HCG Benefits w/TRT

[MrPump]

I'm currently on 150/wk, but reading this site (as I have for years) I see a lot of posts regarding HCG.

Can someone tell me what the benefits are? Is it just your sex drive? Also, what symptoms would one have to indicate that HCG is a possible solution to discuss with their Dr?

Thanks in advance.
Pump

 

[Diamond Jim]

Hi - I ordered some HCG after reading this thread earlier. I found when I took it my Estrogen went up so high I couldn't do the nasty. Okay, I don't know what it was which went up, but I know what went DOWN!

Something I don't know and wonder about is whether it matters WHY you are on TRT. In my case, gonad #1 suffered a long and agonizing death when I was in my 20's, then #2 started to give out just before I hit 50. So, I thought "let's give number 2 a boost!". Number 2 has shrunk, and I was hoping he would grow bigger too. Well, maybe he did grow a bit, but as I said, I was not happy about the rest. FYI I tried 500mg once a week, then twice a week.

Now, here is something you can take home, instead of all this anecdotal stuff. Have a look at Dr. G's thread. In there he says to stay AWAY from HCG,that it f#$%s-up your other levels too much. Because I don't go on cycles, I can't remember what he said about PCT then, but anyway, don't take my word for it, but I'd think twice about not taking his.

Yes, that means your balls will shrink. Somebody tell me I'm wrong, but....

Jim

 

[SlimyToodleTot]

I too have always wondered about this. If you're already shut down, why try to restart everything if your body's going to recognize the imbalance in testosterone from being on TRT or being "on." Especially, since it raises your E so much. I have heard so many mixed opinions on this. I can speak from experience, my endo only put me on HCG after being on for 4 years and my wife and I started trying to have a baby. He discontinued TRT and we went HCG for a month. Everything returned to normal. On top of all this, things I read say that HCG can cause Lydeig cell death. Why would a person want to run so much if Lydeig cell death is a real possibility unless its absolutely necessary, like when trying to have a baby or recover PCT

 

[MaineGuy]

I too have always wondered about this. If you're already shut down, why try to restart everything if your body's going to recognize the imbalance in testosterone from being on TRT or being "on." Especially, since it raises your E so much. I have heard so many mixed opinions on this. I can speak from experience, my endo only put me on HCG after being on for 4 years and my wife and I started trying to have a baby. He discontinued TRT and we went HCG for a month. Everything returned to normal. On top of all this, things I read say that HCG can cause Lydeig cell death. Why would a person want to run so much if Lydeig cell death is a real possibility unless its absolutely necessary, like when trying to have a baby or recover PCT

Leydig cells also start to die when your testicles are not producing. Besides keeping your boys plump, this is one of the reasons docs prescribe HCG.

 

[mike3000l]

One of the main reasons guys incorporate HCG on trt is to preserve fertility. Usually docs will incorporate hcg with younger guys or guys wanting to have a child in the future. Do you want any/more kids?

If your sex drive and errection quality is good and you dont want more kids I dont see the advantage

 

[SlimyToodleTot]

Good to know. In one of the Muscular Developments mag's, Greg Valinteno mentions every 6 weeks, run 500 iu every other day for a couple of weeks. What do you think of this method compared to ALL THE TIME when on TRT. And since you're "on" all the time while on TRT, 500 iu EOD or 250?

 

[Donzi]

Good to know. In one of the Muscular Developments mag's, Greg Valinteno mentions every 6 weeks, run 500 iu every other day for a couple of weeks. What do you think of this method compared to ALL THE TIME when on TRT. And since you're "on" all the time while on TRT, 500 iu EOD or 250?

500-1k units a week is all you need. The best is to do 250 4x wk for absorption rate. I still do 500 2x wk. its great to keep your sex drive from crashing.

 

[kaleb]

i take 150iu hcg 2x week. works great.everybody is different. if i take more than that,my estrogen gets to high and i suffer from anxiaty.

 

[Diamond Jim]

Hey Kaleb (and all),

That's interesting. So, what does the HCG do in you or I? If our nads aren't producing enough test, CAN they produce more? Is it the FSH which is actually lacking? It sounds like it. Oh, and sperm too? They are not stimulated by the same hormone, are they?

F#@#% you know, I read this stuff so many times, but it just goes in one ear and out the other until one day I need it, then I have to go and read again.

Has anyone had a read of Dr. G's thread?? Honestly, this guy is so impressive. I would love to have my sex-drive higher (my girlfriend is 10 years younger, and likes LOTS), but there are other ways to do that than HCG. Sperm production is another story. Guess I'll have to go read Dr. G again.

 

[Stewie]

Hey Kaleb (and all),

That's interesting. So, what does the HCG do in you or I? If our nads aren't producing enough test, CAN they produce more? Is it the FSH which is actually lacking? It sounds like it. Oh, and sperm too? They are not stimulated by the same hormone, are they?

F#@#% you know, I read this stuff so many times, but it just goes in one ear and out the other until one day I need it, then I have to go and read again.

Has anyone had a read of Dr. G's thread?? Honestly, this guy is so impressive. I would love to have my sex-drive higher (my girlfriend is 10 years younger, and likes LOTS), but there are other ways to do that than HCG. Sperm production is another story. Guess I'll have to go read Dr. G again.

