Cycles (bulk/cut) over 50

[MajinBoo]

The doses and the fact that you said his coach is from Spain were enough for me and I already know who his coach is

If we talk about a "popular" spanish coach and high doses, that's a easy one

 

[RepZZ]

Thanks for the kind words, much appreciated. I take daily:
TUDCA
Astragalus
Fish oil
Plant phenols
Betain HCL
Berberine
Red rice yeast
Krill oil
Curcumin/tumeric
CoQ10
D3/K2
Men's multi
Jardiance
Entrusto (sp)
Metropolol
Crestor

Is this overkill. Yes, probably. But it's just my daily habit and I don't mind it. I take these in the AM and PM. Bloodwork is fine. LDL was around 160 and my doc wanted it lower, so that's why I added the generic version of Crestor. The heart meds are due to an A-fib event I had after getting the second jab of the Pfizer COVID vaccine (what a PA at the Cleveland Clinic called the "clot shot"). My BP is 110/80, but my ejection fraction (EF) is still on the low side and therefore the Jardiance and Entrusto. Calcium score was an 11 (almost no hardened plaque), and I got a catheterization done in December, and everything is clear.

I plan to stick with the EQ and NPP from week 24 down to week 14, then switch over to primo and mast (likely at 300mg/wk each). I may forgo the primo altogether, we'll see. Then I'll likely introduce an oral such as winstrol in the last 3-4 weeks. Low dose tren A at 10mg/day is an option at 4-6 weeks out, but not presently in the plan.

I'm planning on putting together a log with pics for this. It helps my progress as the posting makes me feel accountable to people! LOL

I'm using 60% of that. No Telmisartan? I like Telmisartan, amlodipine (if needed), crestor and zetia. I would think about natto kinase and baby aspirin. Solid list. I'll shoot you some DM occasionally to pick your brain. I using 350 test and 200 Deca but the deca is giving me sides for the first time

 

[warlock]

One of my close friends is a masters 212 pro, he is 59 this year. He works with a popular coach in Spain. He competed in bodybuilding for over 20 years, and was an athlete in other sports before that.

His off-season is typically 1000-1500/300-600/300 test, eq or primo, and deca. He uses anavar sometimes in off-season. Gh 4-6iu. Contest prep is typical 350/350/350 test tren mast, anavar and winstrol last 2-4 weeks. Gh 6-8iu.

Sometime last year his body stopped responding like usual. Wasn't responding to food, training, or drugs.

His bloodwork showed that his blood glucose, fasted insulin, CRP, ESR (sedimentation rate) were starting to elevate.
He ended off-season and went to cruise 400 test, his inflammation and insulin sensitivity got worse.
Some diet changes, detox, peptides (BPC/TB/KPV,MotsC,Reta) and not much improvement.
He lowered to 250 test, lowered his protein from 300g to 200g, kept carbs around 200g every day, fats are always low-moderate (10-30g added fats), and things started to improve.
3 months later, after more regular cardio (daily 30 minutes LISS became daily 60 minutes, and added 3 HIIT sessions per week), and he's sleeping better, stress and inflammation markers came down, responding to food and training again.
He tried to start an off-season with 750 test and kept food low, but by 3-4 weeks in he felt miserable, fasted blood glucose was >100, couldn't sleep. His body said enough is enough. No more competitions.

Now he is just on trt 250, 3iu gh. Trains 5 days a week, LISS every day, HIIT 2-3 times a week, protein is low, carbs moderate.

Why do I mention this? Some guys are in their 50s and still pushing their bodies to the limits. Some guys are in their 50s just on trt and trying to maintain and preserve whatever health they have. Some guys say it depends on how long you've been training and pushing your bodies, some say neither of those matter. What you do is ultimately based on your goals and expectations, what you're willing to put your body through, and what your body is willing to tolerate. What someone else does might not have any relevance for you or your body. But it can be helpful or at least entertaining to learn other perspectives.

Can you share the name of such coach?

 

[tommyguns2]

I'm using 60% of that. No Telmisartan? I like Telmisartan, amlodipine (if needed), crestor and zetia. I would think about natto kinase and baby aspirin. Solid list. I'll shoot you some DM occasionally to pick your brain. I using 350 test and 200 Deca but the deca is giving me sides for the first time

I was on Losartan, and it had no sides, but my BP was still regularly around 140/90. So my doc pulled the Losartan and added in the Entresto, which is Valsartan + Sacubitril. That brought my BP right down to 110/80, and combined with the Jardiance and Metropolol is supposed to help with my ejection fraction.

I've never run Deca before, but I've run NPP a number of times, and never have any problem with it. But I've never run more than 300mg/week.

 

[mimo]

Can you share the name of such coach?

My guess: Frqncisco Espin

 

[luki7788]

My guess: Frqncisco Espin

Do you really think it’s appropriate to mention someone by name here?
Those who need to know, know. In my opinion you shouldn’t be bringing up any coach by name like this, especially if something is off. You could’ve just sent a private message instead of posting it on a public forum.

Maybe others guys see it differently, but to me it’s a bit inappropriate.

