Hepatic adenomas what now

[ghoya15]

Okey guys here we go again , i compete since 18, i started with nonstop blast around 20 for 2 years on high dosages, i developed baretts esophagus so i dropped dosage low and after year i was very lucky but it completly dissapered and got cured BUT here we go again i started like retard again blast 2g here 2 g there 16iu gh, but atleast i go for year full body check (we got oncology program they make all tests for every possible cancer)

And to my big supprise they told me on ultrasound that i have 10cm mass on my liver and i need to go for CT, my liver enzymes only slightly elevated (i wasnt big on orals most of the time) all tumor markers came back normal. That day i dropped everything to 250mg test E e7d HCG 1500iu e3d and anastrazole 1mg/ed which is most likely overkill now but i need to make blood test on hormones too so i know where i stand right now.

On ct they found 7 masses, biggest one got 10cm but its FNH then same type masses like this one but smaller, hemangiomas and last one is hypoechoic (adenoma) this one is only 1,6cm. After ct they told me there is no cancer or anything going on and i need ultrasounds and blood test with tumor markers after half year or year.

So what can i do right now? Ofc i went on TRT dosages instantly there was no way around even its small it looks like its last warning for me but also i know for sure (i know myself) that once it gets better or resected i will come back to cycles but not in grams but in mgs this time no more abuse. Iam in touch with best liver surgeons we got here and plan my liver resection so i can get rid of the monsters. Sorry for bad english

Also i know it sounds stupid from some1 who abused shit tons of AS but simple blood work is good for nothing, i had liver enzymes almost normal my doctor wasnt even worried about it he thought its from heavy workout i had no problems i was feeling great and still had 10CM MASS on liver which is fucking hugeee.

 

[mike036]

From what I have read on here over the years it is the uncontrolled high estrogen that is the cause of these hepatic adenomas.

 

[FuriousAngus]

I don't have much to contribute, but hopefully it's not a tumor. Have you had your heart scanned/done an echo at any point during those years/post blast?

 

[ghoya15]

All of these are benign tumors, iam worried only about adenoma thats why i consider to get surgery done. About heart i only got EKG done, BP was always normal. Kidneys, stomach etc all without any problems. Also i had ultrasound 1 and half year before and i had nothing on liver so it grows quite fast with some help.

 

[xman280]

adenoma is a tumor....I researched after one of the board members posted his story about that. Supposedly not dangerous unless it keeps growing. common in people using steroids and women on anti pregnancy pills. A female colleague of mine has one that was discovered in her 20s, doc blames it on the pregnancy pills, but it stays the same size for a very long time - 2inch diam. so he doesnt see any need to open her, and she s been having it for past 20 years with no issues....so I guess GH and IGF might not be a good idea if a person has one of these. and yeah worst is that there will be no signs of it till they do a cat scan, ultra sound, MRI, maybe X-ray - idk. But ultra sound is not a bad idea - they tell u if liver is enlarged, if the see fatty tissue, and some kind of canals there being clogged or not....

 

[thethinker48]

adenoma is a tumor....I researched after one of the board members posted his story about that. Supposedly not dangerous unless it keeps growing. common in people using steroids and women on anti pregnancy pills. A female colleague of mine has one that was discovered in her 20s, doc blames it on the pregnancy pills, but it stays the same size for a very long time - 2inch diam. so he doesnt see any need to open her, and she s been having it for past 20 years with no issues....so I guess GH and IGF might not be a good idea if a person has one of these. and yeah worst is that there will be no signs of it till they do a cat scan, ultra sound, MRI, maybe X-ray - idk. But ultra sound is not a bad idea - they tell u if liver is enlarged, if the see fatty tissue, and some kind of canals there being clogged or not....

NO STEROID USE is a good idea in his case as well. All AAS are known to increase growth factors; the last thing you want with adenomas in your body.

If I were OP, I would consider coming off or at the very least run the least amount of TRT dose possible. And seriously reconsider future steroid use (I know that's the last thing anyone on here wants to hear). Talk to your MD about this; Stewie's input here would be very helpful, as will gotgame's.

This is why proper estrogen control, and ancillary use is important with PEDs. And why genetic propensity to adenomas is another risk factor (not as common, but something to keep in the back of your mind).

 

[gotgame]

Please search ProM for a member who recently died from liver cancer after what I suspect was conversion of an adenoma to HCC. I discuss much of this in details before he died.

If you have the mindset that you are going to keep cycling then honestly I dont know what to say. Please look into adenomas, androgren receptors, IGF receptors, conversion to hepatomas, how likely you are to survive one rupturing.. ok im done. Best of luck to you. If you are done cycling and want to discuss MRI imaging/biopsy results and management I would be happy to discuss that more.

My feeling is that once you develop adenomas your steroids usage days are a thing of the past.

