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Former National Level Competitor.. HRT? yay or nay

hardtothecore

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Newbies
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
48
Brothers,
I've been a competitive NPC heavyweight for 3 years now, gotten to the national level without abusing many supplements, and have realized I just dont have the genes and/or desire to get to the next level. I've decided that my health is more important, and we all know that getting our physiques to obscene pro levels takes extensive usage.

So here's my question... I'm 26... married with 2 kids, and dont want any more. I've been all clean of supplements for about 8 months, and am still at 228 with visible abs. My bloodwork revealed that my total Test is around 350, with a range of 340-1100... so I'm at the VERY BOTTOM of normal. My doc offered to put me on HRT 200mg cyp/week, but to be honest, I feel pretty decent besides a bit of fatigue and not being as lean as usual. I'm very torn as to whether or not I should get on exogenous test, as my body is at least producing SOME test... Has anybody been in my boat? What do you guys see as pros and cons? I feel like I'm too young to be on HRT, but at the same time, I'm too young to have such low T. Sorry for the little rant, I'm just driving myself crazy trying to figure this out. Thanks!
 
Hey man, what was your AAS usage like prior to coming off? I ask because I'm your same age and wonder if I even stand a chance at recovery.. But in your shoes I certainly know what I would do, most likely your levels wont get much better. At 26, im very surprised your doc gave you that as an option.
 
Brothers,
I've been a competitive NPC heavyweight for 3 years now, gotten to the national level without abusing many supplements, and have realized I just dont have the genes and/or desire to get to the next level. I've decided that my health is more important, and we all know that getting our physiques to obscene pro levels takes extensive usage.

So here's my question... I'm 26... married with 2 kids, and dont want any more. I've been all clean of supplements for about 8 months, and am still at 228 with visible abs. My bloodwork revealed that my total Test is around 350, with a range of 340-1100... so I'm at the VERY BOTTOM of normal. My doc offered to put me on HRT 200mg cyp/week, but to be honest, I feel pretty decent besides a bit of fatigue and not being as lean as usual. I'm very torn as to whether or not I should get on exogenous test, as my body is at least producing SOME test... Has anybody been in my boat? What do you guys see as pros and cons? I feel like I'm too young to be on HRT, but at the same time, I'm too young to have such low T. Sorry for the little rant, I'm just driving myself crazy trying to figure this out. Thanks!

I wouldn't do any outside hormones. 8 months sounds like a long time, but it really isn't especially if you been doing a lot of gear over the past few years. My advice is to look into diet (high fat, red meat etc) and look into natural test boosters. Maybe an ai/hcg. If your still having problems look into hrt. Your still really young man!
 
I would go by two things...One is how you feel. Are you feeling depressed, tired, experiencing ED, etc? Two, get your levels checked every few months and see where they're at. One or both should give you a good indication of what you need to do!!
 
Brothers,
I've been a competitive NPC heavyweight for 3 years now, gotten to the national level without abusing many supplements, and have realized I just dont have the genes and/or desire to get to the next level. I've decided that my health is more important, and we all know that getting our physiques to obscene pro levels takes extensive usage.

So here's my question... I'm 26... married with 2 kids, and dont want any more. I've been all clean of supplements for about 8 months, and am still at 228 with visible abs. My bloodwork revealed that my total Test is around 350, with a range of 340-1100... so I'm at the VERY BOTTOM of normal. My doc offered to put me on HRT 200mg cyp/week, but to be honest, I feel pretty decent besides a bit of fatigue and not being as lean as usual. I'm very torn as to whether or not I should get on exogenous test, as my body is at least producing SOME test... Has anybody been in my boat? What do you guys see as pros and cons? I feel like I'm too young to be on HRT, but at the same time, I'm too young to have such low T. Sorry for the little rant, I'm just driving myself crazy trying to figure this out. Thanks!

Hey bro -- Let me ask you this.......if you don't have symptoms, what would you be hoping to gain from the medicine? My opinion is that the number is just a number.....JUST a reference point. Would you take an antidepressant if you were not depressed? Just my two cents bro
 
Hey bro -- Let me ask you this.......if you don't have symptoms, what would you be hoping to gain from the medicine? My opinion is that the number is just a number.....JUST a reference point. Would you take an antidepressant if you were not depressed? Just my two cents bro

truer words havent been spoken. your bf is a bit higher and u feel tired. but thats expected. If you truly have no symptoms, stick with it. sometiems it takes a WHILE to get things back to normal. maybe do a pct with hcg, clomid and nolvadex. Or jsut leave it alone. i have read of peoples test coming back up slowly 6 months to a year.
 
