continued discussion......

[alan1973]

we’re speaking about conflicts hundreds or thousands of years ago when death tallies were not a priority or of mild interest like they are today....but about 809 million people have died in religious wars. That’s nearly a billion people. all the other wars combined don't come close
if we take the Bible literally, then God killed about... oh, well let's see..

2,038,344 people? Not including, I believe, the flood.

All numbers are estimates...even current wars' estimates can be greatly off.

 

[alan1973]

i did want to continue this debate, but let's face it....no gods killed anyone, people did. their ignorance of the true meaning of their religion is what caused it and shame on them for attaching their religion to their cause (usually it's political, about power or about money or land).
Religion in general is good, what is bad is when thinks they have to "save" me from my religion....that is just wrong. I have friends of many different religions and I chose those folks that do not judge. I respect all religions, I don't respect people that abuse their religion with others. Religion in general is supposed to make people better....fine, you make yourself better your way and I will mine.
PEACE 2 ALL!

 

[pesty4077]

i did want to continue this debate, but let's face it....no gods killed anyone, people did. their ignorance of the true meaning of their religion is what caused it and shame on them for attaching their religion to their cause (usually it's political, about power or about money or land).
Religion in general is good, what is bad is when thinks they have to "save" me from my religion....that is just wrong. I have friends of many different religions and I chose those folks that do not judge. I respect all religions, I don't respect people that abuse their religion with others. Religion in general is supposed to make people better....fine, you make yourself better your way and I will mine.
PEACE 2 ALL!

One of the best posts I heard, I can't argue with that. Well said!

 

[PsyT]

I agree with most of what you said, but I think you cannot abstract the religion away from the institution and the actual people involved.

 

[bloodshed]

i did want to continue this debate, but let's face it....no gods killed anyone, people did. their ignorance of the true meaning of their religion is what caused it and shame on them for attaching their religion to their cause (usually it's political, about power or about money or land).
Religion in general is good, what is bad is when thinks they have to "save" me from my religion....that is just wrong. I have friends of many different religions and I chose those folks that do not judge. I respect all religions, I don't respect people that abuse their religion with others. Religion in general is supposed to make people better....fine, you make yourself better your way and I will mine.
PEACE 2 ALL!

they kill in the name of god, which is proof people are incapable of religion.

 

[jalsmiley]

religion was invented back in at time when there was a class system, where the rich and noblemen needed a way to keep the pleebs and common men which outnumbered them by the millions under control...
for those who have faith, great...it keeps you happy and moral, for those who dont believe, you can still be moral and happy

 

[loftros]

God never killed people..people killed people they saw as different. On the street would you be able to tell the difference from a russian catholic and a russian atheist? I doubt it. These wars occurred because of made-up belief systems that made people more different. In other words, it's just like race....except religion isn't quite as "real".

 

[myosin]

MAYBE a different discussion board?

I know the great difficulties religion can pose. Several times I almost "lost my faith." As mentioned before I am a minister studying for my M.Div. We are grilled on all the different religions and how they might be similar but also where they differ and their origins.

My friends, as important a topic this is, and one that I dedicate my life to, might I suggest to discuss these things at a religious discussion board? It is just WAY TO BIG AND DEEP to get an answer through a few threads here.

Also, it's just way to easy to read with bias. Many people come with preconceived notions and then only absorb what will support their belief, even when overwhelming evidence may prove otherwise... good 'ol fashioned pride (we ALL have it). As mentioned, I almost gave up my faith a couple times, but all my research keeps bringing me back to it.

I mentioned this in one other thread and I will share it here as well
Reasonable Faith: (it will answer MANY questions and objections)
CARM - Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry

Look up Lee Strobel as well.

Please, I say all this with great respect. So can we move on?

 

[buselmo]

religion was invented back in at time when there was a class system, where the rich and noblemen needed a way to keep the pleebs and common men which outnumbered them by the millions under control...
for those who have faith, great...it keeps you happy and moral, for those who dont believe, you can still be moral and happy

there you have it...

you have to keep in mind that the majority of the human race (sorry to say this and offend anyone) can't think on it's own and we would probably be worse than animals if we didn't have someone say "if you do this, you'll burn for eternity"

most people i know (i'm talking 99%) truly believe that without religion, the world would be in a chaotic state (like it's not in that state right now), and without that "order" to not commit crimes. MORAL people have that sense without the need for a "god" to tell them that... but sadly, notmany moral people around. anyway, the premise is great, but the practice turned out to be an experiment gone bad...
those that had the "power" to talk to god, had this in mind "I want an orderly world, according to my definition of order, and anyone who opposes should be eliminated"

ended up to be a power struggle for land, money, and power in every case of religion ever documented in history.

it's a double edged sword... without religion, you'd have a lot of retards running around thinking they could do what they want if there isn't a god to judge them (murder, steal, rape... etc.), yet with a religion, those same idiots listen to the guy that says "these people want to secretly kill all ofyou and rape your women, so go and wrap these bombs on your chest, blow them up, and you'll end up in heaven with all the women you want to plow, all the food you'd like to eat, and all the crap you ever dreamed of"

it's sad really

 

[VNV]

Respecting religion is for pussies. You have to show respect for people, but you don't have to respect their ideas. If someone told me they believe the microwave works by using magic, I'd think they're an idiot. Just like if they told me a god created the world in seven days. I'd show them respect by not making fun of them, but I'd sure as hell still think they're an idiot.

 

[hawkmoon]

I'll let Richard Dawkins (a personal hero) do the talking for me:

My point is not that religion itself is the motivation for wars, murders and terrorist attacks, but that religion is the principal label, and the most dangerous one, by which a "they" as opposed to a "we" can be identified at all.

Society bends over backward to be accommodating to religious sensibilities but not to other kinds of sensibilities. If I say something offensive to religious people, I'll be universally censured, including by many atheists. But if I say something insulting about Democrats or Republicans or the Green Party, one is allowed to get away with that. Hiding behind the smoke screen of untouchability is something religions have been allowed to get away with for too long.

I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world.

Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.

 

[Big A]

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