Doctor gave me cardio scare

[OldManLogan]

So I had a diagnostic CT done for my lungs, which actually revealed a bit of plaque on my heart- calcifications score of 3. Lungs all good.

So went to a cardiologist to learn more about it, what to do/expect etc. No surprises there, since I’ve got diet, weight, exercise and lifestyle dialed in. But after asking me a few questions, he comes back and tells me I have a slight to moderate risk (around 6%) of having a CV event in the next ten years, and I should consider maybe starting a statin. What the fuck…

Mind you, I drink zero alcohol, lipids and kidney function are fucking perfect, quit smoking almost 20 years ago, no diabetes and fully controlled BP- and there is zero history of cardiovascular issues on either side of my family. Then he says he estimates my heart age at 61 (I’m 53)!

I’m like wtf. Flabbergasted.

On my way home, call my best friend who’s a surgeon and he goes “what? How did he arrive at that score?” Then he pauses. “Did they ask your BMI?”

I’m like , “yeah it’s 29.”

“Dude. That’s not going to work. That puts you as overweight and 1 point away from being obese.”

Recalculated score, 2.7%. Good to go!
That fucker almost gave me a heart attack.

Sharing so that maybe one of y’all don’t get an annoying surprise if this happens to you.

Btw calcification score is 3- out of 400. still some but at age 53, I’ll take it.

 

[Sectør]

Out of curiosity did he have any other suggestions for improving heart health other than just taking a statin?

I’m sure a lot of people here (myself included) would be interested in some preventative measures to try to keep the heart as healthy as possible considering our gear use.

That is scary though. So basically they just take your BMI and calcification score and assign a % risk chance based on these two factors? 6% seems rather specific. Just trying to understand what influences the % risk score better. I’m clueless myself on this topic

 

[juiceball44]

BMI is so dumb to me I can have visible abs and be considered obese lol

 

[Fleezy]

According to BMI

I’m already dead

 

[3BILLS]

According to BMI

I’m already dead

You can always come back under a different name

 

[OldManLogan]

Out of curiosity did he have any other suggestions for improving heart health other than just taking a statin?

I’m sure a lot of people here (myself included) would be interested in some preventative measures to try to keep the heart as healthy as possible considering our gear use.

That is scary though. So basically they just take your BMI and calcification score and assign a % risk chance based on these two factors? 6% seems rather specific. Just trying to understand what influences the % risk score better. I’m clueless myself on this topic

All he had was diet and lifestyle, but he was like “I figured you have that covered”- also more vegetables in my diet (I’m actually ok there, too) and less protein for dome reason (Mediterranean diet style)- and he did mention and ask if I held my breath during heavy lifts, because of additions heart strain. That was about it. but I guess he meant well.

He did say if it were up to him, he might have chosen the statin from a long term risk mitigation perspective… but he mentioned the potential side effects, I’m like “ehhh…” but after the revised score, no need.

 

[Reno911]

OP- you didn't mention anything about PED use. What has that looked like? That's going to put some miles on you. Also you mentioned your 53 and quit smoking almost 20 years ago. That means you probably had about 20 years of smoking under your belt which isn't great.

Also, what do your lipids look like including APO B and Lipoprotein (a)?

 

[bbxtreme]

Myself and @nothuman have shared a lot of in depth stuff here on heart health and how to be preventative that I would search back through.

But I fully agree with @Reno911 as there are so many unaccounted factors to consider. Knowing the little I do on here about you I would suggest an echo and a comprehensive blood panel with cardio/lipid/inflammation markers at minimum. It will help you screen for the integrity of your heart- EF rate, any enlargement or valve issues.

Knowing your transformation, age and history of smoking a calcium score of 3 could be considered a blessing by many in your case.

 

[buck]

Last i checked i had a calcification score of about 500. Which gives me a 7% chance of an event in 10 years at my age, which was 62 at that time.
And if a person has a score of zero and is that age they have a 5% chance from my reading. No blockages, good diet all my life, done cardio my whole life, low BP, good glucose and inflammatory marker levels throughout life etc. Several studies i have seen point towards intense training leading to higher calcification in general. at least that is the only negative thing i have found that applies to me. Other then anabolics. I have had lower cholesterol levels all my life which doesn't seem to be optimal from my reading.

