I have a question to ask

[maldorf]

Steroids build muscle, the more you take the bigger you get, as far as how big and what you end up looking like is an individual thing. It makes no sense to compare any two people especially two that are at different ends of the spectrum when it comes to genetics.

the problem is that your genetics are going to hold you back when you reach a certain level of developement. Everyone has a ceiling they reach, and no matter how high a dose of drugs you take you arent going to grow anymore. Like some of the other posters on this thread said, how many guys on this board along are taking weekly doses between 2-4g/week? Are these guys huge and highly competitive? You reach a point where nothing is going to make you grow more.

 

[maldorf]

For me? NO but I believe everyone should make their own decisions hopefully based on enough knowledge to make an informed one.

The problem is that many of us make the wrong decisions. We have a guy on here now that is walking around with a hematocrit in the 60s. Another guy has one that is 58. Two of us have had blood clots, and one of us died and the other had a heart attack. Three or more of us have been diagnosed with cardiomyopathy and an ejection fraction in the 30s or lower.

Many times a bodybuilder's strong desire to grow gets in the way of rational thinking. Its a very hard thing to admit that youre never going to be as huge and muscular as you want, and never going to be able to compete at a decent level. It is very hard to let go of your dream. Sometimes it take the threat of death to make you do it.

 

[Magnum]

the problem is that your genetics are going to hold you back when you reach a certain level of developement. Everyone has a ceiling they reach, and no matter how high a dose of drugs you take you arent going to grow anymore. Like some of the other posters on this thread said, how many guys on this board along are taking weekly doses between 2-4g/week? Are these guys huge and highly competitive? You reach a point where nothing is going to make you grow more.

Genetics hold EVERYONE back. All of us will stop growing sooner or later. Like I said, our own genetics will determine how we all will look like at the end stage of development. This is no different for me, you or Ronnie Coleman. Just because someone posts on this board and takes 2 to 4 grams weekly doesn't mean they have any more chance to be pro than someone who doesn't post on here. In fact, most genetically gifted up and comers do not post on here. You are right about one thing, we all stop growing eventually.

 

[Magnum]

The problem is that many of us make the wrong decisions. We have a guy on here now that is walking around with a hematocrit in the 60s. Another guy has one that is 58. Two of us have had blood clots, and one of us died and the other had a heart attack. Three or more of us have been diagnosed with cardiomyopathy and an ejection fraction in the 30s or lower.

Many times a bodybuilder's strong desire to grow gets in the way of rational thinking. Its a very hard thing to admit that youre never going to be as huge and muscular as you want, and never going to be able to compete at a decent level. It is very hard to let go of your dream. Sometimes it take the threat of death to make you do it.

This is true, but you can't save the world. How many guys on here are just taking steroids and no trenbolone? The majority also take large amounts of all or some of T3, ECA stack, Clen, GH, Insulin, AE, BP meds, Cholesterol meds, Viagra etc. Most guys on here are a walking fukin pharmacy and when something goes wrong they all scream steroids as the culprit. Half the guys on here have no clue as to what they are taking and the damage that they are causing to their body. Stupidity at it's worst.

 

[maldorf]

Genetics hold EVERYONE back. All of us will stop growing sooner or later. Like I said, out own genetics will determine how we all will look like at the end stage of development. This is no different for me, you or Ronnie Coleman. Just because someone posts on this board and takes 2 to 4 grams weekly doesn't mean they have any more chance to be pro than someone who doesn't post on here. In fact, most genetically gifted up and comers do not post on here. You are right about one thing, we all stop growing eventually.

Yep, and the trouble comes about when people try to force their bodies to grow beyond that point by taking more and more drugs. THey fail to realize that they are not going to grow much more at all and that all they are doing is endangering their health and their life. If I dont grow on 2grams, then maybe ill grow on 3grams. Oh no, I didnt get much off 3grams so next years Ill be doing 4 grams. Years after playing with all of these hormones and hitting it hard in the gym/eating right and youve put on all of maybe 5-10 lbs of muscle. Well, ill keep doing this and maybe after another 5 years ill be huge! NOT!

 

[Magnum]

Yep, and the trouble comes about when people try to force their bodies to grow beyond that point by taking more and more drugs. THey fail to realize that they are not going to grow much more at all and that all they are doing is endangering their health and their life. If I dont grow on 2grams, then maybe ill grow on 3grams. Oh no, I didnt get much off 3grams so next years Ill be doing 4 grams. Years after playing with all of these hormones and hitting it hard in the gym/eating right and youve put on all of maybe 5-10 lbs of muscle. Well, ill keep doing this and maybe after another 5 years ill be huge! NOT!

