Got a gyno evaluation from Dr. Nadler

[drgoodbody]

Yup, went and saw the man himself - the king of gyno surgery. I had been feeling a little tenderness in my boobs even with a ton of anti-e's (nolva), anti-aromatase (a-dex and letro) and anti-prolactin (bromo). So I paniced and made an appt to see him. He examined me thoroughly and said I was maybe a 3 on 1-to-10 scale, not bad at all. Also explained how he would take 95% of the glandular tissue, and do a little lipo. I'm pretty damn lean, so when I flex my pec's the only part that stays soft is the gland -easy for him to see what he'd do. Also told me I need to be clean for 6-8 weeks before surgery. Price tag for this = $7500, and 12 weeks to recover, give or take.

Well I don't know that I'll do it because it isn't severe at all, plus he definitely put me at ease showing me pics of real gyno that he's corrected (holy shit it was fucked up!).

BTW, he's a very nice, soft spoken guy - much respect to him for helping the BB community and understanding what we do.

DrG

 

[JETHRO TULL]

WELL.....HOLY CRAP!

7,500???!! I THINK I'D WAIT UNTIL IT WAS REALLY BUGGING THE HELL OUT OF ME BEFORE I SPENT THAT KIND OF MONEY. THAT'S JUST ME THOUGH!

 

[Reload]

The price for peace of mind...
It's a simple procedure really. I've had it done twice. You'll notice that Dr. Nadler said that he would only remove 95% of the glandular tissue. The reason for this is that the 5% he leaves in is to support your nipple, preventing a concaved or dimpled appearance. Understand though that that 5% can regrow tumorous cells and you could end up right back where you started. The Doc missed a chunk of mine and it grew back with a vengence. Your still going to need your anti-e's post procedure if you intend to go back on. I read differing opinions on this fact and on how the procedure is done. Some say that they've had the entire gland removed which I find doubtful. Others say that once you've had the procedure you won't need to spend your money on anti-e's ever again. I'm a living example that it can come back. Not only the left side where the chunk had been missed but the right as well regrew tissue just not at the same rate.
If your at a 3-10 I might forego the surgery for now, hit the nolvadex hard for awhile and cross your fingers. You might be able to save yourself $7,500 in non covered medical expenses. I would also lay off the heavy androgens for awhile. If you have hard glandular tissue under your nipples then they're probably there for good. It might shrink a bit. If what you have is simply puffy nipples with some associated pain and no hard glandular tissue then your chances are good at avoiding surgery and simply hitting the nolva and avoiding all aas with the exception of var, primo to maintain gains while going natty for awhile.

 

[drgoodbody]

Reload - you got it right bro. Dr. N said that is why he leaves that 5%, for nipple support, otherwise you will have an indentation. He also said that it does regrow, even with only 5% tissue there and so he says the pro's come in every few years for a touch up because of that. Now I don't cycle year round, only about 2 times a year for 12 weeks each, but he did recommend staying on nolva and arimidex even following the surgery.

For now I'm holding fire on the surgery (although I do have a bit of fiberous-ness under my nips) you really can't see anything abnormal. Only my wife or myself or the Dr. can even feel it.

DrG

 

[Reload]

It's a good thing you caught it when you did. Something to be said for being lean eh? With the nolva and removing the androgens from your cycle you should see a small reduction in the overall glandular mass. Now you'll need to figure out what it was about your cycling methodology that got you to this point and how to avoid it in the future. As Dr. Nadler said...the pro's regularly come in and have the tissue shaved down. These "Pros" either don't know what they're doing (highly doubtful as most have excellent trainers...Glass, Nicholl's etc) or they simply take so much shit that aromatization is unstopable no mater what dose of Arimidex, Femara, Extremasane, nolva etc. they're on.
Now imagine having to have this surgery repeatedly every 2 to 3 years...the things we do for our beloved sport huh? Makes ya think!

 

[drgoodbody]

Good question about my cycle. I haven't been able to figure it out, since my test dose was quite low. Here's what I've been on:

250mg/week Sustanon
600mg/week Equipoise
400mg/week Trenbolone
350mg/week Winstrol (but only for weeks 1-6)

1mg/day Arimidex
20mg/day Nolvadex
2.5mg/day Bromocriptine

Plus some clen and T3.

I just don't get it - not much there to aromatise.

And yes, Dr. N said that pro's are using so much gear that it is inevitable that they'll need a boob-shave every few years. He actually didn't seem surprised by my cycle at all, but also couldn't see why I'm feeling sore. In the past I've run 1g/week of Sust and nothing - very strange.

My other Doc, Dr. Colker told me during my last cycle that injection frequency (androgen spikes) tend to cause gyno more often than cycles with less frequent injection. Maybe there's something to that, since on this cycle I'm injecting something nearly everyday, where as last cycle it was only two injections a week.

Well I'm open to any thoughts on this subject you guys might have. I'm here to learn.

BTW, the cycle above has made me harder and look better than any previous cycle ever.

DrG

 

[Reload]

That's a pretty heafty dose of tren per week and I'll bet that's where your problems originate. Tren, Deca, anadrol all lend themselves to progesterone induced gyno. The bromo you were taking I'm betting was to avoid this conversion...I've seen very few posts from reputable individuals stating that bromo actually worked. Those few that stated bromo actually helped complained about the sides of the bromo itself more than their gyno.
I have a suspicion that your physiology doesn't handle tren very well or you've simply gone overboard with the tren dose. I'm assuming your refering to the acetate version and not the ester heavy enanthate right? I'm old enough to remember good old french parabolin ( yep I'm an old fart now) and how frequently it was used back then. Most guys got away with one dose every 6 days at 76mg/ml with 250-500mg Sustanon per week and some D-bol (20-30mg/day) run straight through for 10 weeks. Now thats a very small dose when you start to calculate the ester weight attached to it being a hexy. Your taking the acetate version (the test suspension of tren) that only hangs around for a day or two...that's a lot of trenbolone per week but not uncommon by these boards standards. I understand you feel the tren has made a difference in your body comp but if the trade off is gyno...well, I'm sure you can make your own conclusions.
BTW...I had no problems with real Parabolin at 1ml per week but when fina (a.k.a finaplix pellets converted to injectable) became all the rage I tried it and also developed sensitive nips at 100mg EOD or roughly the same dose as you are taking per week. I ended up decreasing my fina dose to 50mg EOD and that seem to take care of the problem. Another option is to simply remove the tren from your cycle all together and opt for another compound.

 

[drgoodbody]

Agreed, I think it is progesterone related and due to the tren. Bromo helps with prolactin levels, not progesterone directly. For that you need mifepristone (RU486). Thats about the only drug that will combat progesterone directly as far as I know. Well I'm dialing back the tren now, and btw, bromo does cause me some nausea as a side effect. This cycle I opted for a body comp change cycle, not a new set of boobs, LMAO. My tren is UG lab made from powder, not pellets (although I've done that too).

BTW Reload, how old are you? I'm 36, so not exactly a newbie, but still learning.

Thanks for the advice bro,

DrG

 

[Renegade]

A good doc in Michigan does it for 4 grand, and you can finance it. Want more details?

 

[Mr_Magoo]

would luv 2 know how 2 finance it