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couple HRT ?s + good total test/very low estrogen?

Matsuo Munefusa

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Hey guys,

got some bloodwork back....I've been off HCG for a few months now. Just on low dose testosterone and a lowish dose of primo. No AI, no nolvadex (nothing). My total test level came back 759 which feels good to me. I'd like to maybe bump it up a little bit.

But more concerning to me is my estrogen level is completely tanked. It is reading <5 currently. My libido is fine and my recovery is going good....maybe my joints are suffering a bit because of this though?

I added HCG at 200iu EOD now and will retest hoping it bumps my test up a bit and more importantly my estrogen.

Has anybody ever experienced this (normal test level with abnormally low estrogen level)? Is this because of high SHBG??? I'm pretty lean right now (for me at least, not on a cutting diet or anything) - around 10% - and am aware that lowers aromatase enzyme I guess?

Thanks for advice :)

ps I am also on inject curcumin but I stopped that today since I don't know if it is causing a problem?
 
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Matsuo Munefusa

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couple more points, I microdose the test everyday at 15mg/day. Been doing this for a LONG time. I feel like for some reason this may have raised my SHBG? I have been seeing lower and lower estrogen value over the last 2-3 years since I started doing this. It wasn't until this year I dropped my aromasin because of low estrogen reading earlier this year. That was a relief as I hate aromasin but my estrogen still remains tanked :/

any help would be appreciated....maybe it is as simple as just adding EOD shots of HCG and doing EOD shots of 30mg test E (instead of doing ED shots of 15mg test e?)

if just adding EOD shots of HCG doesn't give me improved estrogen reading in 2 weeks from now (when I get blood work again) then I will try to go to larger test shots EOD instead of ED.

Any other thoughts?

I even thought to add 5-10mg of dianabol in per day to give a little wetness to my joints but then I figured thats a bad road to head down because I can't run that for long without affecting my lipids/liver values :/

Any idea would be appreciated/considered :cool:
 
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bad rad

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I have low SHBG but also barely aromatize my TRT. While logic says to inject more often with smaller doses I don't feel as well as 2x injects weekly. This is without hCG and even with it all I really get as a benefit is E2 numbers in range as my nuts don't respond much. I've been considering the D-bol option too. It can't be any worse for my liver than weeks of NSAIDs.
 
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Kaladryn

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How long have you been off the aromasin? I found that aromasin had killed my E2 also, I think the suicidal effect has increasing results over time, no one has really studied long-term usage of this stuff in men.

Definitely strange to have E2 that low with test that high IMO.
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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How long have you been off the aromasin? I found that aromasin had killed my E2 also, I think the suicidal effect has increasing results over time, no one has really studied long-term usage of this stuff in men.

Definitely strange to have E2 that low with test that high IMO.

I have been off aromasin for about 4 months now. I kept tapering it smaller and smaller doses....no joke at the end I was taking 6.25mg 2x/week only. Until even that I could notice was drying my joints out too much so I stopped and felt better for sure.

But now I get this bloodwork expecting estrogen to be normal and its rock bottom :confused:

The only explanation I can come up with is that my SHBG is sky high and my total test is being completely bound up by SHBG so it cannot convert to estrogen....does that make sense to you as a possible explanation? :confused:

I suppose I should bite the bullet and get SHBG and free test added on to my next round of bloodwork....
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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I have low SHBG but also barely aromatize my TRT. While logic says to inject more often with smaller doses I don't feel as well as 2x injects weekly. This is without hCG and even with it all I really get as a benefit is E2 numbers in range as my nuts don't respond much. I've been considering the D-bol option too. It can't be any worse for my liver than weeks of NSAIDs.

yeah dude, you know one of the times I felt best in my life I was on low dose test, 2iu gh, and 10mg dbol/day........it is tempting......but man I really want to try to take care of my health and I am not sure dianabol fits into a longterm protocol :star-:ars
 

bad rad

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5mg daily for 6weeks then 2 weeks off was the prescription TRT dosage for Ciba D-bol. I bet one beer has more negative effects than that.
 

blaze918

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Somewhat random question - with such low E levels do you notice less sensitivity/feeling in the bedroom?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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Somewhat random question - with such low E levels do you notice less sensitivity/feeling in the bedroom?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

dude, this is why it surprised me so much that I got low estrogen reading like this...in the bedroom there is absolutely zero problems. I'm hard as I ever was, sensitive as ever, orgasms are strong/good volume. There is literally zero problem :confused:

It makes the situation even more confusing to be honest that there aren't "problems"

I've been using the HCG now, on my 3rd EOD dose and I can already tell a difference. I also filled out a good bit, I'm guessing its mostly water because its only been a week. The only real "symptom" I could find was that my weight had stalled even though my calories were up. I'm guessing the old adage that you need estrogen to grow is TRUE and I'm hoping now I can play catch up if the HCG causes estrogen to rise.

I'll report back in to you guys in 2 weeks and hopefully be telling you that my estrogen is in the 20-30 range....and I guess I will just need to run HCG year around then?
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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5mg daily for 6weeks then 2 weeks off was the prescription TRT dosage for Ciba D-bol. I bet one beer has more negative effects than that.

