from them. You won't have to suffer as you can eat as much as you like within reason and you should still lose weight.


As others have said, start running. I'd advise sprints, especially uphill or up bleachers if you can. But definitely start being more active. Go play a couple hours of pick-up basketball at a local court a few times a week. Or pick up cycling, or tennis, or even golf (walk, don't ride).

i have heard conflicting things about this I don’t want to overdue the hcg if they don’t come back after a month of 250iu x2 a week then they aren’t going to come back I’m not going to overdue it
 

Kaladryn

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Your PCT protocol is just going to stimulate T production, which will signal GNRH to remain shut down longer. If you stimulate or mimic LH production ON cycle, then you can help increase the number of leydig cells, but doing so OFF cycle will just delay recovery. I would start your protocol now and stop it when you come off or right after. HCG doesn't stay in the system very long, but clomid remains active for much longer (active metabolites) and nolva won't be effective.

The ideal state for recovery is: Low T, Low E, maximum number of leydig cells. The HPGA: E negatively feeds back GNRH which stimulates LH which stimulates T which aromatizes to E and negatively stimulates GNRH
 

ripriot

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Haven’t gone to one just my GP , hemotologist , and cardiologist

I guarantee you that you are not a special case. Keep trying and find a good doctor if you have health insurance. Or the doctors you did see have them run more test. The answer is out there. Look into an academic opinion such as Mayo clinic, Cleveland Clinic, Universities with med schools near you. The directors of those programs are some of the smartest minds in medicine.
 

Kaladryn

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250 hcg isn't going to cut it if your balls have been shutdown for years

Try 1500-2500
Those doses of HCG are what we were using in the 80s and 90s, this is way too much and although works temporarily, massively desensitizes lyedig cells to LH over the long term, which won't help for AAS recovery (works well for fertility though). I did massively amounts of HCG in the 90s and can confirm this from personal experience but it has also been widely discussed by doctors.
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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Your PCT protocol is just going to stimulate T production, which will signal GNRH to remain shut down longer. If you stimulate or mimic LH production ON cycle, then you can help increase the number of leydig cells, but doing so OFF cycle will just delay recovery. I would start your protocol now and stop it when you come off or right after. HCG doesn't stay in the system very long, but clomid remains active for much longer (active metabolites) and nolva won't be effective.

The ideal state for recovery is: Low T, Low E, maximum number of leydig cells. The HPGA: E negatively feeds back GNRH which stimulates LH which stimulates T which aromatizes to E and negatively stimulates GNRH
Thank you brother can you check your inbox
 

hollaatyaboyy1

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Those doses of HCG are what we were using in the 80s and 90s, this is way too much and although works temporarily, massively desensitizes lyedig cells to LH over the long term, which won't help for AAS recovery (works well for fertility though). I did massively amounts of HCG in the 90s and can confirm this from personal experience but it has also been widely discussed by doctors.
This is what I thought as welll
 

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