EAT FOOD NOT SUPPLEMENTS

[PHIL HERNON]

YES

Phil, wouldn't there be a different between supplementing with protein, carbs, fats (which we almost HAVE to do) vs. what he's talking which is mostly micro related (vits and mins)? OH YES I BELIEVE SO....BUT HE IS SAYING POWDERS, LBA, ETC...

I'm thinking yes, two oranges are better than vitamin C pill, almonds and peanuts better than a vitamin E capsule, but I really don't think absorption of regular eggs is as good a good protein isolate or other form of pre-digested protein. I AGREE 100%.......

I'm not a dietitian though but that would make sense to me. IMO the articles apply to micros not macros.

GOOD POINT

 

[OuchThatHurts]

GOOD POINT

Then IMHO, I would have to disagree with the thread. I think proteins like isolates, LBA, etc. and carbs like wazy maize, and fish oil and olive oil are going to be easier to use and consume your total gross amounts of macros. I look at macros and micros apart from one another. I eat and supplement my days macros and then if I feel I could be shorting myself vits and mins, then I'll take extra.

I think most of the hoopla surrounding mega-dosing vitamins and minerals is overstated. What matters is that you are not deficient.

Now that I think of it, same thing applies to macros like protein - as long as you're not deficient. I don't thing force-feeding yourself tons of protein is going make as much a difference unless you are protein deficient. If you have adequate proteins, then sleep and rest/recovery is what you need more of. Not another 100gms of poop in the toilet.

 

[e6er]

A majority of the supplements out there are garbage.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

PLEASE

A majority of the supplements out there are garbage.

NAME NAMES.....EXPLAIN WHAT YOU MEAN..ALSO, WHAT ARE YOU EXPECTING FROM THESE SUPPLEMENTS?

 

[Papa Van Smack]

Not much to throw in there except.....when I go for a few days of eating very large amounts of fruits and vegatables(like when my parents harvest their garden and send me a shit ton of produce) I do feel a lot healthier. My workouts also benefit greatly from the influx of fresh nutrients.

 

[muscle96ss]

You guys also have to realize that by the time most of the fruits, vegetables, and foods make it to the supermarkets and our mouths, the nutrient content has been vastly modified and/or destroyed and it does not contain the nutrients that nature intended it to.

 

[e6er]

NAME NAMES.....EXPLAIN WHAT YOU MEAN..ALSO, WHAT ARE YOU EXPECTING FROM THESE SUPPLEMENTS?

I am not a pro, nor am I an aspiring pro bodybuilder. Just your average gym rat who works hard day in and day out. With that being said, nowadays the marketing with supplements are ridiculous. I think a lot of money is spent on supplements by uninformed people hoping to look like the next Ronnie or Jay. Take Muscletech for example, over-priced, over-hyped products and pass down the expensive costs of advertising which could be duplicated by buying the same exact ingredients separately.. I've used Arganine that I've spent $10 on in the store, while someone goes out and buys BSN's NO-Explod thinking that it's much better. It really isn't, it's just the advertising hype.

Every day a new supplement company is popping up with fancy names, being pushed by popular board members in order to sway people into buying it.

While I think most supplements are garbage, I say that because there are other good supplements, that if taken correctly work much better for the $
.

 

[Ness]

You guys also have to realize that by the time most of the fruits, vegetables, and foods make it to the supermarkets and our mouths, the nutrient content has been vastly modified and/or destroyed and it does not contain the nutrients that nature intended it to.

Really? How and why? What happens to an orange from the time that its picked off a tree to the time you put it in a bag that causes this to happen?

 

[mature muscle]

A majority of the supplements out there are garbage.

I will have to agree most supplements promise amazing results and just don't deliver,. I have never had a problem with eating and i feel i get more from real food then anything else but i do use a protein shake once a day. when you reach phils level i guess its worth the investment to use more just to much money for myself.

 

[Papa Van Smack]

Really? How and why? What happens to an orange from the time that its picked off a tree to the time you put it in a bag that causes this to happen?

Not sure, i hope this isn't true. But I will say that the veggie's fresh from my parents garden, or the local farmers market during the warm months do seem to go a long way in improving my energy/workout performance.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Ok

I am not a pro, nor am I an aspiring pro bodybuilder. Just your average gym rat who works hard day in and day out. With that being said, nowadays the marketing with supplements are ridiculous. I think a lot of money is spent on supplements by uninformed people hoping to look like the next Ronnie or Jay. Take Muscletech for example, over-priced, over-hyped products and pass down the expensive costs of advertising which could be duplicated by buying the same exact ingredients separately.. I've used Arganine that I've spent $10 on in the store, while someone goes out and buys BSN's NO-Explod thinking that it's much better. It really isn't, it's just the advertising hype.

Every day a new supplement company is popping up with fancy names, being pushed by popular board members in order to sway people into buying it.

While I think most supplements are garbage, I say that because there are other good supplements, that if taken correctly work much better for the $
.

But as a consumer, wouldnt you do some research before believing a label? You really dont believe they hype do you? Look up the ingredients and tell me if you come to the same conclusions as Jay or Ronnie is telling you. Are you saying that we need the FDA to intervene and save us?

 

[machola]

You guys also have to realize that by the time most of the fruits, vegetables, and foods make it to the supermarkets and our mouths, the nutrient content has been vastly modified and/or destroyed and it does not contain the nutrients that nature intended it to.

Not sure, i hope this isn't true.

don't say something as a fact if you don't know its true. we're confused enough...

 

[zephyr22]

Whoa there Phil....

