Healing peptides for ACL issues

[SMOLWARRIOR]

Small context, my wife has had 3 ACL tears all from playing soccer. Her most recent happened almost 2 years ago now. She has done PT and all sorts of therapy to assist with getting things back going. She still experiences pain and discomfort in her knees and especially worst when its cold or she trains legs. I've read how others have used BPC and other healing peptides after having surgeries and how beneficial its been to helping. My main question is about Oral healing peptides. She's already expressed how she wont inject for her own reasons but I've made mentions of the oral version and she doesn't seem opposed. How different is injecting the peptide to taking it orally and can we trust oral peptides or would injecting closer to the knee have more effect? thanks in advance

 

[kscowboy]

Most oral peptides (Only a couple of exceptions) dont do much at all.

 

[Ranchhand]

Most oral peptides (Only a couple of exceptions) dont do much at all.

The only people promoting oral versions of any peptides, including BPC-157, are people making a profit off of selling oral versions. Any clinical study you will read on the healing benefits of the healing peptides (BPC-157, TB-500, GHK-Cu, KPV) are injection only. I've used BPC, TB and GHK to heal injuries, recover from surgeries, heal up chronic tendinitis and improve digestion and gut health. I'm living proof they work. I will Only inject them, I will never waste my money on orals. Your wife needs to make the decision if she wants to hold true to ethical/moral or phobias to needles, or use something that has now been proven to being effective at healing damaged, torn, and injured tissue. She's had at least 2 tears in one of her knees, if not 3 tears in one knee. Each re-injury to a knee means it's becoming less stable and potentially more painful. What does she want, a potentially stronger healthier knee pain-free or hold onto certain beliefs.

You mentioned 3 ACL tears, but does that including one, two or three surgeries or no surgeries. That's important, BPC-157 and TB-500 are amazing healing peptides, but there's limitations, an example is a full ACL tear.

The questions you ask have been answered numerous times in the multitude of threads about BPC, TB and the healing peptides on the board. Which includes the discussion on oral versions of these peptides.

 

[SMOLWARRIOR]

thanks for the added info! I posted this and quickly found the threads on these types of peptides shortly after.

From what I understand she’s had 2 ACL reconstruction surgeries one on each knee (patellar tendon graft) and 1 patellar cartilage scraping surgery due to cartilage degradation on her right side

I’ve shared some of the posts I’ve seen here and articles that I’ve read so that she could potentially think about it and the benefits it could have for her. I shared your experience with her also @Ranchhand thank you

Thanks guys

 

[Ranchhand]

thanks for the added info! I posted this and quickly found the threads on these types of peptides shortly after.
Checkout the 2 posts below from Knight9 on dosing protocol, frequency, and amounts:

Knight's Post #10:

Wolverine Stack BPC-157 & TB-500?

I've never used TB-500 or BPC-157. I tried to research administration techniques on the internet but getting a lot of mixed information. I want to run these compounds to help heal my thumb injury. I ramped up my HGH for a minute and it swelled up the joints in my hand. I went to the gym one...

www.professionalmuscle.com

Knight's Post #16:

How much BPC-157??

So my boss who is very active and 73 years old just ruptured his Achilles tendon playing pickleball.... he just had surgery Friday and is looking to mend as quickly as a 73 year old can..... His doctor (super cool from what he told me) is all for him taking peps to improve healing.... also he's...

www.professionalmuscle.com

From what I understand she’s had 2 ACL reconstruction surgeries one on each knee (patellar tendon graft) and 1 patellar cartilage scraping surgery due to cartilage degradation on her right side
Cartilage scraping is a tough one. Material is removed which means it will never be replaced or repaired. The only thing that could help regenerate the Cartilage removed from scraping is Stem Cell therapy. If not too much was scraped away there's potential that Stem Cells could regenerate the tissue, but it's not a 100%. But possibly if not too much cartilage needs to be regenerate to bring back to it's original state. The cool thing about TB-500 is it's that one peptide that triggers your body's own natural production of Stem cells. Sure, not at the level of Stem cell therapy itself, but it's still something that has potential to help.