 

[seymoor77]

Last i checked i had a calcification score of about 500. Which gives me a 7% chance of an event in 10 years at my age, which was 62 at that time.
And if a person has a score of zero and is that age they have a 5% chance from my reading. No blockages, good diet all my life, done cardio my whole life, low BP, good glucose and inflammatory marker levels throughout life etc. Several studies i have seen point towards intense training leading to higher calcification in general. at least that is the only negative thing i have found that applies to me. Other then anabolics. I have had lower cholesterol levels all my life which doesn't seem to be optimal from my reading.

Almost every endurance athlete has a high calcification score and lower than average cardiac events - in fact, long term lowering of LDL can increase "calcium score" - a plaque is made up of 4 things - one being calcium buildup and one being LDL - statins or newer meds drive the LDL out of the plaque - LDL is softer and can rupture easier resulting in a stroke or heart attack - as you drive the LDL out of the plaque the plaque shrinks and because more calcified and less like to rupture

 

[NEMSZ]

So I had a diagnostic CT done for my lungs, which actually revealed a bit of plaque on my heart- calcifications score of 3. Lungs all good.

So went to a cardiologist to learn more about it, what to do/expect etc. No surprises there, since I’ve got diet, weight, exercise and lifestyle dialed in. But after asking me a few questions, he comes back and tells me I have a slight to moderate risk (around 6%) of having a CV event in the next ten years, and I should consider maybe starting a statin. What the fuck…

Mind you, I drink zero alcohol, lipids and kidney function are fucking perfect, quit smoking almost 20 years ago, no diabetes and fully controlled BP- and there is zero history of cardiovascular issues on either side of my family. Then he says he estimates my heart age at 61 (I’m 53)!

I’m like wtf. Flabbergasted.

On my way home, call my best friend who’s a surgeon and he goes “what? How did he arrive at that score?” Then he pauses. “Did they ask your BMI?”

I’m like , “yeah it’s 29.”

“Dude. That’s not going to work. That puts you as overweight and 1 point away from being obese.”

Recalculated score, 2.7%. Good to go!
That fucker almost gave me a heart attack.

Sharing so that maybe one of y’all don’t get an annoying surprise if this happens to you.

Btw calcification score is 3- out of 400. still some but at age 53, I’ll take it.

I would highly recommend going to see
a Sports Cardiologist, not a regular one..

Here’s my story;

I’m 35, did a CT Calcium score 2 years ago, came back at 15. Did one in January and came back at 17, so not much progression..

I had a wild past, drank a lot, did drugs, ate like shit, did PEDs to make up for it etc. Got sober 8-9 years ago and have been absolutely impeccable with my health ever since. I’ve done 2 Echos and they came back perfectly normal. Lipids have always been in OPTIMAL range, not just normal range, with the exception of naturally lower end HDL of 40 which doesn’t really change no matter what I do.. I’ve also gotten my Apo B and Lipoprotein (a) etc all tested as well and all were good.

Have only been on Test only the last 12 years and real TRT doses the last 8-9 with the exception of the last 2 months I’ve been around 350mg and upped it to 500mg recently with GH the last 2 months at 3iu ED.

I do cardio, very active in BJJ/striking, I eat like 90% healthy with occasional fuck offs here and there, I average 12-15k steps per day etc. My blood pressure has always been around 115-120/70-80..

My doc who’s very progressive and she always gives me whatever tests I want said she sees nothing to worry about etc BUT my paranoia got the best of me so I scheduled with a great Sports Cardiologist down here in SFL..

I actually went to see him a few days ago and he was amazing, he works with athletes, is very familiar with PEDs etc.. He asked and went through every detail of every test and every bit of my past and genetics that could’ve contributed to this.

I even asked about how he felt me pursuing gaining more size/muscle, nothing crazy, maybe like 15-20lbs but not compromising my health to do so and using “healthier options” like only Test and GH to do so given my current tests and history etc..

He literally told me this;

“I don’t see any cardiac risks for you given your lifestyle and health you’ve maintained the last 8-9 years and your tests you’ve provided. What the calcium score means is that there was a lesion, a response to inflammation and your body did its job to repair it.

As for taking anything to pursue your goal, I don’t recommend any other PEDs or Anabolics because we have seen earlier and faster onset of CVD in people who do those things, especially when pushing the limits pharmacologically and pushing their bodies to places it’s not meant to be, but given your approach and modest goals I have no problem with you using either Testosterone or GH either as we don’t usually see cardiac risks with that either so long as it’s moderate and you’re monitoring yourself with your blood work and blood pressure etc. You seem to know all the risks and exactly what to look for so I don’t see you as having any kind of cardiac risks any time soon if you keep up what you’re doing prioritizing your health.”

