How/why insulin would benefit those who already produce it?

[Biggerp73]

I'm wondering how exogenous insulin would benefit the person who already produces it on their own. With exogenous test and GH, we are putting in much more than our body naturally produces. But from what I understand, that really isn't the case with exogenous insulin. The human body naturally releases 30-50iu on its own. Most bodybuilders report gains with as little as 10-15iu per day. Now from what I understand the body reduces it's own insulin release in response to exogenous insulin, so it doesn't seem to be the case that taking exogenous insulin combines with natural insulin to result in significantly more insulin than otherwise would be. Or maybe I'm wrong. And on the flip side, it seems one could just eat the same amount of carbs and the body would release a similar amount of it's own insulin to shuttle those nutrients.

 

[Fluffy_XL]

You are not wrong. Of course taking exogenous insulin won't result in significantly more insulin even though your body will ALWAYS produce a certain amount of insulin after taking up nutrients ...always but of course not too much if blood glucose decreases rapidly after an exogenous insulin shot.

Also your afaik pretty much correct if stating that GH alone would to the job if you pound carbs around training. There have been quite some good BBs in the past who did it that way.
Problem is that this is exactly the same as if you just sit around binging sweets ...your over and over stress your pancreas pretty badly and THAT is what causes diabetes type 2 ...the exogenous GH aggravates that.

So basically you need exogenous insulin and/or a pretty good blood glucose management with metformin and all those those glucose managing supplements.
Best way is probably GH + insulin + metformin on a regular at bedtime to keep insulin sensivity in check to some degree.

 

[need4tren]

It’s just to absorb food better. If your eating 1000g of carbs a day there is no way the body is gonna be able to produce enough insulin to take all those carbs in. Body only produces so much insulin. Everyone’s different so can’t put an iu number on it. But Ull even notice a difference taking 4-5 iu with a meal.

 

[maldorf]

I noticed a big differenence in how full I was and would get a nice pump after injection. I would do it post workout and then have a snack afterwards. I felt like it sped up my recovery from hard workouts too. Not very scientific, but empirically that is what I have to offer.

 

[Biggerp73]

Great responses so far guys, thanks. I don't doubt it *is* beneficial, as so many report good gains from it, and I don't think its simply a matter of placebo either. I am just wondering about the mechanisms since it doesnt make much sense to me, since it seems the body will release similar levels of insulin on its own in response to similar amounts of carbs already.

 

[danieltx]

Great responses so far guys, thanks. I don't doubt it *is* beneficial, as so many report good gains from it, and I don't think its simply a matter of placebo either. I am just wondering about the mechanisms since it doesnt make much sense to me, since it seems the body will release similar levels of insulin on its own in response to similar amounts of carbs already.

The issue is more that the pancreas can't keep consistently producing enough insulin to cover blood sugar.

For a typical bodybuilder in a growing phase using a good amount of GH and consuming a lot of carbs every single day, exogenous insulin is needed to keep blood sugar down and let you fully utilize the nutrients. Yeah your pancreas will make some, but it often won't be enough when you're doing things that elevate blood sugar consistently over the long-term.

Dave Palumbo has many videos discussing insulin from a variety of angles on the RX Muscle YouTube channel - https://www.youtube.com/user/rxmuscle/search?query=insulin

 

[need4tren]

Fouad was talking to luke sandow about insulin and I agree with them. It’s not a muscle builder but it is a temporary cosmetic effect with retaining more glycogen then one can hold. It can help build muscle as it’s helps recovery ect. But won’t build muscle like testosterone does

 

[Knight9]

Exogneous insulin will store nutrients far more efficiently (especially an abundance of them) by shoving them into the cells if they are present and timed correctly. This isn't rocket science and your body is not going to be able to just produce as much insulin as you ever need. Insulin also helps GH work better and covers for lost sensitivity while taking a load off the pancreas.
As said, metformin or even berberine can be used to correct the sensitivity.

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[Knight9]

Fouad was talking to luke sandow about insulin and I agree with them. It’s not a muscle builder but it is a temporary cosmetic effect with retaining more glycogen then one can hold. It can help build muscle as it’s helps recovery ect. But won’t build muscle like testosterone does

Fouad and Luke think the most anabolic compound available doesnt build muscle? Sounds like those guys think they are much smarter than they truly are.