Yeah and I also think that most guys jump on high does way too soon when they could be growing on much smaller doses. I mean so many newbies I see with not much size at all want to try tren and slin and GH and IGF and so on. Take 3 basic steroids and that person can put on a major amount of size over the course of 3 to 4 years.

 

[Charlie Wax]

did you become a pro? or did you at least win a national show?

Answer: No, my intentions where not to become a "pro" bodybuilder. No, i never "won" a show because i never intended to compete in a bodybuilding event.
The reasons i took what i took, and did what i did had to do with a specific professional sport, not a hobby (some call bodybuilding a sport) motivated by over inflated egos. The sport i became a member of ended up getting me into a paticular entertainment industry that thrives on very large, jacked up steroid induced "superstars". This industry turned out to be just as much of a "who you know and who you blow" career as "pro" bodybuilding is so i chose a different lifestyle, and career because i have NO desire to kiss ass or blow someone to get ahead in life just for a shot at being rich and famous.
No, im not a millionaire, and im not famous as i once (maybe) could have been but im very happy with my life and career and im still just as jacked, anabolically induced as i have been for many years now. I do what i do now because its just become a part of life to me. Some people diet, take huge amounts of drugs, train hard just for the hopes of winning a useless trophy and call it bodybuilding. I do the very same thing and i call it a hobby.
Most people who are "inspired" to be the next Cutler, or Coleman have NO CLUE how many OTHER people there are out there wanting the exact same thing while looking 10 times better then the next guy yet never end up making a penny from bodybuilding. Sure, there are a lucky FEW who make money "bodybuilding" but statistically given the number of wanna bes vs the number of "pros" that make a quality amount of money you would have way better odds just saving all the money you spend in your life pumping drugs into your body and buying the weekly powerball lottery. Odds are you would win the lottery before you would end up making millions at pro bodybuilding.
Hey, im not knocking BBing, if its your thing, and you like going through pure hell just to win a trophy with your name on it then i wish you all the best.
I would rather do it for personal accomplishment goals and enjoyment rather then give a shit what paid off judges say about what i have accomplished.

 

[dr intensity]

I cannot answer that....its all individualistic.

a) Ive seen white guys juice to the high hilt for years that end up looking like stocky fat guys and noone would even give a second thought that they lifted. Most people dont know about those guys....(why? because again...they dont look like they lift so noone discusses them)...people only discuss the monstrous guys who they cant understand why they are so big. They never discuss the guys smaller and suckier than them who are doing alot of juice....because those guys dont offend their ego.

b) I saw 2 roomates split a couple bottles of Winny tabs back in the day. They had no access to anything else so i know thats all they were doing....the area at the time was very dried up. They were about the same height (5' 10ish).....one roomate had an older brother who had incredible genetics and he obviously ended up with the same kind of genetics........
He gained about 25 lbs of lean muscle mass...it was ridiculous...he got bigger by the day.....the other roomate gained about 2-3 lbs....and he was so pissed off.. that he thought the other roomate was taking more (sounds just like every single guy in modern day bodybuilding)...but he wasnt...they ended up with the same amount of tabs.... such was the genetic response to anabolics and also the one roomate had elite bodybuilding genetics.

c) Some guys have pretty good response to drugs and then eat and train like crap and get nowhere.

d) Guys like Ron Harris state straight out that they didnt have a big response to drugs, nothing magical happened....Ive seen that before many times with some guys you would think were mesomorphic and then ive seen other mesomorphic guys explode.

e) But you just cant take someone like DJ Qualls the actor (look him up) and put him on an elite lifting training and drug program and make him into a pro bodybuilder...its not in the genetic cards...You might eventually get him up to 210 (maybe 220 after many years) but is he going to walk into a room and people think "wow that guy is huge!".....no.

f) I think I am pretty good at what i can do with someone. You can say Im downright cocky about it. I truly believe I can make anyone big and i have to be like that to make it happen. And I would love to coat my ego and say I could make anyone I trained gigantic! Thats a lie because I can only do what someones genetics allow them to do.

g) Here are 2 guys 6'6" each

Noah Steere with the 24 inch plus arms

and

Brent Barry with about LOL 12 inch arms

Do you really think I could ever with any amount, any drug, any compound, any nutrition, any training, make Brent Barry's arms into the size of Noah Steeres arms? Not a damn chance in hell. You got to give me a pretty good size peice of clay to work with, not a 1/2 inch by 1 inch string of play doh.

