How Many of You Cut During a Cycle?

[Sieve]

I cut/bulk on cycle. Just mantain off...

 

[Deleted member 106824]

I cut/bulk on cycle. Just mantain off...

Seems to be the best way lol. With this cut being over I would normally transition into a slow bulk trying to gain strength while having a slight surplus of calories. However, now that I've started getting into AAS use I fear that anything I put on while off cycle will just be mostly fat. My next cycle won't be until maybe October or so, so I'm hoping that with increased calories (currently averaging about 2300, probably won't be able to bring that too much higher to soon though cause I still need to get off the T3) I can put on some strength between now and then. Not sure how it will work out in practice though.

 

[Gunsmith]

after comps I've always come off completely , changed my training to a heavy high intensity like DC and flood the body with plenty nutrients , after being calorie deprived from competing you're like a dry sponge and soak it all up aka "anabolic rebound"
I use his time to rest my body from chemicals and the damage they do , take a couple months off and if labs are good get back on a low dose.

This year , I don't plan to come off even with a pending elbow surgery I'm gonna run 200mg a week test maybe 200 a week deca for the joint support properties and peptide/GH
the plan is to hold as much muscle as possible and stay leaner , hoping to take a full year off , stay on 200-300mg test and cycle EQ , deca and tren in with it probably slowly increasing the dose keeping tabs on the blood work , cycling insulin in pre training , Planning to be at say 500mg test , 500-600mg EQ at start of prep

16 weeks out 4 iu HGH/ED, 350mg test-E , 350mg tren-E , 350mg mast-E , 350mg EQ
10 weeks out add 100mg to 450mg to each
6 weeks out add 150mg to 600 each , replace EQ with winstrol
3 weeks out drop test and HGH , 600mg tren-E , 1200mg mast-E , 600mg winstrol
7 days out drop tren and mast (last injection) , add in 100mg Proviron/ED , 100mg winstrol/ED , 20mg Halo/ED (all oral)

I think skipping a year competing and getting all joint s healthy I can realy bust ass and add some muscle and hopefully get on stage next year in the 260's

 

[Deleted member 106824]

after comps I've always come off completely , changed my training to a heavy high intensity like DC and flood the body with plenty nutrients , after being calorie deprived from competing you're like a dry sponge and soak it all up aka "anabolic rebound"
I use his time to rest my body from chemicals and the damage they do , take a couple months off and if labs are good get back on a low dose.

This year , I don't plan to come off even with a pending elbow surgery I'm gonna run 200mg a week test maybe 200 a week deca for the joint support properties and peptide/GH
the plan is to hold as much muscle as possible and stay leaner , hoping to take a full year off , stay on 200-300mg test and cycle EQ , deca and tren in with it probably slowly increasing the dose keeping tabs on the blood work , cycling insulin in pre training , Planning to be at say 500mg test , 500-600mg EQ at start of prep

16 weeks out 4 iu HGH/ED, 350mg test-E , 350mg tren-E , 350mg mast-E , 350mg EQ
10 weeks out add 100mg to 450mg to each
6 weeks out add 150mg to 600 each , replace EQ with winstrol
3 weeks out drop test and HGH , 600mg tren-E , 1200mg mast-E , 600mg winstrol
7 days out drop tren and mast (last injection) , add in 100mg Proviron/ED , 100mg winstrol/ED , 20mg Halo/ED (all oral)

I think skipping a year competing and getting all joint s healthy I can realy bust ass and add some muscle and hopefully get on stage next year in the 260's

Wow competing at 260, you must be massive. That plan you outlined definitely seems like it would give great results for a contest prep and considering the compounds I imagine you'd have no water issues close to the contest. I am surprised/impressed that at 260+ and using that high of doses during your prep that you can still make gains in the off season while completely off. I would be very content if I could even add 10-20lb or so to my lifts for reps between now and my next cycle.

In any case, today was a high carb day (500g) and my stomach looks much fatter than when I woke up this morning, which of course would have to be water over such a short time period, so I'm hoping that that's an additional indication that my body's ability to store water is just that much higher on AAS and that it will go down significantly when I come off.

 

[Gunsmith]

well the idea behind the higher doses goin into the prep is that you don't need to restrict the calories as bad , more hormone plus enough food allows you to add muscle and get leaner.

I have a close friend that explained this to me , he is 220-225 , 12-13%BF but competes at 205-210 fuckin peeled the body fat percentage to actual weight loss doesn't add up so a fair bit of weight is replaced with lean mass.

my plan is to be 275ish at the start of my prep hopefully no more than 12% , hoping that I can just use a very clean diet with this listed compounds to drop bodyfat and possible gain some lean mass without having to spend more than 30-40 min a day on cardio.

as far as the weight , Im 6'2" - 6'3" so it's relitive , not that impressive standing next to sombody 5'8" 240

 

[Deleted member 106824]

well the idea behind the higher doses goin into the prep is that you don't need to restrict the calories as bad , more hormone plus enough food allows you to add muscle and get leaner.