Exogenous Testosterone has a mild suppressive action of Pregenolone via disruption of LDL cholesterol (doses dependant,hence the elevation of LDL with higher doses) Pregenolone is the first hormone synthesized from LDL cholesterol. A intermediate decrease of naturally occurring Pregenolone results in a decrease with the metabolisms of corticosteroid, mineralocorticoids, glucocorticoids, androgens, and estrogens, as well as the neuroactive steroid Allopregnanolone( which is considered a feel good hormone).
Pregenolone also metabolises to 17 alpha-hydroxyprogesterone, and 17 alpha-hydroxypregnenolone as the only important delta 5 intermediate, Androstenedione and testosterone and estrone.

So what's this have to do with hCG? hCG not only mimics LH,it also stimulates 17-hydroxyprogesterone in the testicles therefore may help restore (back fill) the production of said disrupted Endogenous hormones ie ; mineralocorticoids, glucocorticoids, Androstenedione ect, ect. Keep in mind Testosterone is primarily produced in the testicles, and a small amount is secreted from the adrenal glands.

Many men feel a better sense of well-being while supplementing with hCG, some over do it raising their Estradiol levels to high.

If you have the opportunity, I would suggest reading up on literature by Dr. Eugene Shippen, Dr John Crisler and Dr Mariano. They are a wealth of knowledge when it comes to hormones.

 

[Stewie]

I'm currently on 150/wk, but reading this site (as I have for years) I see a lot of posts regarding HCG.

Can someone tell me what the benefits are? Is it just your sex drive? Also, what symptoms would one have to indicate that HCG is a possible solution to discuss with their Dr?

Thanks in advance.
Pump

You may print this off and discuss with your Physician, if you need more studies,let me know.

**broken link removed**

 

[Dopamin]

Lydeig cell death can occur but you have to take large amounts of hcg over 5000IU for a longer time

on trt hcg is benifical for the libido and it prevents the nuts from shrinking,keeps semen volume normal and can also help obtain fertility because with hcg your nuts are producing intracellular Testosteron which works different in some way than exogenous Test


i felt always better with HCG on TRT

 

[buck]

hcg can benefit libido, mood, appearance,a boost in T levels. it also stimulates your P450 to keep operating and sends cholesterol down stream for other functions. 250iu 2x week works for me as per a couple Dr's i have dealt with. less seems to work as well for me too. E2 has not been a big issue for me.

 

[Ehren]

Great post, Stewie.
Couple questions:

I read an article recently that states supplementing with R-ALA protects Leydig cells from desensitizing during hCG administration. Any truth to it?

How much is estrogen raised (estimated %) by administration of hCG on average. Say, when taking 250iu 2x a week. Is there any dose-dependant curve that's sort of reliable? I notice this is the only time I need to raise the an AI when on TRT.

To the OP, I always feel better on hCG when running AAS or after long enough on TRT alone. Benefit are: Sex drive up, it keeps testes full and just overall a less "burnt out" feeling. So, I guess more well-being overall.

Drawbacks are: raised Estrogen which I can usually feel 2-3 days after using hCG and see on my body in the form of bloat in 4 or so, accompanied by a bad attitude if I don't use an AI. Then trying to figure out how much Aromasin to use, while not overdoing it, which is tricky.

My "solution" had been to use a low dose of Aromasin (6mg) the day before, day of, and day after hCG. It's not perfect, but better than getting all bloated and pissy.

 

[cornertech]

I'm currently on 150/wk, but reading this site (as I have for years) I see a lot of posts regarding HCG.

Can someone tell me what the benefits are? Is it just your sex drive? Also, what symptoms would one have to indicate that HCG is a possible solution to discuss with their Dr?

Thanks in advance.
Pump

HCG will generally help you make more testosterone naturally especially while on TRT, which will somewhat suppress your body's own ability to do so. It may also help keep your HPTA, SHBG and FSH in check.

 

[lacey23]

I've used HCG for years with my TRT and had a bitch of a time dialing in. I didn't really know it wasn't an option to not use it, as my Dr's always used it. It was impossible for me to synch up the rise in E2 with AI's. Others seem to be able to do it.

The problem imo is that HCG has a 33 hour half life. Assuming that the test+E2 production correlates somewhat with the half life of HCG, that means E2 can be all over the place throughout the week if you are prone to E2 from HCG. Personally with 250x2 /week of HCG my E2 was in the 50's (after 4 days since last HCG inject), and without it I'm in the 20's. So my e2 could have been swinging 20-30 points throughout the week. Trying to control that with an AI (that has it's own half life to deal with) proved to be impossible.

All that said. When I'm completely off HCG I feel anxiety, and a decreased sense of well being. So, what I've ended up doing is using a tiny dose of HCG. ~20iu's EOD. For me personally I get just as much 'well being', and libido from 20iu's EOD as I do from larger doses, and I have a lot less e2 to deal with. Also, since the injections are so frequent, the change in E2 levels isn't as significant.

There's still some problems with it. For example, after I take the injection Libido goes up, but wood gets worse. Then, the next day wood is fine, and Libido is worse. Mood is good throughout. I'm personally not a big fan of AI's, and end up using zinc, and DHT gel to help deal with that.

 

[O40]

Hey guys I will chime in here. I run HCG at 250 IUS 2X a week. Seems to be perfect for me, I ran 500 a several times and it spikeed my Estrogen levels and last time I was tinkering started a bit of gyno as I was adding prop to my HRT dose. I do feel better afterwards but need to keep it at 250. Whan I supplment my HRT dose I found that Adex at .25 mg every 3 days works, more than that and it knock my libido in the dirt. I am 51 and lovin life w HRT.