 

[ghoya15]

You know its hard to say iam done cycling from day to day when 2 weeks ago i was getting into my pre comp. prep, but i always go for complete check before i start and this is how it end up. I sacrificed most of my life to gym not gonna lie. Thats why i try to look for options to keep going in future, what about liver resection? Also doctor actually told me that testosterone even as TRT is bad idea, i know it sounds weird but Deca only would be much better option (ofc you dont want to run deca only trt or cycle but we talk only about muscle maintain here not cycle) if surgery or next ultrasound will show that its getting bigger iam done for sure. (i will go in next 4 months)

 

[pesty4077]

You know its hard to say iam done cycling from day to day when 2 weeks ago i was getting into my pre comp. prep, but i always go for complete check before i start and this is how it end up. I sacrificed most of my life to gym not gonna lie. Thats why i try to look for options to keep going in future, what about liver resection? Also doctor actually told me that testosterone even as TRT is bad idea, i know it sounds weird but Deca only would be much better option (ofc you dont want to run deca only trt or cycle but we talk only about muscle maintain here not cycle) if surgery or next ultrasound will show that its getting bigger iam done for sure. (i will go in next 4 months)

The above guy is an expert on these matters (gotgame), unfortunately you don't seem to want to listen to sound advice. I think you are on a collision course with death and that is a shame at such a young age.

 

[thethinker48]

"A 27-year-old man with a 5-year history of anabolic steroid abuse presented to the emergency room with 2 d of midepigastric pain and nausea. His only medications were oral androstenedione and intramuscular nandrolone. He was a police officer and competitive bodybuilder. He denied use of alcohol, tobacco, and intravenous drugs. Physical examination disclosed midepigastric tenderness and tender hepatomegaly. Laboratories were notable for 2.2 mg/dL total bilirubin, 1.3 mg/dL direct bilirubin, 2457 U/L ALT, 431 U/L AST, and 275 U/L alkaline phosphatase. Hematocrit was 50.5%. Abdominal computed tomography (CT) on admission showed a round, heterogeneous-appearing 9.9 cm × 9.6 cm mass in the left lobe of the liver. Magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) with gadolinium contrast demonstrated multiple hepatic masses, the largest of which measured 10.6 cm ×10.6 cm. The largest mass had an enhancing capsule and demonstrated signal heterogeneity, characteristic of an adenoma with intralesional hemorrhage (Figure ​(Figure1A).1A). The patient underwent left lateral hepatic segmentectomy with open cholecystectomy. Pathologic examination revealed an adenoma with peliosis hepatis, 25 cm in diameter. The patient was instructed to discontinue steroid use. On MRI 3 mo later, the adenomas appeared 40% smaller (Figure ​(Figure1B).1B). The patient subsequently resumed oral androstenedione only."

"Approximately 3 years and a half after his first presentation, the patient returned to the emergency room with sudden-onset, right-upper quadrant pain in the setting of recurrent injection nandrolone use 6 wk earlier. Vital signs were within normal limits, and there was tender hepatomegaly. Laboratories were notable for ALT 625 U/L, AST 398 U/L, and normal alkaline phosphatase and total bilirubin. Prothrombin time (PT) was 13.1 s; international normalized ratio (INR) was 1.1. The hematocrit was 38.7%. Abdominal CT revealed several lesions in the right lobe of the liver, the largest of which had increased in size to 7.7 cm × 7.2 cm and demonstrated intralesional hemorrhage, accompanied by a subcapsular hematoma and intraperitoneal hemorrhage. CT angiogram on hospital day 2 showed no contrast extravasation, but the hematocrit dropped to 24.9%. On hospital day 3, the right upper quadrant pain worsened, and he became tachycardic. Repeat abdominal CT showed expansion of the hematoma, with new anterior subcapsular and subphrenic components (Figure ​(Figure2).2). The hematocrit was 24.4%. Because of his limited hepatic reserve and ongoing steroid abuse, he was felt to be a poor candidate for either hepatic resection or liver transplantation. He, therefore, underwent angiographic embolization of the accessory right hepatic artery. Four units of packed red blood cells were transfused. The serum ALT exceeded 10000 U/L after the procedure but declined over several days. After transient oliguric renal failure, he was discharged to home on post-procedural day 5."

This guy came in with hepatic adenomas (presumably from nandrolone use according to this case study); continued to use after he was discharged, and 3 1/2 years later came in with ruptured cysts that required a potentially life threatening procedure, and complete liver loss (a transplant wouldn't even be considered in his case).

As much as I can understand the psychological struggle of a bodybuilder; DO NOT take this lightly, and take up gotgame's offer of discontinuing AAS use and discussing what future steps you need to take.

