Competing or not, who here works with a coach and who here does their own diet?

[Biggerp73]

Most the time I eat a minimum 75-100g protein every ~5 hours and then carbs/fats as I feel I want them

When I try to diet, I usually just do a modified PSMF with about 20-40 protein every ~7 hours, zero carbs and fats, with one high carb meal every ~3 days, for as long as I feel

If I ever did want to compete (and I probably wont - and if I did I would probably want to get skin removed from my flanks before I did) - I would benefit from a coach for the simple reason I second guess the shit out of myself and go back and forth between extremes all the time

 

[333_pharma]

it all depends on the individual i have been on the industry for more than 20 years and sometimes i feel that i dont know what to eat if i dont follow a protocol. i tried to do my own diets and i always over think it, and ended up in the same spot and hire a one time coach for a diet plan and thats it, unless i tried to prep for a show i had a 16-24 weeks coach and then i just paid him again for one time plan for offseason and thats it.

 

[Sixfoottwo]

Never used one but might after this Corona shit is gone, don't want to risk the gyms closing right after I hire one as it would be my luck. Thinking of Dusty as he seems like a great guy and I like his style. Or maybe JP.

 

[333_pharma]

Never used one but might after this Corona shit is gone, don't want to risk the gyms closing right after I hire one as it would be my luck. Thinking of Dusty as he seems like a great guy and I like his style. Or maybe JP.

I feel you on the corona lockdowns, they closed again the gyms in my area and I'm stuck at home with bands and a utility bench only doing one-day upper body other days lower body, and then rest (repeat), but both guys are freaking great, thanks to dusty I learned about DC training that I have been doing for almost 10 years mixed with meadows training, for joint longevity.

 

[Dadbod3000]

I am antisocial and agoraphobic so no coach also not a competitor and don't like the idea as I feel bodybuilding is an individual thing but I am also small so you should probably get one

 

[zacharykane]

I've used a couple different coaches. First coach I used more for the sake of preventing me from going full blown crazy the last few weeks of prep and doing shit I didn't need to do. I become my own worst enemy, and having someone to tell me "no, you don't need to do extra cardio" went a long ways towards helping me bring a solid look to the stage.

Second coach I hired and just handed over the reigns and it was a disaster. Everything we did went against what had worked in the past, and we kept doing things I had said from the start wouldn't work.

So when I compete again next year, I'm sure I'll work with someone more in the capacity of making sure I don't do anything dumb, but for the most part I'm perfectly capable of prepping myself and have won several shows doing so.

 

[tren_plz]

I've used a couple different coaches. First coach I used more for the sake of preventing me from going full blown crazy the last few weeks of prep and doing shit I didn't need to do. I become my own worst enemy, and having someone to tell me "no, you don't need to do extra cardio" went a long ways towards helping me bring a solid look to the stage.

Second coach I hired and just handed over the reigns and it was a disaster. Everything we did went against what had worked in the past, and we kept doing things I had said from the start wouldn't work.

So when I compete again next year, I'm sure I'll work with someone more in the capacity of making sure I don't do anything dumb, but for the most part I'm perfectly capable of prepping myself and have won several shows doing so.

So you're saying dont hire Goob?

 

[TheOtherOne55]

I've used a couple different coaches. First coach I used more for the sake of preventing me from going full blown crazy the last few weeks of prep and doing shit I didn't need to do. I become my own worst enemy, and having someone to tell me "no, you don't need to do extra cardio" went a long ways towards helping me bring a solid look to the stage.

Second coach I hired and just handed over the reigns and it was a disaster. Everything we did went against what had worked in the past, and we kept doing things I had said from the start wouldn't work.

So when I compete again next year, I'm sure I'll work with someone more in the capacity of making sure I don't do anything dumb, but for the most part I'm perfectly capable of prepping myself and have won several shows doing so.

Question Zach, did you know any of his protocols going in? Like what were some things that he had you doing that you KNEW weren't going to work.

 

[Ruhlfreak55]

I've used a couple different coaches. First coach I used more for the sake of preventing me from going full blown crazy the last few weeks of prep and doing shit I didn't need to do. I become my own worst enemy, and having someone to tell me "no, you don't need to do extra cardio" went a long ways towards helping me bring a solid look to the stage.