I’ve shared some of the posts I’ve seen here and articles that I’ve read so that she could potentially think about it and the benefits it could have for her.
One of the main benefits she will most likely experience is a reduction in pain or irritation from flare ups of inflammation from active use in her knees. I've had three serious knee injuries with one involving an ACL tear. The MRI showed the tear, the doc tried to convince me I needed surgery. I said it looked like a partial tear. He tried to say it was a full tear but the MRI image was skewed. In my mind I said your full of shit and opted out of surgery. From research I did myself clinical data showed at that time people who had early in life arthroscopic knee surgery where material was removed there was a 70% chance of arthritic conditions with degenerative pain later on in life. I was too young at the time and said fuck that and got on HRT and it took 2 years, but I rehabilitated my knees myself.

I mainly contribute it to HGH and dedicated rehab I structured myself. I used Serostim at 4iu's to 2iu's per day for 2 years. This is what sold me on the miraculous healing properties of peptides. They hadn't separate the amino acid chains that make up BPC-157 and TB-500 yet. But these amino acid chains are in HGH, just not at the dose of these peptide chains of today where you can take BPC and TB by themselves. Today I use BPC-157 and TB-500 to mitigate inflammation. The only residual effect I have from the knee injuries is an occasional slight flare up in the meniscus, in which pinning some BPC-157 takes care of it within a day and the irritation (pain) from the inflammation is gone. I don't even have to pin it proximal to the knee with the flare up. Within a short period of time after injection the BPC-157 goes systemic all through the body. If she's open to it, let your wife read my personal testimonial to be benefits of these peptides. I'm sold and will use them as necessary the rest of my life.

Cheers , Ranchhand

 

[buck]

I have never found peptides to do much for any real tears. Nor for a joint that is very worn out. You can give them i try, i have but don't get your hopes up a lot.

 

[Ranchhand]

I have never found peptides to do much for any real tears. Nor for a joint that is very worn out. You can give them i try, i have but don't get your hopes up a lot.

I agree, to a point, a very worn out joint is a joint that doesn't have any or very little cartilage left. So yeah, peptides aren't going to be much help, but stem cells might be helpful. Pulled this from John's Hopkins Medicine:
Regrowing knee cartilage, which lacks a blood supply and cannot heal itself, is now possible through advanced surgical techniques and emerging therapies. Options include Autologous Chondrocyte Implantation (MACI), which grows your own cartilage cells in a lab, and mosaicplasty, which transplants cartilage from non-weight-bearing areas to repair damaged spots. While these procedures can delay knee replacement, they are typically for isolated injuries rather than full-blown osteoarthritis.

This is where I might not completely agree with you. Depends on what you define as a real tear. Tearing is tearing, if you have a bad partial or full tear, yeah most likely you're going to need surgery, but peptides will still help with recovery and healing. If you have a mild to micro tear, this is where I think peptides can be very beneficial to the healing process, effectiveness and end result quality. A middle of the road tear, there's a good chance you can end up with some level of deformity, but peptides could lessen the severity of deformity, but more importantly improve the quality of the healing process so that the tear itself is stronger and less susceptible to re-tearing.

 

[SMOLWARRIOR]

thanks for the added info! I posted this and quickly found the threads on these types of peptides shortly after.
Checkout the 2 posts below from Knight9 on dosing protocol, frequency, and amounts:

Knight's Post #10:

Wolverine Stack BPC-157 & TB-500?

I've never used TB-500 or BPC-157. I tried to research administration techniques on the internet but getting a lot of mixed information. I want to run these compounds to help heal my thumb injury. I ramped up my HGH for a minute and it swelled up the joints in my hand. I went to the gym one...

www.professionalmuscle.com

Knight's Post #16:

How much BPC-157??