h) If after 2 years of hardcore lifting (assuming your past the teenage formulative years) you got a pretty good build and have built up enough muscle mass that people are commenting on you "being a bodybuilder".....take it to the bank that you probably will eventually become a damn big and worthy bodybuilder if you get your training, nutrition and everything else dialed in right.......................if after 2 years of hardcore lifting, nobody is ever commenting on "you being a bodybuilder" outside of your mom....take it to the bank that you probably wont be the guy people are saying "IFBB pro card is going to be yours bro" anytime soon.

i) I find it kind of funny that nobody ever comments on their friends that did large cycles that look like shit....because there are alot of guys out there like that....but again those guys dont screw up anyones ego so it doesnt matter or get talked about.

thanks alot dante,

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

Answer: No, my intentions where not to become a "pro" bodybuilder. No, i never "won" a show because i never intended to compete in a bodybuilding event.
The reasons i took what i took, and did what i did had to do with a specific professional sport, not a hobby (some call bodybuilding a sport) motivated by over inflated egos. The sport i became a member of ended up getting me into a paticular entertainment industry that thrives on very large, jacked up steroid induced "superstars". This industry turned out to be just as much of a "who you know and who you blow" career as "pro" bodybuilding is so i chose a different lifestyle, and career because i have NO desire to kiss ass or blow someone to get ahead in life just for a shot at being rich and famous.

Excuse my intrusion.....I consider myself a pretty wellrounded, intelligent person and pride myself on being a man of eclectric interests who studies many different subjects......you cant just throw out a riddle like that and not have me take a guess at it.

1)First underline - pro football as obviously there would be no need to be so large for other sports unless rugby is recruiting pro wrestlers (see #2)

2)Second underline - obviously pro wrestling

3)Now i have to put the timelines together and did a little bit of research......(about 3 minutes worth because im a pretty good searcher)...did a search of former pro football players who became wrestlers and then tried to match up the timeline (12 years or so)

Alex Trebeck Im going to say "Who is Monty Brown" for my answer for 500 dollars please.

How did i do? And no Ive never heard of Monty Brown before this post.....im going on intuition and searching ability......but I got to admit when I came up with the name Monty Brown during searching and then entered that in Wikipedia to see if I might have it......seeing that bodyweight of 265 made me whisper to myself "case closed" as thats the same exact bodyweight you mentioned in your earlier post.

The only thing that is throwing me off a little bit is a black guy would usually not use "Joe Dirt" as a reference to his build back in the day-human nature wise....but never say never.....I think I got this one though.

Ill take "Trombones and Trenbolones next for 1000 Alex"

 

[b-boy]

Excuse my intrusion.....I consider myself a pretty wellrounded, intelligent person and pride myself on being a man of eclectric interests who studies many different subjects......you cant just throw out a riddle like that and not have me take a guess at it.

1)First underline - pro football as obviously there would be no need to be so large for other sports unless rugby is recruiting pro wrestlers (see #2)

2)Second underline - obviously pro wrestling

3)Now i have to put the timelines together and did a little bit of research......(about 3 minutes worth because im a pretty good searcher)...did a search of former pro football players who became wrestlers and then tried to match up the timeline (12 years or so)

Alex Trebeck Im going to say "Who is Monty Brown" for my answer for 500 dollars please.

How did i do? And no Ive never heard of Monty Brown before this post.....im going on intuition and searching ability......but I got to admit when I came up with the name Monty Brown during searching and then entered that in Wikipedia to see if I might have it......seeing that bodyweight of 265 made me whisper to myself "case closed" as thats the same exact bodyweight you mentioned in your earlier post.

The only thing that is throwing me off a little bit is a black guy would usually not use "Joe Dirt" as a reference to his build back in the day-human nature wise....but never say never.....I think I got this one though.

Ill take "Trombones and Trenbolones next for 1000 Alex"

OMG! i almost spit crystal light all over my computer screen when i busted out laughing at your post, O shit your funny dante, good one bro!!!!

I'll take "Trombones and Trenbolones next for 1000 Alex" ...... LMAO

 

[619muscle]

Excuse my intrusion.....I consider myself a pretty wellrounded, intelligent person and pride myself on being a man of eclectric interests who studies many different subjects......you cant just throw out a riddle like that and not have me take a guess at it.

1)First underline - pro football as obviously there would be no need to be so large for other sports unless rugby is recruiting pro wrestlers (see #2)

2)Second underline - obviously pro wrestling

3)Now i have to put the timelines together and did a little bit of research......(about 3 minutes worth because im a pretty good searcher)...did a search of former pro football players who became wrestlers and then tried to match up the timeline (12 years or so)

Alex Trebeck Im going to say "Who is Monty Brown" for my answer for 500 dollars please.

