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Insulin - New Mike Arnold protocol. 5x per week indefinitely

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Finally. Thank you. I wondered how long it would take for your negativity to tire. For a minute there I was starting to think you had a never-ending supply.

It could continue, if you so like.

I enjoy proving dumbasses like yourself wrong. Especially you. Man with no face and a fictitious name.

As a matter of fact, I'll follow along awaiting in the shadows.
 
It could continue, if you so like.

I enjoy proving dumbasses like yourself wrong. Especially you. Man with no face and a fictitious name.

As a matter of fact, I'll follow along awaiting in the shadows.

That would great, except for the fact you failed to do so. I could understand if I was the only person who preferred berberine over metformin, but it's just not the case.

Now, with compelling evidence that metformin provides additional anti-bodybuilding side effects that berberine has not been proven to have, it is just crazy to me that you completely dismiss it.
 
You apparently didn't read the whole thread because I never said he "disrespected" Dante (that was Stewie putting words in my mouth, again), nor was that even the point. The point was that Stewie has a habit of jumping into my threads and correcting errors and/or providing information I "neglected" to give. Like I said, this normally wouldn't matter,but Stewie does that a lot, especially to me, and it is never accompanied by any previous positive comments. When someone only offers up criticism, after a while you start to wonder why. So, when I saw him jump into one of Dante's posts and tell him his recommendation doesn't work for everyone, I thought to myself "I've seen that before" and mentioned it. That was all there was to it.

Note: He put up the actual post, so no need for the link.

Actually Mike, I have. Here is your Quote: I saw you do this same thing to Dante, in an old thread I read just today when doing a search. Dante was gyving great information about some supps he recommended, and when Dante failed to mention one aspect of one of the 20 supplements he listed (he didn't say anything wrong, he just didn't elaborate on every single point), you immediately jumped in and tried to make him look stupid simply because he didn't mention that this particular supp didn't work for everyone. UNQUOTE

Saying Stewie tried to make Dante look stupid is the same thing as disrespecting that person. He might not have said the word Disrespect, but it is the same thing making people look stupid or trying that aspect.

And for the record, I disagree about what you say about Stewie, He does nothing but go out of his way to help others.When you say he does nothing positive, it simply is not true. He is not a negative person at all. Why don't we say he is negative to you? That would be a fair assumption.
 
Actually Mike, I have. Here is your Quote: I saw you do this same thing to Dante, in an old thread I read just today when doing a search. Dante was gyving great information about some supps he recommended, and when Dante failed to mention one aspect of one of the 20 supplements he listed (he didn't say anything wrong, he just didn't elaborate on every single point), you immediately jumped in and tried to make him look stupid simply because he didn't mention that this particular supp didn't work for everyone. UNQUOTE

Saying Stewie tried to make Dante look stupid is the same thing as disrespecting that person. He might not have said the word Disrespect, but it is the same thing making people look stupid or trying that aspect.

And for the record, I disagree about what you say about Stewie, He does nothing but go out of his way to help others.When you say he does nothing positive, it simply is not true. He is not a negative person at all. Why don't we say he is negative to you? That would be a fair assumption.

The quote has already been posted..and that's how it appeared to me. Forgive me for seeing things differently, given the behavior I've repeatedly witnessed from him. Not negative at all, huh? I think this thread alone nullifies that statement, but I'm glad you've had good experiences.
 
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The quote has already been posted..and that's how it appeared to me. Forgive me for seeing things differently, given the behavior I've repeatedly witnessed from him. Not negative at all, huh? I think this thread alone nullifies that statement, but I'm glad you've had good experiences.

Like I said, I know he is negative towards you, but he has helped many others on different threads. So, I agree about the negativity here, just don't see all that negativity from him on other threads. Mike, I know who his real name is, what he looks like, where he is from and how he helps others. To say he is negative, simply is not true.
 
Like I said, I know he is negative towards you, but he has helped many others on different threads. So, I agree about the negativity here, just don't see all that negativity from him on other threads. Mike, I know who his real name is, what he looks like, where he is from and how he helps others. To say he is negative, simply is not true.

OK--he's a great guy. He really comes off that way here.
 
Mike. If you so could please, ever be so kind to provide the masses with a well documented paper from a research institute or university goverened by the NHS that proves beyond a resonable doubt that metformin eliminates the androgen receptor in isolation. I'll give you the biggest public apologie this board has ever witnessed.

Otherwise, your word means nothing.
 
Mike. If you so could please, ever be so kind to provide the masses with a well documented paper from a research institute or university goverened by the NHS that proves beyond a resonable doubt that metformin eliminates the androgen receptor in isolation. I'll give you the biggest public apologie this board has ever witnessed.