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[brutus69]

Fouad and Luke think the most anabolic compound available doesnt build muscle? Sounds like those guys think they are much smarter than they truly are.

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cool. so no one needs steroids when all u need to do is insulin cycles. to build all that muscle mass. since its the most anabolic compound.

 

[johnjuanb1]

Fouad was talking to luke sandow about insulin and I agree with them. It’s not a muscle builder but it is a temporary cosmetic effect with retaining more glycogen then one can hold. It can help build muscle as it’s helps recovery ect. But won’t build muscle like testosterone does

This is what I found personally.
In 1995 I would do high doses of humalin-R and humalin-N. It was the original Milos stack but a higher dose. I did 20 units R with 20 units N upon waking, and 40 units R preworkout.
Insulin used this way made me gain 15Lbs lean super fast, forearms got huge and vascular, it was the instant illusion of muscle all over.
Negatives: bad heart palpitations and pounding. I passed out a couple times.
At this age insulin would be just asking for a heart attack.

DISCLAIMER: DO NOT try this protocol. Even Ronnie Coleman stuck with 60ius total: 20, 20, 20, according to Milos looking in his contest bag. I was young and stupid, stupid, stupid.

 

[b-boy]

Fouad was talking to luke sandow about insulin and I agree with them. It’s not a muscle builder but it is a temporary cosmetic effect with retaining more glycogen then one can hold. It can help build muscle as it’s helps recovery ect. But won’t build muscle like testosterone does

I also agree with this, it's one of the reasons why I don't use it.

 

[Fit2Serve]

How/why testosterone would benefit those who already produce it?

^same question, same answer really... cuz there is more.... so it can do more of what it does
-F2S

 

[Beti ona]

It’s just to absorb food better. If your eating 1000g of carbs a day there is no way the body is gonna be able to produce enough insulin to take all those carbs in. Body only produces so much insulin. Everyone’s different so can’t put an iu number on it. But Ull even notice a difference taking 4-5 iu with a meal.

But why absorbing more carbs means more muscle? Shouldn't you be gaining the same amount of fat?

 

[Biggerp73]

^same question, same answer really... cuz there is more.... so it can do more of what it does
-F2S

I addressed that in the OP. It doesn't seem that exogenous insulin in healthy individuals results in supraphysiological levels.

 

[tren_plz]

cool. so no one needs steroids when all u need to do is insulin cycles. to build all that muscle mass. since its the most anabolic compound.

What Knight said is a fact and you turn around with a strawman fallacy.

A lot of ppl look at insulin in a vacuum and think one size fits all. I personally think there are a ton of different ways to utilize it. This is the one compoudn where i dont think more is better unless you're genetically gifted/dont put on BF.

4-5 IU pre and post workout goes a long way.

 

[Freedom15Muscle]

But why absorbing more carbs means more muscle? Shouldn't you be gaining the same amount of fat?

I think it had more to do with the condition of your current blood sugar levels and your bodies insulin sensitivities. I use it on chest days with high carbs for growth, but I follow a low carb principle with berberine the rest of the week.

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[Fit2Serve]

I addressed that in the OP. It doesn't seem that exogenous insulin in healthy individuals results in supraphysiological levels.

have u ever used insulin?
i can vouch it is definitely doing something lol

if u take too much insulin u go hypo. ur body doesnt do that. so.... its stonger than what your body can produce.
-F2S

 

[Biggerp73]

have u ever used insulin?
i can vouch it is definitely doing something lol

if u take too much insulin u go hypo. ur body doesnt do that. so.... its stonger than what your body can produce.
-F2S

As I said, I don't doubt insulin works. I know how many guys report good gains from it. But it doesn't seem to cause supraphysiological levels of insulin significantly beyond what the healthy body already produces. And the reason why natural insulin doesn't cause you to go Hypo isnt because it's less potent but because the body releases it in proportion to blood sugar, whereas exogenous insulin is not tied to blood sugar and therefore can be elevated when blood sugar is not.

 

[Biggerp73]

As for whether ive tried it, I did experiment a little bit about a decade ago, and noticed more fullness with lanrus but didn't really experience any significant muscle gains either way (though I wasn't using GH and didn't experiment for too long anyways)