I have a close friend that explained this to me , he is 220-225 , 12-13%BF but competes at 205-210 fuckin peeled the body fat percentage to actual weight loss doesn't add up so a fair bit of weight is replaced with lean mass.

my plan is to be 275ish at the start of my prep hopefully no more than 12% , hoping that I can just use a very clean diet with this listed compounds to drop bodyfat and possible gain some lean mass without having to spend more than 30-40 min a day on cardio.

as far as the weight , Im 6'2" - 6'3" so it's relitive , not that impressive standing next to sombody 5'8" 240

In your friends example, the downside is he is not only getting fatter after each contest like most people but also losing muscle (assuming he goes back to around that 220-225 at 12-13% bf), which has to suck to see happen to yourself. I guess in that case the goal would be to compare one off season to the next rather than to the contest so ideally maybe 220 12% one year, 225 12% the next even though its still worse than what you have in contest. I know a few people who are fans of growing into a show though. I believe Dante is a proponent of just test+GH in the off season and bringing out the heavy stuff for contest. I was hoping I could grow during this cut but maybe my expectations were set too high for a 4-500mg Test + superdrol cycle.

And yea height definitely plays a big role, but 260 is still really impressive in my book if someone is legitimately less than 15% or so.

 

[Deleted member 106824]

Hm, this could be nothing but I just realized up until I hit about 200lb this cut I was taking 200mg/20mg of caffeine/ephedrine. I stopped because it was messing with my sleep but with caffeine being a diuretic I wonder if that contributed to me looking better/drier then. Not sure how strong of a diuretic it is though. I guess I could add it back in this week to see, there's just the sleep issue.

 

[aminoman74]

Thats the best time to cut when on a cycle so it helps with anti canabolic

 

[Ehren]

I found that as well. Losing 16lb in 7 weeks is definitely more than I've ever done before and while maintaining strength....it's just that for such a large weight decrease I'm surprised I don't look leaner. I remember thinking at 200lb on the way down that I would be looking pretty damn cut at 190 and I'm usually a good judge of that, although I've never cut on AAS before

Good job on the weight loss.
I cut on a cutting cycle. I don't see the point of stressing the body during a time when it's already trying to recover from a cycle, and hormones aren't in the mix. Then you add starving and more cardio to it, causing more muscle loss. Losing bloat accounts for a leaner look anyway, so if I was lean on cycle, Ill look lean off.

So when I come off, I just continue lifting as usual, but less volume, medium intensity cardio as usual. Only change is lowering the carbs to the point where I don't get fat.

The longer I do this I realize that getting lean and staying lean is my challenge, adding muscle is easier. Just doing it without getting fat is the trick.

 

[TNH]

I don't compete, but I try and cut once a year for summer. Its the closest I get to contest condition. In the ten years I have been doing this, I always used higher doses (cycle/blast doses) for gaining mass and lower doses (what many would call cruising or bridging doses) to cut. I don't blast and cruise full time yet.

My reasoning for lower doses during cutting is that I can't really gain mass while in a deficit, so taking too much of the drugs won't result in any more gains.

I have heard people 'growing into the show' though, and I am currently trying that right now. I'm using drugs that I would normally use for cutting, reducing calories, but for the first time I am using more standard doses (1g total AAS per week). I am only one month in, but so far I am thinking I should save my high doses for gaining mass.... the higher doses I am using now aren't speeding up my fat loss more than normal, and I don't think I am gaining any extra muscle, so I might be wasting it. Time will tell for sure though.

 

[Gunsmith]

In your friends example, the downside is he is not only getting fatter after each contest like most people but also losing muscle (assuming he goes back to around that 220-225 at 12-13% bf), which has to suck to see happen to yourself. I guess in that case the goal would be to compare one off season to the next rather than to the contest so ideally maybe 220 12% one year, 225 12% the next even though its still worse than what you have in contest. I know a few people who are fans of growing into a show though. I believe Dante is a proponent of just test+GH in the off season and bringing out the heavy stuff for contest. I was hoping I could grow during this cut but maybe my expectations were set too high for a 4-500mg Test + superdrol cycle.

And yea height definitely plays a big role, but 260 is still really impressive in my book if someone is legitimately less than 15% or so.