We even joked about having a follow up in 30-40 years..

He actually asked me if I work in the medical field because I’ve read up and learned so much about this topic with health.

On a side note, he did offer me to have a CT Angiogram for peace of mind, had no problem doing so, which we will do here in a couple weeks.

He even offered a Cardiac MRI but given my other tests and my in depth blood work and current level of health and physical activity he said he didn’t see the need but if I wanted to, he would write me the script but that he couldn’t guarantee insurance would cover that as that would be skipping a few steps like the CTA, so we’re just going with that instead, again, for peace of mind..

Most doctors are not knowledgeable when it comes to athletes and PEDs and don’t even apply real world experiences, they just go by what the book tells them to and MOST of them are completely out of shape too..

Go find a Sports Cardiologist.

 

[buck]

Almost every endurance athlete has a high calcification score and lower than average cardiac events - in fact, long term lowering of LDL can increase "calcium score" - a plaque is made up of 4 things - one being calcium buildup and one being LDL - statins or newer meds drive the LDL out of the plaque - LDL is softer and can rupture easier resulting in a stroke or heart attack - as you drive the LDL out of the plaque the plaque shrinks and because more calcified and less like to rupture

I have seen the studies where they have higher calcification when they get into their 60's as BP is high for all the time they are doing aerobics that seems to be at least 1 factor.
I have also seen numerous studies showing intense aerobics to not be helpful with long term cardiac health.
Seems moderate is best for longevity.
And even lifting weights can lead to the same positive effects from data i have seen.
I did see a study in the early 80's in Runners world magazine. That tracked people that ran marathons throughout their lives and lived 3-4 months longer then average.
Can't say i have seen to many very old people that have done aerobics through out their lives. And running started to be very popular back in the 60's.

 

[Sectør]

I would highly recommend going to see
a Sports Cardiologist, not a regular one..

Here’s my story;

I’m 35, did a CT Calcium score 2 years ago, came back at 15. Did one in January and came back at 17, so not much progression..

I had a wild past, drank a lot, did drugs, ate like shit, did PEDs to make up for it etc. Got sober 8-9 years ago and have been absolutely impeccable with my health ever since. I’ve done 2 Echos and they came back perfectly normal. Lipids have always been in OPTIMAL range, not just normal range, with the exception of naturally lower end HDL of 40 which doesn’t really change no matter what I do.. I’ve also gotten my Apo B and Lipoprotein (a) etc all tested as well and all were good.

Have only been on Test only the last 12 years and real TRT doses the last 8-9 with the exception of the last 2 months I’ve been around 350mg and upped it to 500mg recently with GH the last 2 months at 3iu ED.

I do cardio, very active in BJJ/striking, I eat like 90% healthy with occasional fuck offs here and there, I average 12-15k steps per day etc. My blood pressure has always been around 115-120/70-80..

My doc who’s very progressive and she always gives me whatever tests I want said she sees nothing to worry about etc BUT my paranoia got the best of me so I scheduled with a great Sports Cardiologist down here in SFL..

I actually went to see him a few days ago and he was amazing, he works with athletes, is very familiar with PEDs etc.. He asked and went through every detail of every test and every bit of my past and genetics that could’ve contributed to this.

I even asked about how he felt me pursuing gaining more size/muscle, nothing crazy, maybe like 15-20lbs but not compromising my health to do so and using “healthier options” like only Test and GH to do so given my current tests and history etc..

He literally told me this;

“I don’t see any cardiac risks for you given your lifestyle and health you’ve maintained the last 8-9 years and your tests you’ve provided. What the calcium score means is that there was a lesion, a response to inflammation and your body did its job to repair it.

As for taking anything to pursue your goal, I don’t recommend any other PEDs or Anabolics because we have seen earlier and faster onset of CVD in people who do those things, especially when pushing the limits pharmacologically and pushing their bodies to places it’s not meant to be, but given your approach and modest goals I have no problem with you using either Testosterone or GH either as we don’t usually see cardiac risks with that either so long as it’s moderate and you’re monitoring yourself with your blood work and blood pressure etc. You seem to know all the risks and exactly what to look for so I don’t see you as having any kind of cardiac risks any time soon if you keep up what you’re doing prioritizing your health.”