Second coach I hired and just handed over the reigns and it was a disaster. Everything we did went against what had worked in the past, and we kept doing things I had said from the start wouldn't work.

So when I compete again next year, I'm sure I'll work with someone more in the capacity of making sure I don't do anything dumb, but for the most part I'm perfectly capable of prepping myself and have won several shows doing so.

I had an issue similar to your second experience for the new york minute I tried a coach in the past. I've done this alot, and while I haven't WON any shows like you have on your own, I have a really good idea about what I can handle and what works and what doesn't for me. The person I had a little help from basically cookie cuttered a bunch of STUPID shit diet wise that wasn't what I usually do and I knew wasn't sustainable for me. And then didn't wanna conversate about it on top of that. Aka wouldn't tell me WHY. I'm a physicist, you have to be able to tell me why if I'm gonna do something.

 

[TheOtherOne55]

Honestly, coaching is MFer.

I coach people AND get coached and its apples to orange on how coaches should and do conversate and relate to their athletes.
I'm using Justin Harris right now. And to even get to that point, i do my freaking research. Everything he thinks about training and nutrition, i am kind of in the same camp. He believes is keeping it simple and consistent and over time you can get freakishly huge and freakishly lean playing the long game. Thats exactly how my brain works so just shooting back and forth emails with him, i knew we would work well together. The best fit for an athlete usually takes research.

For instance, I like AJ Sims. He turned one of my buddies pro. But just from my own research, I knew philosophy wise we wouldn't click. The point I'm making it don't chalk up coaches as a shit investment because you and he did not fit.

Also, some competitors was a sound board and to be buddies with a coach. Others just want their plan every week and that's it. Which one are you? Which side does your coach belong on? That shit matters. Personally, i just need my plan and if I have questions, I'll ask. But when I coach athletes, I'm much more accepting of them just wanting to bullshit and chat with me.

 

[thethinker48]

Honestly, coaching is MFer.

I coach people AND get coached and its apples to orange on how coaches should and do conversate and relate to their athletes.
I'm using Justin Harris right now. And to even get to that point, i do my freaking research. Everything he thinks about training and nutrition, i am kind of in the same camp. He believes is keeping it simple and consistent and over time you can get freakishly huge and freakishly lean playing the long game. Thats exactly how my brain works so just shooting back and forth emails with him, i knew we would work well together. The best fit for an athlete usually takes research.

For instance, I like AJ Sims. He turned one of my buddies pro. But just from my own research, I knew philosophy wise we wouldn't click. The point I'm making it don't chalk up coaches as a shit investment because you and he did not fit.

Also, some competitors was a sound board and to be buddies with a coach. Others just want their plan every week and that's it. Which one are you? Which side does your coach belong on? That shit matters. Personally, i just need my plan and if I have questions, I'll ask. But when I coach athletes, I'm much more accepting of them just wanting to bullshit and chat with me.

Coaches lots of times have 2 types of clients; soldiers and scientists

Soldiers just follow everything to a T, and don't care much for the why

The scientist needs the reason, and is probably the type that will take things from that experience which can be used for life. This is the person that gets the most bang for the buck in that regard

I'm sure each coach has a preference for their type too. If I had to hire someone; it'd probably be someone like Scott Stevenson who likes educating more than giving straight commands (I think Justin's like that too; he has a hard science background and quantitative mind)

 

[juggy38]

I’ve worked with coaches and do better. I push too hard, diet too hard, bulk too much. And I’m flip floppy. If I pay for a plan I fucking nail it

 

[juggy38]

I want to hire Paul carter or Dusty next. They both monderare-low volume high intensity, which I enjoy most

 

[zacharykane]

It was all completely diet related. The last few weeks before a show, my metabolism is basically out of control, and I need to eat a ton to keep from losing muscle and fullness. I even detailed out exactly what I had done in the past that got me to about 80% of where I could be fullness and dryness wise.

Filling out after making weight is also an exercise in shit loading, as it's the only real way I can come remotely close to filling back out. This past year at USAs, after making middles right on the dot, we did a very mild load which I expressed concerns about it being too little, but also wanted to do listen to what I was being told, as that was the reason I hired a coach. I came in the next day barely full, and could hardly get a pump.