Yea you do gain some fat and the muscle does "shrink back" some due to the lower hormone not bei g their to support the muscle mass but adding some weight the body in for of fat keeps the body in a mechanical advantage , keeps the muscles full and joints lubed allowing you to train with great intensity!

when the hormones are added back the muscle memory kicks in and they pop right back in place.
the trick is to not let this fuck with your head , you will look smaller due to being less defined but as long as you can keep your waist tight and keep abs semi visible you are still as lean or leaner than most of the general population

think about it like Kevin Levrone , he shrunk WAY up off season then rebounded quickly when it was getting time to compete , granted alot of that had to do with his genetics , the theory is the same

 

[Deleted member 106824]

Good job on the weight loss.
I cut on a cutting cycle. I don't see the point of stressing the body during a time when it's already trying to recover from a cycle, and hormones aren't in the mix. Then you add starving and more cardio to it, causing more muscle loss. Losing bloat accounts for a leaner look anyway, so if I was lean on cycle, Ill look lean off.

So when I come off, I just continue lifting as usual, but less volume, medium intensity cardio as usual. Only change is lowering the carbs to the point where I don't get fat.

The longer I do this I realize that getting lean and staying lean is my challenge, adding muscle is easier. Just doing it without getting fat is the trick.

Similar to me. Not that gaining muscle is at all easy for me but gaining weight is very easy and I would imagine if I used a cycle to gain it wouldn't be much of an issue, it's just that I put fat on very easily and then it's hard to maintain my gains when trying to lean out. But yea I don't like the idea of cutting while off either for the reason you mentioned. I did a designer steroid cycle for 4 weeks in december and made solid gains because I was eating enough. an inch on my arms and all lifts went up significantly. With maintenance calories I maintained most of that for 1-2 months then tried to cut and lost all the gains before starting this first "legit" cycle. Which is why I kind of never want to cut off cycle again because it would seem I would just lose it all. Ideally with me coming off a cut with this cycle ending I will be able to maintain all strength/size until my next cycle and maybe even gain some.

Back on the caffeine/ephedrine just for this next week (last week of the cycle) to see if it makes any difference in appearance with water weight.

I don't compete, but I try and cut once a year for summer. Its the closest I get to contest condition. In the ten years I have been doing this, I always used higher doses (cycle/blast doses) for gaining mass and lower doses (what many would call cruising or bridging doses) to cut. I don't blast and cruise full time yet.

My reasoning for lower doses during cutting is that I can't really gain mass while in a deficit, so taking too much of the drugs won't result in any more gains.

I have heard people 'growing into the show' though, and I am currently trying that right now. I'm using drugs that I would normally use for cutting, reducing calories, but for the first time I am using more standard doses (1g total AAS per week). I am only one month in, but so far I am thinking I should save my high doses for gaining mass.... the higher doses I am using now aren't speeding up my fat loss more than normal, and I don't think I am gaining any extra muscle, so I might be wasting it. Time will tell for sure though.

I was thinking something similar. People seem to recommend something like 300mg Test/week when cutting just for maintenance of muscle while cutting. I guess since calories are low the idea is that twice that much still wouldn't cause muscle gain so just use enough to maintain what you have. Calories certainly play a huge part, I made more gains in the 4 weeks I did that designer steroid cycle in december eating 3500 calories than the first 4 weeks of this test + designer steroid cycle because I was eating more like 2200 calories. That first 4 weeks came to about 750mg total but even so I didn't gain much, although maybe I would have lost more with a lower dose. I imagine so since I started losing size/strength at week 6, when I was just on the test.

I would assume your strength gains with the added calories on AAS are much greater than with reduced calories on AAS? Basically I'm hoping that my lack of gains during this cutting cycle isn't an indication that I won't gain much when I actually have a surplus with the AAS.

Yea you do gain some fat and the muscle does "shrink back" some due to the lower hormone not bei g their to support the muscle mass but adding some weight the body in for of fat keeps the body in a mechanical advantage , keeps the muscles full and joints lubed allowing you to train with great intensity!

when the hormones are added back the muscle memory kicks in and they pop right back in place.
the trick is to not let this fuck with your head , you will look smaller due to being less defined but as long as you can keep your waist tight and keep abs semi visible you are still as lean or leaner than most of the general population

think about it like Kevin Levrone , he shrunk WAY up off season then rebounded quickly when it was getting time to compete , granted alot of that had to do with his genetics , the theory is the same

Yea it definitely would fuck with my head. Even though I have about as much muscle now as I did a few weeks ago (going by arm measurements and strength) I looked fat and small last night and even this morning with the water weight killing my definition but before when I was 'drier' I looked bigger because I didn't have this layer of water blurring everything. It's probably not as bad if you are really lean like 10% or less year round. It's hard to tell because how I look fluctuates a lot, even more on cycle, but I would guess even now at the end of my cut I don't look much leaner than 12%.