We even joked about having a follow up in 30-40 years..

He actually asked me if I work in the medical field because I’ve read up and learned so much about this topic with health.

On a side note, he did offer me to have a CT Angiogram for peace of mind, had no problem doing so, which we will do here in a couple weeks.

He even offered a Cardiac MRI but given my other tests and my in depth blood work and current level of health and physical activity he said he didn’t see the need but if I wanted to, he would write me the script but that he couldn’t guarantee insurance would cover that as that would be skipping a few steps like the CTA, so we’re just going with that instead, again, for peace of mind..

Most doctors are not knowledgeable when it comes to athletes and PEDs and don’t even apply real world experiences, they just go by what the book tells them to and MOST of them are completely out of shape too..

Go find a Sports Cardiologist.

Love this, and thank you for sharing bro.

This is great information

 

[warlock]

I would highly recommend going to see
a Sports Cardiologist, not a regular one..

Here’s my story;

I’m 35, did a CT Calcium score 2 years ago, came back at 15. Did one in January and came back at 17, so not much progression..

I had a wild past, drank a lot, did drugs, ate like shit, did PEDs to make up for it etc. Got sober 8-9 years ago and have been absolutely impeccable with my health ever since. I’ve done 2 Echos and they came back perfectly normal. Lipids have always been in OPTIMAL range, not just normal range, with the exception of naturally lower end HDL of 40 which doesn’t really change no matter what I do.. I’ve also gotten my Apo B and Lipoprotein (a) etc all tested as well and all were good.

Have only been on Test only the last 12 years and real TRT doses the last 8-9 with the exception of the last 2 months I’ve been around 350mg and upped it to 500mg recently with GH the last 2 months at 3iu ED.

I do cardio, very active in BJJ/striking, I eat like 90% healthy with occasional fuck offs here and there, I average 12-15k steps per day etc. My blood pressure has always been around 115-120/70-80..

My doc who’s very progressive and she always gives me whatever tests I want said she sees nothing to worry about etc BUT my paranoia got the best of me so I scheduled with a great Sports Cardiologist down here in SFL..

I actually went to see him a few days ago and he was amazing, he works with athletes, is very familiar with PEDs etc.. He asked and went through every detail of every test and every bit of my past and genetics that could’ve contributed to this.

I even asked about how he felt me pursuing gaining more size/muscle, nothing crazy, maybe like 15-20lbs but not compromising my health to do so and using “healthier options” like only Test and GH to do so given my current tests and history etc..

He literally told me this;

“I don’t see any cardiac risks for you given your lifestyle and health you’ve maintained the last 8-9 years and your tests you’ve provided. What the calcium score means is that there was a lesion, a response to inflammation and your body did its job to repair it.

As for taking anything to pursue your goal, I don’t recommend any other PEDs or Anabolics because we have seen earlier and faster onset of CVD in people who do those things, especially when pushing the limits pharmacologically and pushing their bodies to places it’s not meant to be, but given your approach and modest goals I have no problem with you using either Testosterone or GH either as we don’t usually see cardiac risks with that either so long as it’s moderate and you’re monitoring yourself with your blood work and blood pressure etc. You seem to know all the risks and exactly what to look for so I don’t see you as having any kind of cardiac risks any time soon if you keep up what you’re doing prioritizing your health.”

We even joked about having a follow up in 30-40 years..

He actually asked me if I work in the medical field because I’ve read up and learned so much about this topic with health.

On a side note, he did offer me to have a CT Angiogram for peace of mind, had no problem doing so, which we will do here in a couple weeks.

He even offered a Cardiac MRI but given my other tests and my in depth blood work and current level of health and physical activity he said he didn’t see the need but if I wanted to, he would write me the script but that he couldn’t guarantee insurance would cover that as that would be skipping a few steps like the CTA, so we’re just going with that instead, again, for peace of mind..

Most doctors are not knowledgeable when it comes to athletes and PEDs and don’t even apply real world experiences, they just go by what the book tells them to and MOST of them are completely out of shape too..

Go find a Sports Cardiologist.

That's awesome you have a good team in your corner.

Out of curiosity, did the sports cardiologist tell you up to how much testosterone and GH he would feel comfortable you using?

 

[alfresco]

So I had a diagnostic CT done for my lungs, which actually revealed a bit of plaque on my heart- calcifications score of 3. Lungs all good.

