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Don't worry about high hematocrit/RBC/Hemoglobin?

CratusMedical

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One of our doctors that leads our field of hormone optimization. He speaks to many of the other doctors in the field doing training and seminars. He focuses a lot on the proper way to approach hormone therapy, how to dispel the myths, and why the typical way doctors are trained through med school are often wrong when it comes to proper hormone therapy.

Here is Dr. Neil Rouzier explaining why elevated hematocrit and RBC while on HRT is really not an issue and why doctors make an issue of it and make patients get phlebotomies.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mH-J5kXU-jQ"]High Hemoglobin related to Testosterone therapy with Dr. Neal Rouzier - Delgado Protocol - YouTube[/ame]
 

gungalunga

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Very interesting....Thanks for posting this.
 

nothuman

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I sure as hell hope he's right but I'm not going to be taking any chances.
 

Bio

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Interesting. I wish he would have mentioned a number where he felt it could become dangerous.
 

Stewie

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Dr. Crisler has been following his philosophy for quite some time now.

There's reasonable arguments on both sides, ultimately it's relative the individual's other hematological parameters.

I can see this casting misinterpretation throughout the interweb.
 

FuriousAngus

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Interesting. I wish he would have mentioned a number where he felt it could become dangerous.

From what I understood from this video and reading an article he wrote is that if the ONLY thing that is elevated is RBC/HCT then it's not caue for concern as long as your platelet count is kosher. Something in those lines at least. But an increase in all 3 means that your blood is in fact getting thicker, which (according to him) shouldn't happen as a result of using TRT.

He's also EXTREMELY anti-AI. He thinks that one should seek to optimize test/E2 ratio as opposed to seeking a certain E2 number. He thinks AIs are poison.

Now I honestly am not informed enough to claim whether he's a smart guy or a lunatic, but I personally truly feel best when my E2 is a bit higher.
 

xman280

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that d be very hard to interpret unless they do a whole bunch of tests . He mentions just high RBC count in not dangerous, but combined with high platelet and leukocytes could be looked as a Polycythemia vera. Test does increase platelet and WBC can be increased due to emotional or physical stress, which could be anything from too much working out to too busy lifestyle etc. To completely get real blood test results , a person should probably rest for a week, with no taring and just relaxing to see where he s at...and I dontknow about the rest of u, but any tipe of gear slightly increase my platelets, and that s why i had to start draining.....or u can actually donate just platelets.
 
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Bio

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From what I understood from this video and reading an article he wrote is that if the ONLY thing that is elevated is RBC/HCT then it's not caue for concern as long as your platelet count is kosher. Something in those lines at least. But an increase in all 3 means that your blood is in fact getting thicker, which (according to him) shouldn't happen as a result of using TRT.

He's also EXTREMELY anti-AI. He thinks that one should seek to optimize test/E2 ratio as opposed to seeking a certain E2 number. He thinks AIs are poison.

Now I honestly am not informed enough to claim whether he's a smart guy or a lunatic, but I personally truly feel best when my E2 is a bit higher.

Same here! I always tell guys to get blood work so they don't tank their E2 and always start low with Aromisin because it's a suicidal aromatase inhibitor...harder to bring E2 levels up after too much Aromasin. Arimidex is harder on HDL. Sorry, I don't want to get off topic here.
 

liv2pb

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what about cyclist dying early due to increasing their rbc's? or are they increasing everything at the same time?
 

RamboStallone

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Same here! I always tell guys to get blood work so they don't tank their E2 and always start low with Aromisin because it's a suicidal aromatase inhibitor...harder to bring E2 levels up after too much Aromasin. Arimidex is harder on HDL. Sorry, I don't want to get off topic here.
Nolvadex bro, I'll never use adex or asin again.
 

needthepump

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Terrible advice. Allowing those numbers to climb is playing with fire. I have worked with many doctors over the years from ER doctors to nephrologists....none have even downplayed the significance of the high numbers and the various problems this can cause (heart attack, strokes, pulmonary embolism etc). All potentially fatal conditions.
 

johnjuanb1

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Terrible advice. Allowing those numbers to climb is playing with fire. I have worked with many doctors over the years from ER doctors to nephrologists....none have even downplayed the significance of the high numbers and the various problems this can cause (heart attack, strokes, pulmonary embolism etc). All potentially fatal conditions.

Hard on kidneys too. Thick blood isn't easy to filter.
 

needthepump

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Polycythemia is an increase in RBC's, hgb, and hct which AAS absolutely increase. Polycythemia vera involves an increase in RBC's, platelets and wbc's. They are very different conditions.
 

needthepump

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Hard on kidneys too. Thick blood isn't easy to filter.

Absolutely, which is why I won't touch nandrolone again. It definitely shot my RBC's threw the roof and dropped GFR significantly every time I used it and never went above 500 deca, combined with 300 test.

Thicker blood raises blood pressure substantially.
 

Capin

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Ya my main concern is blood clots when those numbers get too high you become more suseptable to clots which can lead to a stroke.
I feel better and my BP goes down a bit after a double red cell donation.
As far as AI's go I prefer Novaldex I have tried then all and it seems most effective.with less sides, Arimidex makes my joints hurt.
I can look at a vial of test and get gyno I'm very sensitive to it.
This is all Broscience on my part but I go with what feels right I think most of us do that have been in this game for any length of time.
 

needthepump

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Platlets numbers are largely genetic. Look back over your years of blood work and see where you tend to average. The fluctuations should be minimal at best. Conditions like cirrohsis do cause a massive drop in platlets which is why we must not drink too much combined with AAS. Of course, these patients worry about bleeding out and not thick blood but I digress.

With an average platlet range of 150k - 400k (some labs go slightly higher). Those who's platlets run on the high side are the most are risk for kidney failure, heart attack, stroke, PE, etc as this thick blood combined with the AAS will raise everything else RBC's, hgb, hct. Then the blood is syrup.

Ever former steroid abuser I care for at the dyalysis clinics I float to all have and have had a history of platlets on the higher end of the spectrum. Combined with high blood pressure, grams of gear, and tren.....the kidneys will fail eventually.

Would highly recommend a daily baby aspirin if one runs on the high end of the platlets range. In this lifestyle it definitely needed.
 
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Stewie

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Polycythemia is an increase in RBC's, hgb, and hct which AAS absolutely increase. Polycythemia vera involves an increase in RBC's, platelets and wbc's. They are very different conditions.

A really cool term would be endocrinopathy associated erythropoiesis via AAS.

You're correct. All-to-often secondary polycthemia is erroneously called polycthemia vera.
 
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RamboStallone

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I know John Meadows is a big advocate of this as well. Can you elaborate on the differences you noticed after making the switch? Blood work? Libido, energy, etc? Thanks, Rambo!
Asin kills my libido, adex makes my joints ache. No sides with nolvadex bro. I take 20mg a day when on 1g test. I haven't checked my hormone levels in a while, I don't want my insurance to see them so I haven't ordered them with any of my recent bloodwork to be honest.
 

nothuman

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Absolutely, which is why I won't touch nandrolone again. It definitely shot my RBC's threw the roof and dropped GFR significantly every time I used it and never went above 500 deca, combined with 300 test.

Thicker blood raises blood pressure substantially.

What about a higher hematocrit with pretty low-normal blood pressure? Less concern?
 

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