HAmmer strength iso side lateral machine

[anab0lic]

Does anyone rate this machine as a good side delt builder? I just am not getting alot from dumbell or cable work (tried just about every variation) and think this machine could be the solution.... I have tried it once before but I didnt feel it THAT much in my side delts.... I do find that with alot of machines sometimes it takes a few workouts to get the best out of them though...

 

[triathloncoach]

I'm certain it will work. Variation is a key for hypertrophy. They have been around for decades. But it sounds pretty silly. How about the one armed lateral raise while kneeling on a bosu ball. (Dave Tate quote)

I'm almost all compound exercises. My shoulder workout is hang cleans, shoulder press and heavy bag work.

But I also dont look like a body builder. Not much variation in my workouts. Just 30 years of consistent gym time. And 4 years of consistent gear use.

ISO-Lateral + Gear = Nice delts.

 

[E.J.]

I used this machine last week at a new gym and loved it. But I like the Dumbells and cables too. I will just add this machine to my routine. Get a great pump from it. I think it allows for better form than Dumbells, keeps u from using momentum when ur getting fatigued.

 

[PitbullTank]

lmaooo...."the solution"???? LOL....the exercise is fine...but dont think that by switching to a hammer strength machine from DBs that all of a sudden your delts are just gonna start to takeoff...if dbs and cables havent provided any progress, you arent going to experience any w these either...

i also dont understand how you cant "feel" a db or cable lateral raise in your delts unless ur doing it wrong...

 

[anab0lic]

lmaooo...."the solution"???? LOL....the exercise is fine...but dont think that by switching to a hammer strength machine from DBs that all of a sudden your delts are just gonna start to takeoff...if dbs and cables havent provided any progress, you arent going to experience any w these either...

i also dont understand how you cant "feel" a db or cable lateral raise in your delts unless ur doing it wrong...

The problem with dumbells is you only get resistence for 1/3 of the movement where grqavity is pulling downwards.

The problem i have with cables is running the cable behind or infront of your body it seems not to target the side delt as effectively pulling at that angle.

Also the weight really needs o be placed on the elbows not arms straight....

I have terrible shoulders (narrow clavicles) and even then slightest bit of growth there would make a big difference for me.

 

[718si]

The problem with dumbells is you only get resistence for 1/3 of the movement where grqavity is pulling downwards.

The problem i have with cables is running the cable behind or infront of your body it seems not to target the side delt as effectively pulling at that angle.

Also the weight really needs o be placed on the elbows not arms straight....

I have terrible shoulders (narrow clavicles) and even then slightest bit of growth there would make a big difference for me.

Start pinning prop, npp, and gh in your side delts... They will grow.

 

[718si]

The problem with dumbells is you only get resistence for 1/3 of the movement where gravity is pulling downwards.

The problem i have with cables is running the cable behind or infront of your body it seems not to target the side delt as effectively pulling at that angle.

Also the weight really needs o be placed on the elbows not arms straight....

I have terrible shoulders (narrow clavicles) and even then slightest bit of growth there would make a big difference for me.

Add these too:

 

[PitbullTank]

The problem with dumbells is you only get resistence for 1/3 of the movement where grqavity is pulling downwards.

The problem i have with cables is running the cable behind or infront of your body it seems not to target the side delt as effectively pulling at that angle.

Also the weight really needs o be placed on the elbows not arms straight....

I have terrible shoulders (narrow clavicles) and even then slightest bit of growth there would make a big difference for me.

something tells me your form is off...could b wrong tho, not trying to be an asshole...just sounds like it from ur explanations..i can make my delts burn w 5lb pink dbs...i dont see how you cant feel these exercises unless its not being done properly...

 

[summersgold]

Start pinning prop, npp, and gh in your side delts... They will grow.

I have never seen any study that shows that specific site inj. is effective. In fact an article in Mus. Dev. Mag. says that specific site inj. works the same as glute or thigh injection. I have tried site inj. and never got results.