So went to a cardiologist to learn more about it, what to do/expect etc. No surprises there, since I’ve got diet, weight, exercise and lifestyle dialed in. But after asking me a few questions, he comes back and tells me I have a slight to moderate risk (around 6%) of having a CV event in the next ten years, and I should consider maybe starting a statin. What the fuck…

Mind you, I drink zero alcohol, lipids and kidney function are fucking perfect, quit smoking almost 20 years ago, no diabetes and fully controlled BP- and there is zero history of cardiovascular issues on either side of my family. Then he says he estimates my heart age at 61 (I’m 53)!

I’m like wtf. Flabbergasted.

On my way home, call my best friend who’s a surgeon and he goes “what? How did he arrive at that score?” Then he pauses. “Did they ask your BMI?”

I’m like , “yeah it’s 29.”

“Dude. That’s not going to work. That puts you as overweight and 1 point away from being obese.”

Recalculated score, 2.7%. Good to go!
That fucker almost gave me a heart attack.

Sharing so that maybe one of y’all don’t get an annoying surprise if this happens to you.

Btw calcification score is 3- out of 400. still some but at age 53, I’ll take it.

Health scares are nothing to take lightly.

I just had mine done. It was a 7. When I saw the doc to follow up I said I was pissed off, last time 10 years ago it was 0. He said you are friggin nuts. That is a fantastic number.

Same with my PSA, 0.7. Prostrate cancer runs in my family my family . . . Dad (died from it, PSA was 999), uncle, brother, cousin, grandfather, etc., so I get it checked 2x er year. He said my odds of getting prostrate cancer were something like 1 in 1 in 10,000.

Didn’t mean to steel your thunder OML. I’m happy as could be for you and your health. You obviously have and are taking better care of yourself than me. You are an inspiration!

 

[OldManLogan]

Out of curiosity did he have any other suggestions for improving heart health other than just taking a statin?

I’m sure a lot of people here (myself included) would be interested in some preventative measures to try to keep the heart as healthy as possible considering our gear use.

That is scary though. So basically they just take your BMI and calcification score and assign a % risk chance based on these two factors? 6% seems rather specific. Just trying to understand what influences the % risk score better. I’m clueless myself on this topic

It was 6% with a 0.5% + or -. Other factors were blood pressure, diabetic or not, family history, BMI, history of smoking… I think that was it.

 

[Sectør]

It was 6% with a 0.5% + or -. Other factors were blood pressure, diabetic or not, family history, BMI, history of smoking… I think that was it.

Appreciate it mate

 

[OldManLogan]

Health scares are nothing to take lightly.

I just had mine done. It was a 7. When I saw the doc to follow up I said I was pissed off, last time 10 years ago it was 0. He said you are friggin nuts. That is a fantastic number.

Same with my PSA, 0.7. Prostrate cancer runs in my family my family . . . Dad (died from it, PSA was 999), uncle, brother, cousin, grandfather, etc., so I get it checked 2x er year. He said my odds of getting prostrate cancer were something like 1 in 1 in 10,000.

Didn’t mean to steel your thunder OML. I’m happy as could be for you and your health. You obviously have and are taking better care of yourself than me. You are an inspiration!

I mean, luck is definitely a factor. We do what we can to improve those odds, but there’s healthy people who get brain cancer, and chain smokers who live to be 90. I guess we just do what we can, and hope for the best.

Again, it’s luck of the draw. I turned my life around in middle age, after surviving some crazy shit in my teens. You just never know. Enjoy everyday you can being a person of character and service to others as long as you can, that’s all I know. Amir fati and all that.

 

[Bio]

A calcium score of 3 is nothing. However, that's just calcified plaque. You need to get soft plaque measured....https://cleerlyhealth.com/ Also, check out the health thread I started 4 years ago...The Definitive Health Thread It's a great resource and there for members to learn and add to it!

 

[Hatchet]

Calcium is tricky, 'some" is not always bad... I scored almost a 400, which triggered every invasive test imaginable after that score.
Came back with perfect heart health otherwise. Zero blockages, high cardio output on teadmill tests, and a almost perfert ejection-fraction.

I had these small sports all-over, which then add up to that final "score/number". Doc's said all of those small plaque sports were calcified, which is normal.
Prevents rupture, etc... Never worry about that one test, without all the actual follow-up... It doesnt tell you much..