 

[ghoya15]

Ive read much more on subject and most of posts from gotgame, and i will stop TRT too, ive got just couple more questions, what can i do next, how to maintain as much muscle as possible? I dont want to dissapear in few months to nothing. Also i would like to know more about surgery, if its good option, and why they didnt perform any biopsi, is it possible to tell its 100% adenoma just from contrast CT? What about tumor markers, is it good indicator if something is going on together with ultrasound every 4-6 months? Thanks everyone for help.

 

[needthepump]

Definitely drop the TRT as well. Staying alive is the most important thing right now. Seek out a liver specialist and push for frequent scans. Also, watch the drinking or consuming high amounts of sugar. The last thing you need on top of this issue is fatty liver.

 

[Kr0m]

Didn't bald Nazi have one of these that ruptured ?

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[needthepump]

What did your last labs show regarding liver function ? Was anadrol used by chance?

 

[needthepump]

You dodged one bullet with the Barrett's esophagus which can and does turn cancerous in some people. The liver issue is strike two and it should serve as an example to prioritize things in your life. Big muscles really don't mean shit in the end, especially when the pursuit of them causes so much damage.

My input of the issue is different than most here. I see the end result of people who abuse there bodies as I hook people up to dyalysis machines. Our fastest growing group are steroid abusers (especially tren) who combined with hypertension kept pushing the limits. Chasing another inch on the bicep, a bigger chest etc. Now their kidneys have failed. It doesn't happen overnight but it does happen when bodies are pushed to extremes with drug use.

I don't want to see so many people suffering severe life threatening conditions so I try to bring a different view then the oh so common YOLO attitude that is so prevelant with people these days.

 

[ghoya15]

I think my baretts is more genetic in our family then direct AS abuse, but it didnt help much too thats for sure. I used anadrol i think month before these bloodworks up to 200mg/day at one point, but it wasnt longer then 3 weeks on it (not on 200mg) week 1 100mg week 2 150 and then 200 and stop.

AST was 0,98 normal range 0.29-0.72
ALT was 2,20 normal range till 1,09
Bilirubin 9 normal range till 22

Not gonna lie guys i feel like shit, it feels terible to go to the same gym where iam well known as i big guy and now getting small day by day, but it also feels terrible to go to doctors AS 24 years old, to doctor who have to scan and check me for cancer. Yes when i was 18 i was like yeah lets enjoy my fucking life who wants to live more then 50 years, but iam not gonna make it till 30 like this.

 

[needthepump]

I understand your feelings. I use to not attend my gym when I was off cycle. I use to hate how my uniform was loose after I lost "gains". Now it doesn't bother me at all. People don't care if you have big muscles or not. We tend to think others are conserned with us when in reality it's not the case.

You are taking the right path and that is great. Too many people minimize their issues or deny them.

 

[Baxo]

I got this shit man... 2 years ago. I was like you: blasting and cruising since I was 20, and so on... when I was 28 I've discovered the adenoma. Very sad to me, let my body go away, something I had conquered in so many years.

The major problem is the adenoma transform into a hepatic carcinoma. In man, any liver adenoma needs to be taken out, and it was what I did: surgery. They removed my left liver part, no problem to me, I dont drink and am a normal person after the procedure... stayed like a year and a half out of the gym, got skinny like shit, high BF (belly), thought that would be that skinnies guys.

Came back to the game at this year beginning, with no drugs at all, just suplementation. You need to get over this man, it's hard, I know... But high estro levels and our personal genetic is favorable to evolve those adenomas. I catch myself a lot of times thinking about taking some steroids, but I know the risks and my wife and family worries about me, so I don't do it. What I think it's another way to get in a anabolic state, like using peptides like gh frag (wich I haven't tried yet), or myostatin inhibitors... I got now an average body, nothing compared as to I had before. I'm using a lot of suplements, wich helps a little, and low dose GW1516.

I think you need to drop all stuff and don't mess around with steroids anymore, unfortunately. Don't stop working out, even if you get surgery try to come back as soon as you can. Send me a PM so we can discuss this shit... now you need to prepare your mind, and study another anabolic paths with no steroids, you got a partner here.

I'm sorry bro... I know it's our dream to be freak, to be giant and get into the gym and be the alpha. It's very sad, but I choosed not to risk anymore with steroids. In addition I've made a health security of $300.000,00 if I get cancer or some serious shit... I don't know if something is hiding in my liver.

Best regards.

 

[ghoya15]

Thanks alot guys, it really motivates me that iam not the only one who have or had to deal with this. I will most likely hire a experienced coach and focus on fit looking physique. I will give more updates, project small can start )

 

[epoxy]

every time i see a thread about these heptatic adenoma's it scares the shit out of me!

it is a wake up call - i would do the same. as much as i like this game, id rather live a long life as a normal looking guy versus a very short life as a monster