You're like the little guy on my shoulder giving me advice I want to hear :D I'm not gonna check if you have a halo or horns though, I may just run with your advice :):headbang:
 

bad rad

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dude, this is why it surprised me so much that I got low estrogen reading like this...in the bedroom there is absolutely zero problems. I'm hard as I ever was, sensitive as ever, orgasms are strong/good volume. There is literally zero problem :confused:

It makes the situation even more confusing to be honest that there aren't "problems"

I've been using the HCG now, on my 3rd EOD dose and I can already tell a difference. I also filled out a good bit, I'm guessing its mostly water because its only been a week. The only real "symptom" I could find was that my weight had stalled even though my calories were up. I'm guessing the old adage that you need estrogen to grow is TRUE and I'm hoping now I can play catch up if the HCG causes estrogen to rise.

I'll report back in to you guys in 2 weeks and hopefully be telling you that my estrogen is in the 20-30 range....and I guess I will just need to run HCG year around then?

Estrogen plays a big role in insulin sensitivity too. I once ran 500iu hCG E3D with .625 Letro E3D for HRT and I had zero E2 levels. The confusing part is my libido was sky high, great erectile strength and my test levels were in the 400's. My libido was comparable to running Tren.

I'm really considering the 5mg/day after this thread.
 
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Matsuo Munefusa

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Estrogen plays a big role in insulin sensitivity too. I once ran 500iu hCG E3D with .625 Letro E3D for HRT and I had zero E2 levels. The confusing part is my libido was sky high, great erectile strength and my test levels were in the 400's. My libido was comparable to running Tren.

I'm really considering the 5mg/day after this thread.

yeah dude, I have a late winter/early spring cycle planned....was just going to be test/gh/insulin but I may add 10mg dbol a day to it now :)
 

bad rad

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I haven't cycled in years. Just can't plan one out with constant distractions from work. I'd start with 5mg/day of D-bol. It is underrated at low dose. I only cycle 15-20mgs when I use it.
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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I haven't cycled in years. Just can't plan one out with constant distractions from work. I'd start with 5mg/day of D-bol. It is underrated at low dose. I only cycle 15-20mgs when I use it.

yeah I don't cycle really much anymore either, can't stand the sides. This cycle will only be 350mg test for AAS and perhaps low dose dbol. The real work is eating the food and the GH/slin helps metabolize/use that.

Getting older cycling seems less and less important, rather be on low dose regimen that I can run forever that doesn't impact health than shoot up and down with AAS.
 

blaze918

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dude, this is why it surprised me so much that I got low estrogen reading like this...in the bedroom there is absolutely zero problems. I'm hard as I ever was, sensitive as ever, orgasms are strong/good volume. There is literally zero problem :confused:

It makes the situation even more confusing to be honest that there aren't "problems"

I've been using the HCG now, on my 3rd EOD dose and I can already tell a difference. I also filled out a good bit, I'm guessing its mostly water because its only been a week. The only real "symptom" I could find was that my weight had stalled even though my calories were up. I'm guessing the old adage that you need estrogen to grow is TRUE and I'm hoping now I can play catch up if the HCG causes estrogen to rise.

I'll report back in to you guys in 2 weeks and hopefully be telling you that my estrogen is in the 20-30 range....and I guess I will just need to run HCG year around then?

That's crazy. I wonder if the testing was off? Or perhaps you have to have low E levels for an extended period of time before you start experiencing all the side effects? Interested to see where you estrogen level are at in a couple weeks.
 

LATS

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How long have you been off the aromasin? I found that aromasin had killed my E2 also, I think the suicidal effect has increasing results over time, no one has really studied long-term usage of this stuff in men.

Definitely strange to have E2 that low with test that high IMO.

As I've stated in other posts I take 25 mgs of test a day sub q.. I was taking aromasin 6 mgs eod ( three times a week.. ) .. Also dim at 200mg a day..for about a month I felt great.. Then came the achy joints.. No libido.. Had e2 test done.. Came back 15.. I convinced, like you, that AROMASIN has a cumulative effect and even at low dose it will tank your e2 eventually.. Those who think aromasin can't tank your e2 are kidding themselves.. Most cite a study showing 25 mgs a day DIDNT tank estro.. But the study ended in 3 weeks and did show a decline each week of ESTRo.. By doing simple math we can assume that in the following weeks it would tank.. I will get bloods done with just Dim in a few weeks.. If ESTRO is elevated I will try arimidex at low dose ( no more than 1 mg a week.. regardless of ESTRO results) ..
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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Thanks LATS....you know it wasn't until talking with you on the board that I managed to get my head out of my ass with aromasin. I had been so trained to always take aromasin every week...OR ELSE...I never thought that it could be healthy to go OFF it. So thank you for causing me to think about my TRT regimen because obviously it wasn't working for me before to keep doing what had worked in years past.

I'm a week and ahalf into HCG and DAMN do I feel better. I'm gonna keep running it to get my numbers stabilized a little more but I can already tell it feels good to have estrogen. My bodyweight went up a few lbs and my strength went up and I look a bit leaner too and haven't really changed diet at all either. Excited to see what another couple weeks on this new regimen does for my training/physique.

I still don't regret going on TRT years and years ago but guys I really wasn't aware I would have to be changing my regimen every year or two to adjust to growing older, bloodwork going into and out of range, medicines' cumulative effect. Still no regrets, I love having elevated test levels, but damn it does become a bit of a burden over the years to keep test/IGF levels up....
 

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