So my boss who is very active and 73 years old just ruptured his Achilles tendon playing pickleball.... he just had surgery Friday and is looking to mend as quickly as a 73 year old can..... His doctor (super cool from what he told me) is all for him taking peps to improve healing.... also he's...

www.professionalmuscle.com

From what I understand she’s had 2 ACL reconstruction surgeries one on each knee (patellar tendon graft) and 1 patellar cartilage scraping surgery due to cartilage degradation on her right side
Cartilage scraping is a tough one. Material is removed which means it will never be replaced or repaired. The only thing that could help regenerate the Cartilage removed from scraping is Stem Cell therapy. If not too much was scraped away there's potential that Stem Cells could regenerate the tissue, but it's not a 100%. But possibly if not too much cartilage needs to be regenerate to bring back to it's original state. The cool thing about TB-500 is it's that one peptide that triggers your body's own natural production of Stem cells. Sure, not at the level of Stem cell therapy itself, but it's still something that has potential to help.

I’ve shared some of the posts I’ve seen here and articles that I’ve read so that she could potentially think about it and the benefits it could have for her.
One of the main benefits she will most likely experience is a reduction in pain or irritation from flare ups of inflammation from active use in her knees. I've had three serious knee injuries with one involving an ACL tear. The MRI showed the tear, the doc tried to convince me I needed surgery. I said it looked like a partial tear. He tried to say it was a full tear but the MRI image was skewed. In my mind I said your full of shit and opted out of surgery. From research I did myself clinical data showed at that time people who had early in life arthroscopic knee surgery where material was removed there was a 70% chance of arthritic conditions with degenerative pain later on in life. I was too young at the time and said fuck that and got on HRT and it took 2 years, but I rehabilitated my knees myself.

I mainly contribute it to HGH and dedicated rehab I structured myself. I used Serostim at 4iu's to 2iu's per day for 2 years. This is what sold me on the miraculous healing properties of peptides. They hadn't separate the amino acid chains that make up BPC-157 and TB-500 yet. But these amino acid chains are in HGH, just not at the dose of these peptide chains of today where you can take BPC and TB by themselves. Today I use BPC-157 and TB-500 to mitigate inflammation. The only residual effect I have from the knee injuries is an occasional slight flare up in the meniscus, in which pinning some BPC-157 takes care of it within a day and the irritation (pain) from the inflammation is gone. I don't even have to pin it proximal to the knee with the flare up. Within a short period of time after injection the BPC-157 goes systemic all through the body. If she's open to it, let your wife read my personal testimonial to be benefits of these peptides. I'm sold and will use them as necessary the rest of my life.

Cheers , Ranchhand

@Ranchhand I can’t thank you enough for this post. I was able to share this with her so she can also think about her own situation. She says she’s also heard similar regarding the cartilage scraping she admits she just didn’t want to accept it. At least now she’s also read another experience and can maybe take that step.
I know for a while she felt like helping was too far gone and she would just have to deal with the pain but at least she’s read another experience and she’s kind of turning the corner on the possibility.

Thank you for sharing your own experience once again man, really appreciate it

 

[buck]

I agree, to a point, a very worn out joint is a joint that doesn't have any or very little cartilage left. So yeah, peptides aren't going to be much help, but stem cells might be helpful. Pulled this from John's Hopkins Medicine:
Regrowing knee cartilage, which lacks a blood supply and cannot heal itself, is now possible through advanced surgical techniques and emerging therapies. Options include Autologous Chondrocyte Implantation (MACI), which grows your own cartilage cells in a lab, and mosaicplasty, which transplants cartilage from non-weight-bearing areas to repair damaged spots. While these procedures can delay knee replacement, they are typically for isolated injuries rather than full-blown osteoarthritis.

This is where I might not completely agree with you. Depends on what you define as a real tear. Tearing is tearing, if you have a bad partial or full tear, yeah most likely you're going to need surgery, but peptides will still help with recovery and healing. If you have a mild to micro tear, this is where I think peptides can be very beneficial to the healing process, effectiveness and end result quality. A middle of the road tear, there's a good chance you can end up with some deformity, but peptides could lessen the severity of deformity, but more importantly improve the quality of the healing so that the tear itself is stronger and less susceptible to re-tearing.