 

[primobolan]

Over 50 the only thing you should be focused on is recomping and maintaining. All other ships have passed. I also believe the arsenal should be narrowed to only Test, GH and Reta. Reta more so for the health benefits as opposed to fat loss because if you’re over 50 you should already be staying very lean.

 

[Heath82]

Do you really think it’s appropriate to mention someone by name here?
Those who need to know, know. In my opinion you shouldn’t be bringing up any coach by name like this, especially if something is off. You could’ve just sent a private message instead of posting it on a public forum.

Maybe others guys see it differently, but to me it’s a bit inappropriate.

Shows who to stay away from

 

[RepZZ]

Over 50 the only thing you should be focused on is recomping and maintaining. All other ships have passed. I also believe the arsenal should be narrowed to only Test, GH and Reta. Reta more so for the health benefits as opposed to fat loss because if you’re over 50 you should already be staying very lean.

I still have some fire in me. I understand what you are saying and I'm monitoring my health closely. I still have some goals that I would like to chase. Kids, work and all got in the way. Now I'm hoping to maybe do 1 show as my bucket list item. I should have years ago when mass came more easily. I maintain a low bodyfat but would like to gain some more muscle and see how I look when i diet back down. Regret is a bitch but I am very much listening as longevity is a priority.

 

[mimo]

Do you really think it’s appropriate to mention someone by name here?
Those who need to know, know. In my opinion you shouldn’t be bringing up any coach by name like this, especially if something is off. You could’ve just sent a private message instead of posting it on a public forum.

Maybe others guys see it differently, but to me it’s a bit inappropriate.

Dude, i have no idea if it's Espin or not. He's just spanish and known for high dose cycles and delivering results. Just like Chad Nichols was known for pushing it. There's no judgement from me, as the people who want to work with him know what they're getting into. Just like Milos and insulin.

There's nothing wrong with that.

 

[tommyguns2]

Over 50 the only thing you should be focused on is recomping and maintaining. All other ships have passed. I also believe the arsenal should be narrowed to only Test, GH and Reta. Reta more so for the health benefits as opposed to fat loss because if you’re over 50 you should already be staying very lean.

I understand what you're saying here, and I appreciate the heart in which you're saying it. But for guys like me, I married young, had kids young, and spent my 20s, 30s and early 40s at ballet practice, soccer practice, basketball practice, karate practice, wrestling tournaments in the evenings, and building my business during the day, and working hard to keep a good marriage strong and healthy during all of that.

So my ability to train hard like a bodybuilder was limited. Yes, I trained very early in the morning most days as a natural, and started TRT in my 40s. But now I've sold my business (still working as a W-2 employee there) and the kids are all grown up and out of the house. So I've still got my healthy marriage (thank goodness), but now I have some time and energy to dedicate to reasonable bodybuilding as a hobby. To say, "you're done, you're over 50" just doesn't resonate with me. Sure, I won't be running > 2g of anabolics and doing things that youngsters do, but that doesn't mean I can't intelligently push myself, continue to build some muscle (like the tortoise, slow and steady), and stay nice and lean.

Just not ready to say my life is over with respect to pushing myself and continuing to improve. In my view, my best physique is still in the future.

 

[luki7788]

Shows who to stay away from

Dude, i have no idea if it's Espin or not. He's just spanish and known for high dose cycles and delivering results. Just like Chad Nichols was known for pushing it. There's no judgement from me, as the people who want to work with him know what they're getting into. Just like Milos and insulin.

There's nothing wrong with that.

You misunderstood me. I don’t have anything against @mimo I just think that you shouldn’t publicly say negative things about anyone. Maybe not even “negative,” but you know what I mean.
Not every coach prioritizes health, that’s true. But like you said, anyone who chooses to work with him knows what they’re signing up for. So for me personally, when I said I know which coach it is, I just didn’t want to mention his name. People who are in the industry will know anyway.

So yeah, you’re right.

 

[mimo]

You misunderstood me. I don’t have anything against @mimo I just think that you shouldn’t publicly say negative things about anyone. Maybe not even “negative,” but you know what I mean.
Not every coach prioritizes health, that’s true. But like you said, anyone who chooses to work with him knows what they’re signing up for. So for me personally, when I said I know which coach it is, I just didn’t want to mention his name. People who are in the industry will know anyway.

So yeah, you’re right.

Yeah that's what i meant. It just is what it is and it's not like it's a secret. Like i said, no judgement from me.

 

[RepZZ]

I understand what you're saying here, and I appreciate the heart in which you're saying it. But for guys like me, I married young, had kids young, and spent my 20s, 30s and early 40s at ballet practice, soccer practice, basketball practice, karate practice, wrestling tournaments in the evenings, and building my business during the day, and working hard to keep a good marriage strong and healthy during all of that.

So my ability to train hard like a bodybuilder was limited. Yes, I trained very early in the morning most days as a natural, and started TRT in my 40s. But now I've sold my business (still working as a W-2 employee there) and the kids are all grown up and out of the house. So I've still got my healthy marriage (thank goodness), but now I have some time and energy to dedicate to reasonable bodybuilding as a hobby. To say, "you're done, you're over 50" just doesn't resonate with me. Sure, I won't be running > 2g of anabolics and doing things that youngsters do, but that doesn't mean I can't intelligently push myself, continue to build some muscle (like the tortoise, slow and steady), and stay nice and lean.

