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GH, IGF1 and should I combine them ?

sciroxx-lab

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I've been asked more then several times if IGF1 should be combined with GH, and why not to take it by itself or instead of GH usage ?
In a nutshell the ideal solution is using GH in combination with IGF1-lr3 and/or IGF1-DES

It's true that the IGF1 is the mediator for most of the anabolic effect of the GH, but we must consider 2 things -

The GH has some direct metabolic effect by itself, both in releasing glucose and fatty acid into the circulation, and by this raising metabolism and releasing available energy for anabolic demands, The GH has also a direct effect on nitrogen balance not through the IGF1 path

The IGF1 itself has a direct suppressing effect on the endogenous GH release - so if u inject exogenous IGF you actually and directly suppress any GH present in the circulation

Further more - many GH users are not aware to the fact that GH decreases insulin sensitivity. IGF1 increases insulin sensitivity, and negates this effect, which leads to optimal metabolic conditions. Some users use insulin in conjunction with GH but using IGF1 is much more effective in retaining optimum insulin sensitivity and much much safer

So the ideal solution is combining them both and by this keep optimal serum GH and IGF1 levels
 
I am running 4 iu daily 2 am and 2 pm alongside 25 mcg igf1-lr3 post workout days only and pumps have been insane ,muscle stay full,veins I didn't know I had ;)
 
One thing is for sure, you need to feed that LR3.
I ended up a little flat watching my diet a little while dosing 100mcgs Friday and 50/50 sat and sun.
Still ended up takin a bunch of photos last weekend but new I should of looked better!
After a heavy day of refeeding I filled right back out with no fat gain.
 
One thing is for sure, you need to feed that LR3.
I ended up a little flat watching my diet a little while dosing 100mcgs Friday and 50/50 sat and sun.
Still ended up takin a bunch of photos last weekend but new I should of looked better!
After a heavy day of refeeding I filled right back out with no fat gain.

Did you experience more fat loss during the time you weren't eating as much or just flat muscles and no extra fat loss?
 
I am sure there was additional fat loss. Midsection was like Diamonds.
But the rest of my body was not full which shows better striations and veins ready to pop!
The biggest change was no distention or bloat!
Again most there don't notice the deference and you still look like a freak!
Today, Full, veins are huge and still hold the diamonds.

It is tough staying full, ripped and in contest shape week in week out.
Most of the time I am spot on...but it may land on a Friday or Monday instead of every Saturday and Sunday! lol

3iu's x 2 off days, then 10 ius pre w- 100 mcgs lr3 post after mgf works great!
Now just havin the right amount of macros is the trick!
 
there is definitely a symbiotic relationship as far as insulin sensitivity ,, so using them together is idle , im doing the Lr3 as a post workout on just lift days with Des intra workout into the muscles

hgh daily down to 3 Ius AM
 
I am sure there was additional fat loss. Midsection was like Diamonds.
But the rest of my body was not full which shows better striations and veins ready to pop!
The biggest change was no distention or bloat!
Again most there don't notice the deference and you still look like a freak!
Today, Full, veins are huge and still hold the diamonds.

It is tough staying full, ripped and in contest shape week in week out.
Most of the time I am spot on...but it may land on a Friday or Monday instead of every Saturday and Sunday! lol

3iu's x 2 off days, then 10 ius pre w- 100 mcgs lr3 post after mgf works great!
Now just havin the right amount of macros is the trick!

May u possibly specify a bit more on the diet under this usage, I've been asked allot on this issue, and like you said it seems that the effect is greatly influenced by the diet here.

Tks for the help here !
 
I use it more as a recomp peptide with new growth later as a great side effect.

Normally I will dose 100mcgs about 1-2 hrs post workout, for me that's around 1 o'colck pm. Then concentrate on eating as much protein and carbs as possible. 5000-6000 cals.

During the nightly fast is when the recomp occurs as it's burning fat since your blood sugar is low from the long duration of its insulin effect.

Then I have been dosing 50/50 sat and sunday strictly for recomp.
This is where I need to find the optimal micro intake as not to go flat from not enough, or bloat from too many to be at my best for the weekend!

Which is what really only matters!!!....Till I need to wear a Shirt again.
 
When u reduce to 50/50 on weekend you lower calories and carbs as well ? how much ?
 