 

[drflex]

i love the hammer machines, but for shoulders i prefer dumb-bells

 

[ManoftheWorld]

since incline bench helps a good deal on my front delts, when I train shoulders, to balance out the incline bench, I notice I get a good side delt response from heavy db press but I'll do a wide sweeping arc at times so its kinda like doing a flye movement. similar in concept to the "W" press but I try keep my tri/elbows at parallel with floor to for minimal strain on my shoulder joint as well as keeping an overhand grip instead of neutral grip of the "W" .. Ill also throw in cross body cable lateral raises while keeping my body canted to same side as doing current set, usually using opposite hand to hold the cable rail for support as I lean out.. I will alternate with my arm sweeping motion both in front of me as well as behind my back.. making sure to pause at the top of every rep also... burn in great pump I get leaves me movement restrictive for a while after training but with minimal stress on my joint so Im not hating life later on..

 

[718si]

I have never seen any study that shows that specific site inj. is effective. In fact an article in Mus. Dev. Mag. says that specific site inj. works the same as glute or thigh injection. I have tried site inj. and never got results.

From the Dr G Q/A thread:

Great news guys! We have some feedback and answers here. He sent this over to me this morning. There is some pretty damn good information here, that I was previously unaware of pertaining to NPP and a few other things I had no idea about. Please read this you guys, theres some awesome info here!!


As he mentions in his opening paragraph. Please take this information into consideration and where it came from. I don't want this thread to be a pissing contest, but more an informative thread that we can all post in and take info from to help us in our training, nutrition, AAS usage, etc. If you disagree with him, please feel free to say so, but please keep things formal and respectful.






Heres the answers:


==============================================

"First, i wanted to give props to PM and Big A and all the mods for running
such a great board for the members here. I wanted to say thanks to G and
GearDepot for giving me this opportunity to be here and share my views and
experiences in this field. I had been approached by other sponsors to do
something similar but honestly i was always hesitant. But having had
patients, clients and friends who have used GearDepot with nothing but
positive and 100% satisfaction that i decided to accept their offer of
working with them and helping the members of this board with questions
regarding AAS use, HRT, anti-aging and medical related questions. I am a
lurker on this board and will monitor this thread during the week and will
make one long post and try to answer and include as many of the questions
that i can answer with certainty that i believe will help other members of
this board. Please remember that I am not God, and my word may not be the
last and final. If you disagree with what i say, it is perfectly ok, but
remember that real science usually wins over individual experiences and
what you have heard at the gym or bro science. Just because someone jumped
and their parachute failed to open and they survived the fall does not mean
that it makes it a safe idea. At the end of the day this is GearDepot's thread
and i dont want to turn this into a pissing contest. Just to give you some
ideas of my background, i have extensive experience and research Primobolan,
pretty much all forms of nandrolone and testosterone doing research at
Schering. Working with clients and pro athletes i also have experience on
a patient & individual level on other AAS including HGH, post cycle
recovery and TRT.

The question regarding long term high dose AAS was brought up and what long
term effects they have and i definitely want to address that and also tie
that into long term and high dose nandrolone products. Let's face it, there
are not any medical studies that show or prove what happens to humans
exposed to high dose and long term AAS since they will be considered
unethical. No legitimate research facility is going to put humans on any
AAS at high doses for 10+ yrs to assess results. Hell, we dont even to
that to rats However, we have a lot of research from rats, monkeys and
yes even chickens that give us a lot of insight. We also have quite a bit
of data from what we see in lab changes when individual patients have
exposed themselves to high levels of AAS. Lipid abnormalities, prostate
hypertrophy, higher blood viscosity, high red blood counts, gyno, hair
loss, ventricular hypertrophy, higher risk of thrombosis (clotting),
coronary artery disease have all been witnessed and proven in some form
with all AAS at high dosages. Yes, sometimes the truth hurts, but it is
what it is. We did quite a bit of studies on chicken and rats with
nandrolone decanoate. Now to quality we did use high dosage for research
animals. We used typically 10mg/kg weekly which is high. This equals to
900mg of Deca weekly for a 200lb human. But even after 10 weeks of usage,
there would be significant increase in heart size particularly left
ventricle enlargement in the range of 20%. That is a huge number in 10
weeks. This causes severe strain in the left heart, increase in MAP (mean
arterial pressure) which causes further strain and stenosis (tightening) of
the arteries. Remember that arteries and arterioles also have muscle, and
just like your other muscles that get stronger, those muscles get stronger
too and in the process clamp down tighter which raises blood pressure.
Most AAS also increase RBC count which also "thickens" the blood an causes
increase in BP overall.