How did i do? And no Ive never heard of Monty Brown before this post.....im going on intuition and searching ability......but I got to admit when I came up with the name Monty Brown during searching and then entered that in Wikipedia to see if I might have it......seeing that bodyweight of 265 made me whisper to myself "case closed" as thats the same exact bodyweight you mentioned in your earlier post.

The only thing that is throwing me off a little bit is a black guy would usually not use "Joe Dirt" as a reference to his build back in the day-human nature wise....but never say never.....I think I got this one though.

Ill take "Trombones and Trenbolones next for 1000 Alex"

absolute gold myfriend...priceless!

I needed a laugh this morning. thanks boss!

 

[maldorf]

This is true, but you can't save the world. How many guys on here are just taking steroids and no trenbolone? The majority also take large amounts of all or some of T3, ECA stack, Clen, GH, Insulin, AE, BP meds, Cholesterol meds, Viagra etc. Most guys on here are a walking fukin pharmacy and when something goes wrong they all scream steroids as the culprit. Half the guys on here have no clue as to what they are taking and the damage that they are causing to their body. Stupidity at it's worst.

Yep, all true statements. Anytime you start self medicaing yourself you open up pandora's box. So many drugs all at once, you cant tell whats doing what.

 

[maldorf]

Yeah and I also think that most guys jump on high does way too soon when they could be growing on much smaller doses. I mean so many newbies I see with not much size at all want to try tren and slin and GH and IGF and so on. Take 3 basic steroids and that person can put on a major amount of size over the course of 3 to 4 years.

Yes, I agree here too. Its crazy what new guys want to jump on. Me personally though, I started off light and worked my way up over about 9-10 years. By the end I was using high doses, but that last year I actually cut my total dose down to about 1/3 what it had been with the advice of Phil. Phil helped me to gain my sanity . He knew what I was doing to myself was no good. Problem is, I still had the blood clot.

 

[mexbeast]

charlie wax

i hope i did not insult you bro, question, would you lick a good looking pu#%& to get ahead? just yoking. i think wee should not argue with all this guys who have been in the trenches and know the ins in the sport, my name is not known but i have been in the inside and know that there's countless guys taking grams a week; yet no one would even look at then and ask do you lift weights? but at the same time there's many others who never touch a weight; yet have a great built.

 

[Charlie Wax]

i hope i did not insult you bro, question, would you lick a good looking pu#%& to get ahead? just yoking. i think wee should not argue with all this guys who have been in the trenches and know the ins in the sport, my name is not known but i have been in the inside and know that there's countless guys taking grams a week; yet no one would even look at then and ask do you lift weights? but at the same time there's many others who never touch a weight; yet have a great built.

No no my friend, you havent insulted me at all bro.
I agree genetics can make a difference in bodybuilding ect, yet i know first hand that genetics alone is not what it takes to get where these pros are.
They can have the best genetics on earth but the human body will onl grow so much. Not one of the guys in the olympia or any other highly popular bodybuilding show is on that stage just because they have genetics.
There is one thing that every single one have in common - large, huge, massive amounts of drugs. Not the cycles the local big gym at the gym takes, im talking dosages that make the people on this board look like sissy girls.
I have no argument with anyone because i have walked the walk. I know what anabolics did to me. I know the more i took the more i turned into a FREAK and by freak i mean magazine material but that has never been my "thing". My freakiness was just a side effect of doing what i needed to get where i wanted in a career i was setting my self up to do.
It doesnt matter what you post, someone will always be here to argue to your opinion. Thats just how it goes.

 

[cpesloco]

This has been a very good discussion and kept civil all while being entertaining and educational.
Thanks to all who contributed!

 

[oldfella]

I find it very interesting....these "TRUTH" threads. The funny part about them is the guys asking the questions about how much, how long, how big, yada, yada................once the "TRUTH" is told they can't or won't just accept that the truth has many meanings in this dungeon we call Body Building. One man's truth is not the same as anothers. BB #1 might take only 6 grams a week and still not get as big as BB#2 who only uses 1gram. Average Joe might grow like a weed on 750mg/wk while Not so average Joe will not gain on 3 grams. See where all of this leads.