Hey bro -- Let me ask you this.......if you don't have symptoms, what would you be hoping to gain from the medicine? My opinion is that the number is just a number.....JUST a reference point. Would you take an antidepressant if you were not depressed? Just my two cents bro

youre absolutely correct bro... I really have very few symptoms. My sex life is going pretty good, I actually feel very mentally clear.... and for once not hot headed as all hell.

I guess I just take comfort in having that one little 200mg shot per week to keep my test high and let me know I'm being productive, as I still live the bb lifestyle day in and day out.

To be honest, I look 10x better now than any other big bloated offseason i've had, granted I'm 20lbs lighter, but a hell of a lot better looking. I was going to do Team Universe (the only drug tested ifbb pro qualifier) to prove to myself I can do it clean, but i'm shitting myself at the thought.

After some health scares this last year, Its just time for me to move on and stop playing russian roulette with my health. I truly appreciate all of your words of wisdom fellas... means alot. Thanks.
 
Yeah, dont go on it unless you feel like utter shit. I was stuck with a total test of around 45-70 for about 10 months before I finally got on. I felt like total shit. Your levels are a bit low for your age but they still might come up some. 8 months really isnt all that long as Dezzy said and you just might be surprised that your levels may come up some yet. If youre feeling fine like you say then dont do it.
 
I agree with Maldorf completely. I had to come off at 34 years old and I stayed off for a good ten years. I delt like complete shit for at least a year. I think It was really 14 months till my levels come back to low normal.
Hang in there!
 
Thanks guys... All your advice is very helpful, and just strengthening what I know I should do, vs. what my inner juicehead wants lol. I feel pretty blessed that I've kept most of my size and strength at this point, and just hope that with proper diet and training I can continue to improve my physique and attain modest goals.
 
Just talked to my doc... We're going to do another blood test at 8 months clean (next week) and check levels again before any rash decisions are made. Last bloodwork was done at approx 3 months clean, so this should be interesting...
 
Your youth should allow you to eventually come back up but as time goes on you probably will become frustrated with how you feel and look. Having testerone levels in a range from 700 to 900 feels good and should actually keep you healthier. This is just my opinion but I will probably get blasted for it since your so young but if you don't improve expect to get fatter, weaker and lose interest in sex.
 
Your youth should allow you to eventually come back up but as time goes on you probably will become frustrated with how you feel and look. Having testerone levels in a range from 700 to 900 feels good and should actually keep you healthier. This is just my opinion but I will probably get blasted for it since your so young but if you don't improve expect to get fatter, weaker and lose interest in sex.

Trust me bro, I'm already there. Went from squatting 405 ass to the grass for sets of 15-20 to 405 for 6 - 8 and vomitting afterwards lol... pretty depressing.

I do understand that Low T has been linked to hypertension, poor lipid profile, depression, ED, etc., but I guess I just dont know at what point the HRT would help vs. cause future damage. If fertility isnt an issue, the only other things I can think of that could be impacted negatively by HRT would be possible prostate issues down the road, high rbc/hematacrit, and maybe a lowering of HDL chol... anybody wanna chime in? Still kind of in the air...
 
Trust me bro, I'm already there. Went from squatting 405 ass to the grass for sets of 15-20 to 405 for 6 - 8 and vomitting afterwards lol... pretty depressing.

I do understand that Low T has been linked to hypertension, poor lipid profile, depression, ED, etc., but I guess I just dont know at what point the HRT would help vs. cause future damage. If fertility isnt an issue, the only other things I can think of that could be impacted negatively by HRT would be possible prostate issues down the road, high rbc/hematacrit, and maybe a lowering of HDL chol... anybody wanna chime in? Still kind of in the air...

Do you want to pin at least EW and be dependent on something for the rest of your life?

To me its more about this than anything. I'm a young guy too and I have some big cycle plans but recovery is always in the back of my head. Too young for HRT...yet why not besides just injecting a cc once a week?
 
Do you want to pin at least EW and be dependent on something for the rest of your life?

To me its more about this than anything. I'm a young guy too and I have some big cycle plans but recovery is always in the back of my head. Too young for HRT...yet why not besides just injecting a cc once a week?

Pinning ew doesnt bother me. Thats no big deal IMO. For me its more the possibility of health issues down the road from the HRT OR from Low T that is weighing on my decision. My insanity and size complex isnt helping either lol. I have no desire to gear up hard ever... but an HRT dose would be nice for keeping the physique/mindset/sexdrive, but at what cost?... therein lies my internal debate.
 
