Do you need estrogen to grow? Not using AI on cycle

[7asssa7]

There are some studies and literature indicating that Estrogen is required for muscle hypertrophy, satellite cell/gene expression.
Does this mean that using Aromatase Inhibitors during AAS cycle is counter-productive?

If we look at the study by Bhasin, https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11701431"Testosterone dose-response", the subjects having 300mg or 600mg per week had no fabled increase in SHBG nor any other adverse effects. And that is without any AI use!

Why is that everyone recommends an AI these days then?

 

[thethinker48]

You can't grow if you have hepatic adenomas either...

 

[7asssa7]

You can't grow if you have hepatic adenomas either...

You are right. Elevated estrogen leads to that but I still believe you need just enough estrogen to grow.

What would you suggest to do on Sustanon only at 500-750 mg per week? Arimidex or Aromasin?

 

[heavyhitter]

Personally....I like the way I feel, my sex drive, and the way the rest of my blood work looks when I keep my e2 at around 45-50 on cycle. So depending on my doses of aromatizing compounds, that’s how I gauge my ai dose

 

[thethinker48]

You are right. Elevated estrogen leads to that but I still believe you need just enough estrogen to grow.

What would you suggest to do on Sustanon only at 500-750 mg per week? Arimidex or Aromasin?

Bloodwork my friend.

Everyone aromatizes at a different rate.

Don't spitball AIs, often times guys either tank it too much or don't use enough (but as long as they don't get gyno, they think they're good).

I use Aromasin personally; a bit easier on lipids.

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[buck]

Since it occurs in the body naturally I would assume that there is a need for it.

 

[prodaf]

yes estrogen is very important to grow

 

[hilly2008]

There are some studies and literature indicating that Estrogen is required for muscle hypertrophy, satellite cell/gene expression.

Does this mean that using Aromatase Inhibitors during AAS cycle is counter-productive?



If we look at the study by Bhasin, https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11701431"Testosterone dose-response", the subjects having 300mg or 600mg per week had no fabled increase in SHBG nor any other adverse effects. And that is without any AI use!



Why is that everyone recommends an AI these days then?

Estrogen is required.

I’m yet to read any one recommend enough if an AI to remove all estrogen. Especially on this board.

When people recommend an AI it’s always to control estrogen n stop it getting to high.


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[7asssa7]

yes estrogen is very important to grow

Estrogen is required.

I’m yet to read any one recommend enough if an AI to remove all estrogen. Especially on this board.

When people recommend an AI it’s always to control estrogen n stop it getting to high.


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That is my opinion too! But I need help. I am on 500mg sustanon per week and do not want to shortcut my gains. What would you recommend?

I have both Pharma Grade Arimidex and Aromasin. I read that Aromasin is harsher and literally destroys the aromatese. What would you recommend?

 

[heman4u]

That is my opinion too! But I need help. I am on 500mg sustanon per week and do not want to shortcut my gains. What would you recommend?

I have both Pharma Grade Arimidex and Aromasin. I read that Aromasin is harsher and literally destroys the aromatese. What would you recommend?

Wanted to say exactly what hilly2008 said. And for your above question. Well you dont destroy anything if you use and adjust your dosages according to your E2 blood results.
Finding your perfect AI dosage for your test dose takes time and trials. Just make sure you do the sensitive assay E2 test for males and adjust your dosages as per the results. I would say to go with Aromasin and I would start with as low as 6.25mg EOD. Do blood work couple of weeks later and adjust if required. Good Luck.

 

[mytreefiddy]

Bloodwork my friend.

Everyone aromatizes at a different rate.

This right here..... yes you need it..... just needs to be held in check is all..... but like Thinker said we're all different and aromatize at different rates..... some can take a gram and still not need it.....some can just look at a bottle of Test and nips flare up.... just gotta find out where YOU are

 

[hilly2008]

That is my opinion too! But I need help. I am on 500mg sustanon per week and do not want to shortcut my gains. What would you recommend?



I have both Pharma Grade Arimidex and Aromasin. I read that Aromasin is harsher and literally destroys the aromatese. What would you recommend?

I would take nothing.

Why do you think you need something ? Have u got estro sides. If so then 0.5mg arimidex 3 x a week to star t


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[IronLion2]

Estrogen and Prolactin are needed, thats why progestins are so great for growth. Everything needs to be kept in 'proportion,' though balance in this case is very hard to quantify and since everyone's different it takes a lot of guessing and blood testing to see whats best for YOU!

 

[nothuman]

Dangers of Excess Estrogen in the Aging Male - page 1 | Life Extension

 

[7asssa7]

The studies I am referring to, had subjects on 600mg test E per week and noted no significant adverse effects.

Think about it. The normal reference estrogen references are for NATURAL or TRT males, not folks who inject 500mg+ of test per week.

The body seeks homeostasis and the increase in Estrogen is merely that when injecting 500+ mg

 

[Thaistick]

That is my opinion too! But I need help. I am on 500mg sustanon per week and do not want to shortcut my gains. What would you recommend?

I have both Pharma Grade Arimidex and Aromasin. I read that Aromasin is harsher and literally destroys the aromatese. What would you recommend?

Bloodwork then the necessary amount of aromasin.

 

[ChefTren]

So getting blood work is key. Check. What is the best test to get? Is it a female hormone panel so you get total test?

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[heavyhitter]

I would take nothing.

Why do you think you need something ? Have u got estro sides. If so then 0.5mg arimidex 3 x a week to star t


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Why do people still continue to think that as long as they aren't noticing physical signs then nothing needs to be done? Can everybody here feel what their blood pressure is like? Doubtful...but if its high you need to take care of it. Plenty of people never show any physical signs of cancer and only find out they have it from a check up for something else. Does that mean they don't need chemo? Stop using side effects as a means of determining health and get bloodwork done

 

[bieberhole69]

Here's your simple answer:

EXCESS estrogen isn't needed to grow.

 

[johnjuanb1]

There are some studies and literature indicating that Estrogen is required for muscle hypertrophy, satellite cell/gene expression.
Does this mean that using Aromatase Inhibitors during AAS cycle is counter-productive?

If we look at the study by Bhasin, https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11701431"Testosterone dose-response", the subjects having 300mg or 600mg per week had no fabled increase in SHBG nor any other adverse effects. And that is without any AI use!

Why is that everyone recommends an AI these days then?

I don’t use AI’s for that reason. Estrogen plus testosterone means more muscle.
If i get gyno i add masteron. If it’s persistent then i may consider an AI but the masteron usually does the trick for me.