I do also want to acknowledge some of the greats on here like Dante, Phil, and Big A for putting some of this out there. But the real truth is "unless you know personally or are that person you will probably never really know how much Jay Cutler or Ronnie Coleman actually does" it is not because it is a secret, but because it is none of our business. That is the plain truth the way I see it. I also would like to thank Charliewax for his insight as well. Very interesting read and refreshing to see a meaningful debate without all the bickering among men here. Good thread actually.

 

[Charlie Wax]

I find it very interesting....these "TRUTH" threads. The funny part about them is the guys asking the questions about how much, how long, how big, yada, yada................once the "TRUTH" is told they can't or won't just accept that the truth has many meanings in this dungeon we call Body Building. One man's truth is not the same as anothers. BB #1 might take only 6 grams a week and still not get as big as BB#2 who only uses 1gram. Average Joe might grow like a weed on 750mg/wk while Not so average Joe will not gain on 3 grams. See where all of this leads.

I do also want to acknowledge some of the greats on here like Dante, Phil, and Big A for putting some of this out there. But the real truth is "unless you know personally or are that person you will probably never really know how much Jay Cutler or Ronnie Coleman actually does" it is not because it is a secret, but because it is none of our business. That is the plain truth the way I see it. I also would like to thank Charliewax for his insight as well. Very interesting read and refreshing to see a meaningful debate without all the bickering among men here. Good thread actually.

Thanks my friend.
No intentions from me as far as arguing or bickering. That leads to nothing.
I agree with your comment and as with most here i can only tell of my personal experience and those of my close friends who walked the road i walked.
Im in no way downing bodybuilders, but you have to admit it is a sport filled with very over inflated egos, but mostly from the younger BBers. The older you get the less the ego shows. Like i said i get thrown into the bodybuilder stereotype because of my size and frame. Personally i would never jump on stage with a bunch of half naked dudes.... i never had the desire to compete yet to see me u would think thats my entire lifestyle.
The attention was nice when i was younger but then it got old everywhere you go you get stared at and talked about. Oh well, thats just life.
Anyway its nice for someone like you to make the remark you did about the bickering ect...we all have our opinions, i have learned to respect each persons opinion the same as i would like mine respected. You seem like a nice guy.

 

[oldfella]

Thanks my friend.
No intentions from me as far as arguing or bickering. That leads to nothing.
I agree with your comment and as with most here i can only tell of my personal experience and those of my close friends who walked the road i walked.
Im in no way downing bodybuilders, but you have to admit it is a sport filled with very over inflated egos, but mostly from the younger BBers. The older you get the less the ego shows. Like i said i get thrown into the bodybuilder stereotype because of my size and frame. Personally i would never jump on stage with a bunch of half naked dudes.... i never had the desire to compete yet to see me u would think thats my entire lifestyle.
The attention was nice when i was younger but then it got old everywhere you go you get stared at and talked about. Oh well, thats just life.
Anyway its nice for someone like you to make the remark you did about the bickering ect...we all have our opinions, i have learned to respect each persons opinion the same as i would like mine respected. You seem like a nice guy.

No probs charlie........I am one of those half naked dudes you would need to stand next to on stage... LOL! Or I should say was. I too have been around the block more than once and you are correct about over inflated egos. If only some of the young and wrestless here would heed good advice and sit back and think before they leap it might save a few lives and a truck load of disappointments. I am old school and never had the inflated ego.....mainly because there were too many bigger egos standing next to me. I have always been very humble yet proud of my accomplishments. I have nothing to prove to anyone except myself. I never wanted to be like anyone else. I just wanted to stand up and do the best I could. I was just not prepared to take the risk of running insane doses to get bigger. My choice!! Hope you stick around here bro, you sound like a sensible guy and can contribute plenty. Cheers!

 

[mexbeast]

I find it very interesting....these "TRUTH" threads. The funny part about them is the guys asking the questions about how much, how long, how big, yada, yada................once the "TRUTH" is told they can't or won't just accept that the truth has many meanings in this dungeon we call Body Building. One man's truth is not the same as anothers. BB #1 might take only 6 grams a week and still not get as big as BB#2 who only uses 1gram. Average Joe might grow like a weed on 750mg/wk while Not so average Joe will not gain on 3 grams. See where all of this leads.

I do also want to acknowledge some of the greats on here like Dante, Phil, and Big A for putting some of this out there. But the real truth is "unless you know personally or are that person you will probably never really know how much Jay Cutler or Ronnie Coleman actually does" it is not because it is a secret, but because it is none of our business. That is the plain truth the way I see it. I also would like to thank Charliewax for his insight as well. Very interesting read and refreshing to see a meaningful debate without all the bickering among men here. Good thread actually.

amen to that!!!