Total test levels only tell half the story.You can have a test level of only 350ng/dl and feel great if you have low shbg levels because your free test levels will be high.Its the free test levels that are important.Conversely if a person has high shbg levels even a test level of 900ng/dl is going to feel like crap because free test levels will be low.If you feel good stay natural.
 
i think dezzy hit upon a great idea in tweaking your diet.

good quality grass fed meats and whole eggs, whole raw milk and veggies with some carbs then a weekend or day carb up.

along the lines of the anabolic diet, also as others have said maybe a natty test booster such as massive G's from true protein.

whats your training like??

have you had time off??

have you switched things around....have you thought about something like a 3 day per week full body routine hitting the compounds at different rep ranges. short hard workouts 45-1hr long

whats your sleep/stress like??

many things to tweak before hitting the hrt route
 
i think dezzy hit upon a great idea in tweaking your diet.

good quality grass fed meats and whole eggs, whole raw milk and veggies with some carbs then a weekend or day carb up.

along the lines of the anabolic diet, also as others have said maybe a natty test booster such as massive G's from true protein.

whats your training like??

have you had time off??

have you switched things around....have you thought about something like a 3 day per week full body routine hitting the compounds at different rep ranges. short hard workouts 45-1hr long

whats your sleep/stress like??

many things to tweak before hitting the hrt route


My diet is about 80% of a pre-contest diet year round.. Right now its typically this every day:

Meal 1:
3 scoops whey isolate
60g of either oats or grits
coffee with splenda

Meal 2:
9oz chicken breast with mustard
50g yam or brown rice

Meal 3:
90z chicken breast with mustard
50g yam or brown rice

Meal 4:
10 egg whites, 2 whole
40g oats

Meal 5: post workout
3 scoops whey iso
60g grits w/ 1/3 fresh pineapple

Meal 6:
9oz chicken
50g brown rice/yam

Meal 7:
10 egg whites/2 whole

Bed

This diet is very consistant day in/day out. I've always responded phenomenally to low fat/high protein/moderate carbs. Fat tends to make me fat.

Stresswise, my job is brutal. I'm in corrections. Stress/anxiety is always elevated.

I usually take 1 week off per year of training and thats always the week after my last show of the year.

Training is currently 5x a week, high intensity, average of about 60-90 minutes with the weights, cardio 3-4x per week post workout (30 min. on the stepper)

My sleep is always decent... as I'm exhausted by the end of the day. I average 7-8 hrs per night.

I've debated changing up training, but considering how much size I'm keeping, I'm tempted to not change it at all and just keep holding onto what I can for a while.
 
My diet is about 80% of a pre-contest diet year round.. Right now its typically this every day:

Meal 1:
3 scoops whey isolate
60g of either oats or grits
coffee with splenda

Meal 2:
9oz chicken breast with mustard
50g yam or brown rice

Meal 3:
90z chicken breast with mustard
50g yam or brown rice

Meal 4:
10 egg whites, 2 whole
40g oats

Meal 5: post workout
3 scoops whey iso
60g grits w/ 1/3 fresh pineapple

Meal 6:
9oz chicken
50g brown rice/yam

Meal 7:
10 egg whites/2 whole

Bed

This diet is very consistant day in/day out. I've always responded phenomenally to low fat/high protein/moderate carbs. Fat tends to make me fat.

Stresswise, my job is brutal. I'm in corrections. Stress/anxiety is always elevated.

I usually take 1 week off per year of training and thats always the week after my last show of the year.

Training is currently 5x a week, high intensity, average of about 60-90 minutes with the weights, cardio 3-4x per week post workout (30 min. on the stepper)

My sleep is always decent... as I'm exhausted by the end of the day. I average 7-8 hrs per night.

I've debated changing up training, but considering how much size I'm keeping, I'm tempted to not change it at all and just keep holding onto what I can for a while.



I would recommend more rest to increase natural test production, both between workouts and weeks off.
From personal experience and research eod workouts seem to be best for test production.
I would also shorten your workouts.
Training with low test is very different from training with high or even normal test levels.
Also, I know you said fat makes you fat, but you really should swap some carbs out for fat early in the day.
 
i think potentially some of what you state in your reply may hold part of your problem.

training 5 times per week and then 4 cardio sessions

high stress job.

i would never try to force my training ideas and opinions on anyone but i really would consider maybe 2-4 weeks off rest the system then hit some 3 day full bodies even just for a few weeks.

read mountain dogs posts, he has totally changed my way of eating and thinking about food.

based on the diet you have posted thats very lean. a few whole eggs and grass fed steak every day for few weeks may just boost things
 

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