Thinking we learned that I needed to load like crazy, I went on to North Americans, weighed in on Tuesday so I had until Saturday to fill out (I looked my best around 188, and sucked down to 176.25 to make middles). Well after making weight, he had me keep eating like I was trying to suck down a weight class until the Friday, then I had maybe 200g of carbs. The whole time I kept saying "this isn't right, we did this show so I could load back up to where I look my best." I looked like absolute garbage on stage, and dropped 5 placings from USAs putting me out of the top ten for the first time in my career.

So the long and short of it, I can get myself 90% of the way there, and just need someone who actually listens to what has worked, can help me implement that, and tell me no when I get batshit crazy ideas like wanting to do extra cardio and fat burners when I don't need either.

Question Zach, did you know any of his protocols going in? Like what were some things that he had you doing that you KNEW weren't going to work.

 

[zacharykane]

I think this highlights why it's important to basically interview coaches before working with them, to make sure that you're in synch on what exactly you need/want from them. Too many coaches make it seem like the client should be grateful for the "honor" of being coached by *insert big name coach here*. Whereas it should really be the other way around, in that the coaches should be selling themselves to prospective clients on what they can do for them. Too many big egos and too many people thinking the big name coach has the secrets to bringing out the best in people. Having met more than a few of these coaches, I can honestly say the ones that truly just enjoy the sport vs the ones that work with people in an attempt to gain attention are few and far between.

I'm the same way though, in that I need to know the "why" behind doing something, and the first coach I worked with was great at explaining the why and also implementing my feedback. Unfortunately he retired, otherwise I would still work with him.

I had an issue similar to your second experience for the new york minute I tried a coach in the past. I've done this alot, and while I haven't WON any shows like you have on your own, I have a really good idea about what I can handle and what works and what doesn't for me. The person I had a little help from basically cookie cuttered a bunch of STUPID shit diet wise that wasn't what I usually do and I knew wasn't sustainable for me. And then didn't wanna conversate about it on top of that. Aka wouldn't tell me WHY. I'm a physicist, you have to be able to tell me why if I'm gonna do something.

 

[zacharykane]

Can confirm, you get a plan you WORK the plan

I’ve worked with coaches and do better. I push too hard, diet too hard, bulk too much. And I’m flip floppy. If I pay for a plan I fucking nail it

 

[b-boy]

I have used coaches and I have coached myself, every year I did north Americans I coached myself, top 5 every time out. I use coaches just to learn different things, I use coaches as a college professor, I get the plan and ask questions if I do not fully understand why we are doing certain things, I expect a complete knowledge filled answer or I kick you to the curb as thats why I payed you $$$. I researched my coaches very thoroughly and if I cannot get a shit load of info on how they do things then I will hire them for offseason work first to see how they set up diets and how they make adjustments and how attentive they are before I ever get them involved in prepping me for a show (I made this mistake in the past and learned my lesson). Guys like Scoobyprep and shelby, John Meadows, and Justin Harris, Layne Norton I knew enough about them to just start prep with them and go.
About to start my next college course with Alex Kikel with my offseason, then decide if I want to do maybe a masters pro show in 2021.

 

[b-boy]

Just received my plan from Alex, holy shit balls its very thorough. A lot to read and take in.

 

[11111]

I have used coaches and I have coached myself, every year I did north Americans I coached myself, top 5 every time out. I use coaches just to learn different things, I use coaches as a college professor, I get the plan and ask questions if I do not fully understand why we are doing certain things, I expect a complete knowledge filled answer or I kick you to the curb as thats why I payed you $$$. I researched my coaches very thoroughly and if I cannot get a shit load of info on how they do things then I will hire them for offseason work first to see how they set up diets and how they make adjustments and how attentive they are before I ever get them involved in prepping me for a show (I made this mistake in the past and learned my lesson). Guys like Scoobyprep and shelby, John Meadows, and Justin Harris, Layne Norton I knew enough about them to just start prep with them and go.
About to start my next college course with Alex Kikel with my offseason, then decide if I want to do maybe a masters pro show in 2021.

Just received my plan from Alex, holy shit balls its very thorough. A lot to read and take in.

Bboy, what are your main goals this offseason? (besides the obvious)...

 

[Elvia1023]

I do this for fun and have never competed. I don't use a coach and do everything myself. Any lack of progress in the past is all down to my consistency.