So it seems we agree you just use different words to say the same thing. That is why i said real tear as in it shows up on an MRI as a tear for example. If it is so microscopic that an MRI doesn't pick it up it could be anything causing the pain. I can't say where i have seen studies showing where a small noticeable tear, is such that actually healed and looked normal again, maybe there is and i haven't seen it. But if pain goes away i can't call that healing unless the tear heals to the point it looks normal on an MRI. I am talking in the real world and not in a lab setting. As i find those things often don't pan out when applied to the general population. Mostly going by my personal experience.

 

[Ranchhand]

Thank you for sharing your own experience once again man, really appreciate it

Anytime brother, glad I could help with some insight to the possibilities of getting some relief for the pain and potentially creating an opportunity to have a more full recovery for improved quality of life. I get it, when I had my knee injuries I thought there was a strong possibility that I could be labeled as disabled in my early 30's. Hell, I couldn't run for 10 yards without a major flare up where I was in severe pain the rest of the day. Peptides, primarily HGH, saved the day. I can run now pain free, even though I'm not much of a runner these days.

 

[Ranchhand]

So it seems we agree you just use different words to say the same thing. That is why i said real tear as in it shows up on an MRI as a tear for example. If it is so microscopic that an MRI doesn't pick it up it could be anything causing the pain. I can't say where i have seen studies showing where a small noticeable tear, is such that actually healed and looked normal again, maybe there is and i haven't seen it. But if pain goes away i can't call that healing unless the tear heals to the point it looks normal on an MRI. I am talking in the real world and not in a lab setting. As i find those things often don't pan out when applied to the general population. Mostly going by my personal experience.

Absolutely agree, about 10 years ago I hit a tree skiing pretty damn fast. Left a divot in the middle of my right quad. Eventually regained full function and strength, but cosmetically that divot will always be there.

So it seems we agree you just use different words to say the same thing.

Yes, you're right, that happens a lot on this board. When we communicate through cyber words, ie: messaging, some of the translation gets lost and misunderstanding sets in.

 

[buck]

Absolutely agree, about 10 years ago I hit a tree skiing pretty damn fast. Left a divot in the middle of my right quad. Eventually regained full function and strength, but cosmetically that divot will always be there.


Yes, you're right, that happens a lot on this board. When we communicate through cyber words, ie: messaging, some of the translation gets lost and misunderstanding sets in.

I try to be as literal as i can online of in person when communicating. And use words per the dictionary definition. Sometimes it comes off as me being an A hole when saying things exactly as i mean them to the best of my ability. And some times the shoe fits.

The DR that put my shoulder together in 1999 was the head of the sports ortho dept at the state university. Had his own practice, taught and did research. He was growing tendons in the lab back then and was experimenting with grafting them to animals. It still has not gone main stream. My x was a microbiologist/research scientist that was having great success with lower life forms of life modifying their own T cells of creatures so they could combat their own cancer. Was just starting on primates last time we talked. That was 25 years ago. That has not taken off either although it worked great in the lab. Those are just some of my reason to be skeptical about lab results. Even if i hope they end up panning out. Same with supps in lab studies. Devil's advocate can be a good way to learn i find.

 

[Ranchhand]

I try to be as literal as i can online of in person when communicating. And use words per the dictionary definition. Sometimes it comes off as me being an A hole when saying things exactly as i mean them to the best of my ability. And some times the shoe fits.

I like your approach and practice. I'm very similar, my posts are wordy to try and bring clarity. I choose my words to be precise in my explanation. I think through and review my posts and edit as necessary. I've seen too many back and forth arguments between members for lack of understanding because of a lack of conveying the point of view or understanding. Like you said, we said the same thing, but in different ways. I wish we could convey our thoughts like we do in person, but in cyber content to minimize confusion and unnecessary conflicts.