Dont get me started on the FDA regulations for supplements. You see the big debate is that the FDA is trying to "help" the consumer. This is just a crock. They want to be able to dictate what we can and cant consume in our bodies. Also they want to be able to make more money because now it will cost a supplement company to have the FDA check out the product etc....... So no one wins in that case. Just kicking the consumer in the face. Its like anything in life. Research what supp you want to use. Use a reputable supplier and all is good. I feel like the FDA is like a giant Communistic party. They are trying to dictate what the hell supps we take. I mean come on. also my take on supplements is eat whole foods and use supps to overcome the defiecency. Ive tried with and without supplements IE protein powder, post workout protein with carb drinks. I can say without a doubt i do much better with supps. Some day when I get around to it Im gonna have to try these LBAS i hear so much about Phil......

 

[gooey]

heres my special needs thoughts...

I LIVE ON SUPPLEMENTS.......I TAKE SO MANY PILLS, LBAs, PEPTO PRO......HEY, YOU GUYS DO AS YOU FEEL AND I UNDERSTAND THAT MANY OF YOU WILL NEVER BE OR WANT TO BE A PROFSSIONAL BODYBUILDER.....BUT AS A PRO BODYBUILDER YOUR LIFE IS SUPPLEMENTS........THATS JUST THE FACTS MAM.

this is simply a fact.. expecially when your dieting and cannot eat the foods that have certain nutrients in them. Yes im a huge pill popper

NO STEROIDS, NO IGF, NO INSULIN, NO GH.......... IS WHAT I WAS REFERRING TO................

IMO dont feel "natural" is the term to use in BBing. More like "non-drug induced" or "tested clean that day" Their is nothing "natural" about boob jobs, supplements, tans, oil. Even the argument of food types and how they are processed could be considered an argument by Phil. And likewise how can someone call themselves drug free when caffiene is considered a drug? Supplements are apart of BBing and will always be regardless of the importance of all of them BBing needs supplements as much as supplements need BBing.

Goo

 

[jfunk316]

Really? How and why? What happens to an orange from the time that its picked off a tree to the time you put it in a bag that causes this to happen?

The reason is that most fruits and veggies in stores are not vine rippened so they are picked before they develop all the nutrients that you should be getting. This is why frozen is actually the better way to go for nutrient purposes. Of course a farmers market or your own garden where you ensure the vine rippened would be best.

A good place to learn about how powerful fruits and veggies can be is using the info that a company called juiceplus has already. I'm not endorsing them I don't even take the stuff although I prolly should because I lack on the veggie side a lot. I'm just saying that I have learned a lot by reading their studies, lectures, etc...

 

[Mr_Magoo]

You guys also have to realize that by the time most of the fruits, vegetables, and foods make it to the supermarkets and our mouths, the nutrient content has been vastly modified and/or destroyed and it does not contain the nutrients that nature intended it to.

very true, they add pesticides and or grow food in ways that are not natural. take beef for example, organic beef is high in omega 3's and cla whereas the crap u get from the store is higher in saturated fats omega 6 fatty acids because of the diet the cows are forced to eat

 

[smootheavy]

You guys also have to realize that by the time most of the fruits, vegetables, and foods make it to the supermarkets and our mouths, the nutrient content has been vastly modified and/or destroyed and it does not contain the nutrients that nature intended it to.

It is a fact that the foods are irradiated prior to distribution, this is done "to protect the consumer from contamination" also the idea that the food is lower in nutirent content is also fact as the factory farming that has become a main-stay in the US is depleating the soil and land of the nutrients that make it into the produce as well as the lack of nutrients making it into the meats...

read about grass-fed beef then conventional beef and see what I mean.

the fact is we need supplements, but if nothing your still better off consuming fresh foods in their "natural" state as opposed to the processed poison that the FDA and corporate food companies are pushing to the US public.

You can read about this info on the USDA.GOV website as it is public info, its really a shame that this is not making the headlines on the news, death, drugs and sex is more important than the poisoning of the masses.

 

[cooper250]

i agree to both sides but even though i take lots of supps. deep down i always wonder whats really in that jug of protein ect. i mean u never really know.but with with food u can est. how much protein ect. is relly in there.honestly i notice no difference weather i eat or take all those shakes,most are just scams handy yes but u can do without.

i wont go without a good multi,vit. c or e. and fishoil but still am i really getting what im paying for???????

 

[Muay Thai]

i think the moderate to extreme intake of both combined will produce great results in conjunction with good training and rest

 

[edge250]

i guess i should be more specific and i think ouchthathurts said it best.......if you need more fats.........eat some nuts.....if you need more vit c eat an orange.

now obviously as gooey stated if your dieting for competition this all goes out the window. a submaintenance diet isnt going to allow you to get what you need and your going to end up with defiencies that need to be filled via supplements.

do i take supplements........yes. never said i didnt, but i also think there is something very valuable to learn from this article that makes you stop and think.

now for me specifically and no one else and based on what i have experimented with whole food protein sources are superior for growth...FOR ME. i have done the 3-4 protein shake with 2-3 meals. i have done the bottles of lba's. and neither for ME compare to eatting small frequent real food source of protein even post workout unless certain applications require very fast absorption. whether i be "natural" "partially natural" "slightly natural" "all natural" or "naturally enhanced"


in a way i was hoping this would help the majority of new members that seem to have gravitated here that are new to the lifestyle and make them realize that nothing is better nutrition wise than what nature provides us. and that you'll have far more success from the get go if you learn to eat and spend your money on food and not supplements.

phil...do i need to post a picture also. lol. j/k

and hey i am glad this actually sparked a good debate and is an actuall thread worth reading and if baldnazi chimes in and starts talking about the end of the world i will delete it, lol.