 

[Gunsmith]

next cycle use non aromatizing compounds say test , mast and tren with a little Nolva to help with test bloat.
then do an honest to goodness pre contest diet even just 6-8 weeks worth , shoot for getting the leanest you have been and see exactly what you have , I think you'll be amazed how much bigger you look but lighter you weight

 

[Deleted member 106824]

next cycle use non aromatizing compounds say test , mast and tren with a little Nolva to help with test bloat.
then do an honest to goodness pre contest diet even just 6-8 weeks worth , shoot for getting the leanest you have been and see exactly what you have , I think you'll be amazed how much bigger you look but lighter you weight

You said non aromatizing compounds, so I assume you mean low dose test? I feel like at 21 I should hold off on tren for now. I was planning on sticking to the basics like test + maybe some dbol for now, of course both of those aromatize. Some have mentioned equipose but I believe that aromtizes as well and would entail longer cycle length which I'm trying to avoid (looking to do 2-8 weeks in general with a total of being on for about 16 weeks per year).

So nolva helps with the bloat even though it doesn't reduce estrogen like an AI would? Hopefully that means this water bloat will come off within a week or so of PCT. I was talking to a friend who was on 100mg of test which brought him up to a total test of 900 and E was around 30 and he said he dropped 1.5-2lb of water in a few days after going off. Considering My T and E of 2287 and 55 I would hope that means 4-5lb of water. We we're both previously fat kids so I would think maybe we hold water similarly.

 

[Gunsmith]

Mast will help with some of the test aromatizing and the nolvadex will help with the rest unless you are realy cranking the dose up.

nolvadex reduces estrogen related bloat by binding the the estrogen receptor not allowing it to work , Arimidex , letro , Aromasin all totally stop estrogen conversion , granted the old school Nolva might not be a perfetly effective as A-Dex but it's also WAY less hard on the liver and has actualy proven to help raise HDL !!

your right in holding off o tren till later and yes EQ is a great choice as a replacement , it's not the wonder drug tren can be but is effective none the less

 

[Deleted member 106824]

Mast will help with some of the test aromatizing and the nolvadex will help with the rest unless you are realy cranking the dose up.

nolvadex reduces estrogen related bloat by binding the the estrogen receptor not allowing it to work , Arimidex , letro , Aromasin all totally stop estrogen conversion , granted the old school Nolva might not be a perfetly effective as A-Dex but it's also WAY less hard on the liver and has actualy proven to help raise HDL !!

your right in holding off o tren till later and yes EQ is a great choice as a replacement , it's not the wonder drug tren can be but is effective none the less

OK from my understanding nolvadex acts like an estrogen agonist in some places and antagonist in others, so I guess that means it acts as an antagonist with bloat issues. I was using arimidex from ManPower at 0.5mg EOD and E was 58 then changed to his letro at 2.5mg/day and E was 53 so I think the letro is way underdosed or something. Currently back on his adex but at 0.5mg every day instead of every other day. It was my understanding that AI's hurt lipid values and that nolva actually improved lipid values as you mentioned, but I thought nolva was hard on the liver.

If I used EQ it's almost always for 10+ weeks right? I was planning on trying a few 2on/4off cycles and in general not going much past 6-8 weeks ever in the future, meaning I'd have to stick to faster acting compounds. For example I was considering my first 2 weeker in october/november to be 500mg prop + 25mg dbol/day or something like that. Hellooo water bloat lol.

 

[F0cus]

That's how I do it sluggy... I'm in hrt for life so works well for me

 

[thehazzle]

If you stay lean off season you won't have to diet as Hard to compete. IMO I'm never gonna grow past previous size limits on low dose.
Blast to grow but stay lean. Come pre contest time low dose test n tren n HGH should do enough to maintain mass.

 

[beastmode121]

If you stay lean off season you won't have to diet as Hard to compete. IMO I'm never gonna grow past previous size limits on low dose.
Blast to grow but stay lean. Come pre contest time low dose test n tren n HGH should do enough to maintain mass.

How are you gonna stay lean and grow? I never understood that concept


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[sammy555]

How are you gonna stay lean and grow? I never understood that concept


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Eat clean. Eat just enough to gain a few lb a month. Keep test and gh high. Well timed insulin. Do a little fasted cardio. Gain slowly basically. You'll maintain much better insulin sensitivity this way. With enough gear you can grow muscle in a deficit. Others like to use food as there Anabolic, get a bit chubby and ramp every thing up pre contest. I've seen both ways work. I prefer staying lean as I hate dieting

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