In human subjects we used much lower dosages such as 2-5mg/kg per week and
although not as bad as 10mg/kg/week finding we still found higher BP and
increase in heart size per 2D echocardiograms just after 12 weeks. Many
studies had to be halted early because continuation in humans was
considered unethical. The major problem with the decanoate, laurate, and
hexylphenylpropionate is that they are so long acting that they take so
long to kick in and stabilize and on top of that take weeks to leave the
body that almost first 4-5 weeks is "dead time" followed by another 4-6
weeks of "clearing" time. So there is a lot of time that you are exposed
to the drug and getting the side effects without the "positive" that
athletes are looking for in the process. This is why i am a huge of NPP.
This allows all the benefits of nandrolone but without all the dead time
and clearing time of the longer esters. This also allows to get the
maximum benefits in the shortest amount of time so you are exposing your
body to the least amount of nandrolone. To me minus the more frequent
injections, there is absolutely no reason why anybody should choose
decanoate over NPP, period. There is not one single advantage. Another
point that a lot of people do not simply know is that nandrolone definitely
has site enhancing properties. We used to inject nandrolone in live
chicken breasts where we would only inject in one of the breasts and after
10 weeks, one breast would be 15-20% bigger and under microscopy the fibers
were 20% thicker in the breast that was site injected.


One thing that was never researched for simplicity and not to confuse
results was combining multiple AAS in a single subject. We had to be sure
scientifically that lab abnormalities or whatever we found was results of
one compound and not a combination etc. So i cant comment on when some
guys use 6 different AAS and wonder which is the culprit lol. When you have
what i call a "taco salad" of compounds there is no way one can predict in
a single individual how all those will react together at said dosages.

Questions have been raised about PCT and best methods. I think that most
people have it down right pretty well on this board. We used
anti-estrogens such
as tamoxifen or toremifine (which i prefer) along with clomid and HCG at
Schering. AI's although serve great purpose during a cycle for estrogen
control have no role in PCT. Clomid and tore used for four weeks along
with HCG at small dosages 150-200mcg three times a week work great. With
some recent studies that have come out, i have been recommending triptorelin to
my patients at 100mcg as a singe shot after the last AAS has cleared out of
their system followed by Clomid/anti-est/ but with no HCG and have gotten
better results. Needless to say that no matter what your PCT method is
going to be, your body can only go back to what it was doing before. Most
people never have gotten a baseline test level before ever starting. So if
your test level was 500 when you started naturally, the best PCT can only
bring you back to that level. But so many people only check afterwards and
by numbers see they are "low" and blame the cycle or their PCT regimen. I
like to keep my patients between 800-1100 total test levels with their E2
less than 30. Most men will start to feel symptoms of low test below
500-600. And certainly less than 400. I can honestly say that i have
never tested a natural patient over the age of 40 that had a normal test
level. It is just not going to happen. Low testosterone (hypogonadism) is a
disease condition that is getting more and more tested, accepted and
treated. It was a big no no a few years ago and physicians never asked
their patients pertinent questions to get to deeper root of the problem.
It was a knee jerk reaction to just put a guy on Viagra or Cialis without
even checking their test level. It blows my mind.


As far as blood clots go, lets talk about what happens when a normal person
get a blood clot. Blood clots happen in two places majority of the times
.Either in the deep veins of the calf (DVT-deep vein thrombosis) or when
they break off and go to the lungs and you get a pulmonary embolus which
may be life threatening. If either of these two are diagnosed a full work
up should be done in a patient. This includes blood work up to look at
genetic causes which make you more likely to form blood clots such as
protein C or S deficiency, occult malignancies since cancer also makes you
prone to blood clots, etc. If neither of those things are found we look for
other things and if all those are negative it is called idiopathic (which
basically is another way of saying we have no clue why) and patient is
started on blood thinners for six months. If after six months, you have
not developed blood clots then you can be removed from blood thinners and
monitored. If you develop another blood count subsequent to that then you
have bought yourself a ticket for life time blood thinner therapy. The
bottom line is that since we know AAS increases the chance of of blood
clotting, if you test negative for all other causes, then we must and have
to blame AAS for the cause. There is no physician in this world that is
going to give you a stamp of approval that you can go on "anabolic" dosages
of AAS with a history of blood clots. I urge you to re-evaluate your life
and see what is important. Is drying from a saddle embolus? I dont believe
so. Having test levels in the 800-1100 range we believe is ok and does not
raise your chance since those are physiologic levels. Whether you are on
AAS or not i always urge all of my patients to take aspirin 81mg daily, 3gr
of high quality Omega 3 as in DHA and EPA, high quality fats such as those
that come from almonds, walnuts, Brazilian nuts , and avocados regularly.
So there is no question that if you are on AAS those become even more
important to make sure you are at least protecting yourself as much as
possible.