Just not ready to say my life is over with respect to pushing myself and continuing to improve. In my view, my best physique is still in the future.

I'm in the same boat. Now that my kids are grown and i can really focus, I want to see what i have in the tank in the healthiest way possible. What compounds do you prefer and which ones do you dislike at this age.

 

[hawkmoon]

I understand what you're saying here, and I appreciate the heart in which you're saying it. But for guys like me, I married young, had kids young, and spent my 20s, 30s and early 40s at ballet practice, soccer practice, basketball practice, karate practice, wrestling tournaments in the evenings, and building my business during the day, and working hard to keep a good marriage strong and healthy during all of that.

So my ability to train hard like a bodybuilder was limited. Yes, I trained very early in the morning most days as a natural, and started TRT in my 40s. But now I've sold my business (still working as a W-2 employee there) and the kids are all grown up and out of the house. So I've still got my healthy marriage (thank goodness), but now I have some time and energy to dedicate to reasonable bodybuilding as a hobby. To say, "you're done, you're over 50" just doesn't resonate with me. Sure, I won't be running > 2g of anabolics and doing things that youngsters do, but that doesn't mean I can't intelligently push myself, continue to build some muscle (like the tortoise, slow and steady), and stay nice and lean.

Just not ready to say my life is over with respect to pushing myself and continuing to improve. In my view, my best physique is still in the future.

I'm 57 this year and I'm far from done.

People just need to learn, apply that knowledge and not be an idiot. Not saying anyone here is, but too often the signals are obvious but ignored. A good coach that gives a shit helps as well. If my blood work or BP was looking bad I'd be making changes.

As it is my only concern really is just the bodyweight, even though lean. I plan to compete this year and there are others here in Japan that keep going decades more than I.

 

[tommyguns2]

I'm in the same boat. Now that my kids are grown and i can really focus, I want to see what i have in the tank in the healthiest way possible. What compounds do you prefer and which ones do you dislike at this age.

Test, NPP and GH. All pretty low dose. Running the following right now

Test 50md ED
EQ 30mg ED
NPP 20mg ED
GH 5 IU ED

EQ has never done anything for me but I’m trying again LOL

 

[gauge22-v2]

I am 55. Go read my thread in the link below.

I am a savage with tracking every health metric possible. People think I am crazy for how much shit I have tracked.

I felt great, diet spot on, lots of cardio, everything looked fine, had a heart attack.

LAD Stent - cautionary tale? Do not be a fucking moron like me

Thought about not posting this, then reconsidered as there might be others in a similar spot. Heart disease is in the family. Dad died at 45 from a massive heart attack. Due to this I have been quite active on getting scans done, stress tests etc. The last big round of these was in 2023 (if I...

www.professionalmuscle.com

 

[tommyguns2]

Don’t dislike any compounds but my doses are always so low that sides don’t really kick in. For example, I could take tren A at 10mg ED without any sides and still see aesthetic benefits

 

[FrenchBench22]

I’m 45 and have done great with testosterone and trenbolone

Less than an hour ago, amidst your onslaught of one liner comments bumping 20+ threads, you said you are 35 years old and "just getting into it."

Post in thread 'At what age do you think you will or should stop cycles?'
https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...ill-or-should-stop-cycles.168984/post-3619283

And affirmed that with a photo and restated the age of 45.
Post in thread 'What is muscle maturity?'
https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...s/what-is-muscle-maturity.189927/post-3619245

You also stated your first competition was 2007 OCB. If you're currently 35, you would've been in the teen division, and there's only 2 guys there. One of them.. isn't your complexion.
Post in thread 'Road to my first show'
https://www.professionalmuscle.com/...ads/road-to-my-first-show.190004/post-3619236

So which is it, 35 or 45?

 

[Aikman56]

I just turned 50. Although I am still competing, I find myself using lower dosages every year. Those years of adding milligrams equals added pounds on the scale are long past, and my goal is to maintain as much muscle as possible while not dying.

The idea of “bulking and cutting” should be the furthest thing from one’s mind at our age. I don’t let myself get more than 10 or 15 pounds above my contest weight. And although I do eat a lot in the off-season, it’s always clean food with maybe one truly dirty meal every two or three weeks. I just don’t see the benefit out weighing the risk. Pardon the pun, the juice isn’t worth the squeeze! I’m not running aggressive doses anymore, and if I am using the more toxic compounds, it’s for a far shorter period of time.

When I’m done competing, the length and breath of my PED use will be 200 mg of test a week, 2 to 4iu GH daily, and maybe a GLP if I ever feel I reached the point where I need something like that. Once my competitive days are over, the only cycling that I will consider is maybe bumping the testosterone back up to 600 or 800 mg for 12 weeks once or twice a year.

I realize my little diatribe didn’t add much to the conversation, it’s pretty much what everyone else is saying, but I just wanted to throw my opinion in there, and have it counted among those with a bit of wisdom.