Whats the ratio of GH/IGF1-Lr3 needed to achieve this balance of insulin sensitivity decrease/increase?

Also I am sorry if this is a stupid question but it popped in my mind, what are the effects of accidentally shooting IGF1-LR3 into a vein?
 
I'm still confused on this. If HGH converts to IGF then why would using both be more beneficial than just using more HGH which in turn will convert to more IGF.
 
When u reduce to 50/50 on weekend you lower calories and carbs as well ? how much ?

All macros are reduced buy about half, not counting.
This is were again I can easily end up flat by Monday..But man are you ripped up in the meantime!lol
Recomp starts Monday with reefed till wed, eating anything and everything filling all muscle stores back up. Thursday on just cutting Greasy Fat intake as is really the only thing that makes me look soft!

Bulking this weekend to get ready for next.
Chicago air and water show at north avenue Beach on Friday
Saturday is fantasy fest at my Island, All body painting for the Ladys...NICE!
 
Nice indeed ;) tks for the info !
 
I'm still confused on this. If HGH converts to IGF then why would using both be more beneficial than just using more HGH which in turn will convert to more IGF.

First as we mentioned along the thread the GH usage decreases insulin sensitivity (the mechanism in a nutshell is related to the fact that GH increases abruptly the glucose serum levels which requires repeated intensive overload on the pancreas, this is ecatly what leads to type 3 diabetics with time). The IGF1 helps to regulate serum glucose levels which increases insulin sensitivity, which negates the GH negative effect on the pancreas.
 
First as we mentioned along the thread the GH usage decreases insulin sensitivity (the mechanism in a nutshell is related to the fact that GH increases abruptly the glucose serum levels which requires repeated intensive overload on the pancreas, this is ecatly what leads to type 3 diabetics with time). The IGF1 helps to regulate serum glucose levels which increases insulin sensitivity, which negates the GH negative effect on the pancreas.


Since Lr3 as a 20 to 30 our half life do you have to time it around your HGH or will it not matter since the half-life is so long? Thanks
 
The common conception is to use the lr3 post workout, and using higher calories/higher carbs diet the following it, or consumption low to moderate amount of low glycemic index carbs if you like to cut body fat, and by this taking advantage over the metabolic effect of the lr3 around the clock,
The long half life of the lr3 do the trick in improving insulin sensitivity and enabling the pancreas to cope with the higher levels of glucose which is released into the circulation with the GH usage, so you may stick to your regular schedule of GH usage (there are more then few protocols), and take advantage of the synergistic effect of these 2 agents.
You should apply some trial and error regarding the exact timing of the GH, the basic one is actually taking the whole daily GH dosage once a day upon waking up (it most commonly causes the sharpest increase in endogenous IGF1 release), and IGF1-lr3 use post workout or pre largest meal of the day, but of course there are other protocols under which u divide the GH usage, I'm sure the vets here may contribute on this regard
 
Last edited:
If you can afford it hell ya you should combine them
 
The common conception is to use the lr3 post workout, and using higher calories/higher carbs diet the following it, or consumption low to moderate amount of low glycemic index carbs if you like to cut body fat, and by this taking advantage over the metabolic effect of the lr3 around the clock,
The long half life of the lr3 do the trick in improving insulin sensitivity and enabling the pancreas to cope with the higher levels of glucose which is released into the circulation with the GH usage, so you may stick to your regular schedule of GH usage (there are more then few protocols), and take advantage of the synergistic effect of these 2 agents.
You should apply some trial and error regarding the exact timing of the GH, the basic one is actually taking the whole daily GH dosage once a day upon waking up (it most commonly causes the sharpest increase in endogenous IGF1 release), and IGF1-lr3 use post workout or pre largest meal of the day, but of course there are other protocols under which u divide the GH usage, I'm sure the vets here may contribute on this regard

Good to know. MK677 increases fasting glucose levels so adding LR3 when using MK677 seems like a pretty good idea as well.
 
Yes, but need to test and see if the the exogenous injection of the lr3 doesn't suppress the stimulation effect of the mk-677 on the hypophiza - the IGF1 has a direct effect on the secretion of any endogenous GH secretion, I'm not sure to what extent with mk-677, you may make serum GH test to determine this
 

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