A question was asked about if AAS reduces metabolism, and to my knowledge i
have not seen any research that shows any direct evidence. Bottom line is
"metabolism" itself is tested by checking your TSH, free T3 and free T4. If
those numbers are all normal then you dont have a "metabolism" problem.
Now your test or IGF-1 maybe low which may make you feel sluggish but it
is not necessarily a "metabolism" problem. Hope that makes sense.

I would like to also address the question regarding shelf life of AAS.
When i prescribe TRT doses which ware 100-150mg a week a 10ml (200mg of
test cyp/ml) lasts anywhere from 20 to 13 weeks based on those dosages.
Nobody throws away their vials after 28 days and it works just fine.
Testosterone does not degrade and i have known patients that have unopened
vials that are three years old that they are using and their test levels
still come back just fine. Remember that pharma companies will put many
recommendations to increase their profit. A specific example is Botox.
Allergan recommends that you discard the 100unit vial if not used after 4
hours. This is pure crock of shit. Botox can be used for up to 30 days
after reconstituted as long as kept refrigerated at 8deg C. They of course
say that so you throw the stuff away and buy more Botox but everyone in the
industry has caught on.


I hope the above will help the members with some of the questions. Please
continue to post new questions, or follow up questions to the thread and i
will be back in a week with another long post and will try to answer as
many questions as possible. Once again, thank you all for chiming in here
and everybody should thank GearDepot to reaching out to bring this to you
guys. They are truly a class act in this business."



===========================================

 

[718si]

I have never seen any study that shows that specific site inj. is effective. In fact an article in Mus. Dev. Mag. says that specific site inj. works the same as glute or thigh injection. I have tried site inj. and never got results.

Measure your arms.

Put 1cc of prop into your smaller arm for a month.

Measure them again.

Tell me it doesn't work.

 

[BigJB]

Most people from what I've observed use too much range of motion in their side lateral work and end up using more of their traps along with tilting their head and slightly bending their knees using momentum to help them because they are using entirely too much weight to show off for the broskis.

I know that was a run on sentence but you get my point.

 

[rmtt]

When I first started lifting, I never did any laterals.

Just heavy(for me anyway) DB presses in a limited range of motion where I didn't lock out at the top, and never dropped the weights to low. I found a certain range that caused a burn...and stayed in that range.

I have a lot of guys at the gym tell me I that I have decent genetics for shoulders because to be honest, I have trained them maybe 5 times directly in the last year or so except for heavy shrugs which I use for Trap work.

Now if only my arms would respond so nicely...

 

[Ashop]

Does anyone rate this machine as a good side delt builder? I just am not getting alot from dumbell or cable work (tried just about every variation) and think this machine could be the solution.... I have tried it once before but I didnt feel it THAT much in my side delts.... I do find that with alot of machines sometimes it takes a few workouts to get the best out of them though...

I like this machine real well. I always keep enough weight on it to let me do no more than 10 reps. I typically do these after my compound shoulder movements.

 

[premedmonster]

Start pinning prop, npp, and gh in your side delts... They will grow.

ya theyll grow from inflamation haha prop and npp ouch

 

[premedmonster]

o and i love this machine, my delts suck prob since im 6'4'' and dont have wide clavacles but theyre comin along, just be consistent and beat the shit out of the side delt, on this machine i like to go maybe halfway up, any higher i feel my traps taking over, and when u go down dont go all the way keep tension at all times and youll def feel a goodpump. i like doing these before dbs

 

[Ashop]

o and i love this machine, my delts suck prob since im 6'4'' and dont have wide clavacles but theyre comin along, just be consistent and beat the shit out of the side delt, on this machine i like to go maybe halfway up, any higher i feel my traps taking over, and when u go down dont go all the way keep tension at all times and youll def feel a goodpump. i like doing these before dbs

Alot of people do these like pre-exhaust style like you said,,before your DB presses.