- Joined
- Feb 24, 2011
- Messages
- 140
Hey guys. This board has lots of very educated people. So I think this is the right place to ask questions to learn something new.
Let me tell you what brought me to start this thread. I've been on for about 18 months, but decided to come off. I spent a month tapering my T dosage from 100 mg prop ED to 10 mg ED. So the last week of my cycle was 12.5mg prop + 12.5 mg masteron daily. Not too much eh? Still I was increasing poundage every workout while leaning out and losing a very small amount of muscle tissue if any. Even though that I was lifting HIT style just twice a week and doing martial arts 4-5 days a week (not super intense but still). My previous experience with cruising was about the same: when dramatically dropping T dose (I would usually blast with 100mg prop ED and cruise with 50mg EOD... comparable with an HRT dose, is it not?) I was losing next to no muscle tissue while leaning out.
Now here comes the interesting part. I've been off for 2 months (during which I did pretty agressive PCT) and my T came back 762 (decent result, higher than average, I was surprised actually). So I take it I'm about recovered. 2 weeks post cycle it was also in normal range although lower than recently; that was several days after I injected trip. If I understand correctly, 700s is a T level which is usually achieved with a TRT dose of about 150mg T enanthate or cyp weekly.
BUT I feel nothing like when I was on 12.5-25mg prop ED in the end of cycle! I lost much size (not that I ever was big by this board's standards) and body composition deteriorated a bit. Also I lost strength.
So let me sum this up:
90-180mg exogenous T propionate = body recomposition, retaining muscle, getting stronger; good mood; libido higher than average.
762 endogenous T = adding a little BF; losing muscle big time (well I don't think I'm still losing any but I've lost a lot while my T being in normal range during PCT); lost lots of strength (slowly progressing now); mood is ok I guess; libido somewhat lower.
So the question is: what's the deal with that? I doubt an HRT dose of prop could raise my T well over 700s. Yet I feel a hell lot better, especially in the training department, on low dose exogenous T.
First, this is interesting in theoretical regard. What makes exogenous T stronger than endogenous? Talking about sides, a vet here told me that high endogenous T (1000s and higher) is not a health concern while if you get such bloodwork results on HRT u should lower your dose in order not to raise RBC\henatocrit.
Perhaps part of it is the pulsatile nature of endogenous T while exogenous is always there and maintains a pretty steady blood concentration? Perhaps exogenous T does lower SBHG (I saw a research on that on some board)? Maybe that sounded dumb so I count on you more knowledgeable guys to chime in here.
Secondly, in practical regard, I wonder what'll happen if I can drive my endogenous T to 1000s with stuff like DAA, tribulus etc? Will it do any good in training department, will I feel like on low dose T or what? I'm not planning to get back on any time soon after reading some threads on this forum, as long as I can get any progress without AS at all. What's your opinion guys.
Sorry for a very long post! Thank you in advance for your response.
Let me tell you what brought me to start this thread. I've been on for about 18 months, but decided to come off. I spent a month tapering my T dosage from 100 mg prop ED to 10 mg ED. So the last week of my cycle was 12.5mg prop + 12.5 mg masteron daily. Not too much eh? Still I was increasing poundage every workout while leaning out and losing a very small amount of muscle tissue if any. Even though that I was lifting HIT style just twice a week and doing martial arts 4-5 days a week (not super intense but still). My previous experience with cruising was about the same: when dramatically dropping T dose (I would usually blast with 100mg prop ED and cruise with 50mg EOD... comparable with an HRT dose, is it not?) I was losing next to no muscle tissue while leaning out.
Now here comes the interesting part. I've been off for 2 months (during which I did pretty agressive PCT) and my T came back 762 (decent result, higher than average, I was surprised actually). So I take it I'm about recovered. 2 weeks post cycle it was also in normal range although lower than recently; that was several days after I injected trip. If I understand correctly, 700s is a T level which is usually achieved with a TRT dose of about 150mg T enanthate or cyp weekly.
BUT I feel nothing like when I was on 12.5-25mg prop ED in the end of cycle! I lost much size (not that I ever was big by this board's standards) and body composition deteriorated a bit. Also I lost strength.
So let me sum this up:
90-180mg exogenous T propionate = body recomposition, retaining muscle, getting stronger; good mood; libido higher than average.
762 endogenous T = adding a little BF; losing muscle big time (well I don't think I'm still losing any but I've lost a lot while my T being in normal range during PCT); lost lots of strength (slowly progressing now); mood is ok I guess; libido somewhat lower.
So the question is: what's the deal with that? I doubt an HRT dose of prop could raise my T well over 700s. Yet I feel a hell lot better, especially in the training department, on low dose exogenous T.
First, this is interesting in theoretical regard. What makes exogenous T stronger than endogenous? Talking about sides, a vet here told me that high endogenous T (1000s and higher) is not a health concern while if you get such bloodwork results on HRT u should lower your dose in order not to raise RBC\henatocrit.
Perhaps part of it is the pulsatile nature of endogenous T while exogenous is always there and maintains a pretty steady blood concentration? Perhaps exogenous T does lower SBHG (I saw a research on that on some board)? Maybe that sounded dumb so I count on you more knowledgeable guys to chime in here.
Secondly, in practical regard, I wonder what'll happen if I can drive my endogenous T to 1000s with stuff like DAA, tribulus etc? Will it do any good in training department, will I feel like on low dose T or what? I'm not planning to get back on any time soon after reading some threads on this forum, as long as I can get any progress without AS at all. What's your opinion guys.
Sorry for a very long post! Thank you in advance for your response.