Otherwise, your word means nothing.

My word? Please don't take my word for it. Just read the study...and see what others more intelligent/educated than you think. Furthermore, I already answered your question several times. The research available is the research that is available. Hopefully they will do additional research in the future to confirm the it was metformin alone, but considering that extensive research that has already been done on all the other variables, the general consensus is that metformin was responsible. But hey, I am just agreeing with those doing the research--because it makes sense to me. Like I said about 10X now, you can argue with them if you want. However, it is extremely likely that current consensus is accurate. Everyone seems to acknowledge that at this point, but you. Once more, here is a re-post of my thoughts on the matter...





"It has nothing to do with trying. You've revealed your true colors. Your responses in this thread, considering the level of respect accorded to you, indicated the presence of what I would consider serious physiological problems and a major character flaw. I could say a lot more, but will stop there.

Secondly, even though I said I was done arguing about it, I will respond to your question. In short, all the evidence points in that direction, Stewie. If you knew more about this subject, you would realize that it is "extremely" likely that metformin is responsible...to the point where it has become the general consensus among those who are doing the actual research. Why? Because ALL the arrows point in that direction.

Here's how you can come to the same conclusion. Read the study, then read studies on the other variables involved, then draw your conclusion. That's what others have done, which, like I said, includes some of the smartest men in the world on this particular subject. When all arrows point in one direction, we are best off looking in that direction. Either way, it would be beyond STUPID for a bodybuilder to ignore all these "arrows". In this case, I tend to side with those who are smarter than you. You know, those whose research is centered around this kind of stuff.

But just so everyone understands, this "question" of yours has nothing to do with getting to the truth, but everything with not wanting to be wrong. You are basically saying (without actually saying it) "I don't care how likely this is to be the case, or what those more intelligent than me think, I am going to deny it until it has been proven beyond any shadow of a doubt".

Well, in that case, you might as well well start challenging most of what we know to be true as bodybuilders, as 99% of what we know about PED's can't be proven 100% from a clinical standpoint. At least in this case the evidence is strongly in my favor, but of course, you are banking on the ignorance or others and hoping I won't know how to respond, just so you can look right, but the truth is the truth--and that's what the evidence indicates.

After all, how do you think I came to this conclusion? By listening to those who do this stuff for a living! I read the available research and had questions, so I sought out the knowledge of those more educated than me. This led me to my current position.

This is no different than the aromatase inhibitor argument. You actually argued that all AI's were equally likely to damage cholesterol values, which was incredibly dumb. Back then, my conclusions on the matter were drawn from real-world experience. I knew I was right, but after that argument I approached a doctor who is knowledgeable in this area and he laughed at you! He even said letrozole was certainly more likely to damage the lipids than Aromasin, and gave multiple reason (and research) as to why. His thoughts just further confirmed what I already knew--that aromasin is the least likely to damage the lipids, followed by arimidex and then letrozole.

You argue about everything--and so far, you've been wrong about everything. You remind me of a few doctors I've argued with--not doctors involved in the bodybuilding community--just regular doctors. They think they know everything, even when it is beyond obvious they are ignorant in certain areas.


Oh, I am doing a bit of more research on metformin, and it appears there may be a few more reasons why bodybuilders shouldn't use it, but I still need to do some more research before I can be sure.

AS far as the whole AR density thing goes, if you want to argue about it some more, like I said , go do it with the researchers/doctors who see things the way I do. There are plenty. Continuing to recommend metformin over berberine, especially at this point, just isn't smart--at least not for bodybuilders (and maybe for no one)."
 
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Gold just dropped to $15 per ounce. Everyone should sell and buy silver, as silver went up to $7,000 an ounce.

That's cuz I said it did.
 
Gold just dropped to $15 per ounce. Everyone should sell and buy silver, as silver went up to $7,000 an ounce.

That's cuz I said it did.

Now that's just silly, but I am being serious when I say the following. Since you think the general consensus is wrong--that everyone else who does this type of research for a living is wrong in their assessment, why don't you go argue with them?

I am stepping out of this. My opinion is based in large part on the opinions of those more educated than me, so I am not going to argue for them anymore. You can take it upon yourself to seek them out for argument if you wish.

I do have to say though, to your credit I have never seen anyone fight so hard to convince others that such relevant research, as well as the opinions of respected doctors and researchers, is all a bunch of unimportant hogwash. When I encounter information like that, I don't just toss it aside and say "well, until it is confirmed with 100% reliability, I am just going to ignore all the available evidence and pretend it doesn't exist". Why are you doing this?
 
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The issue at hand Mike is you have not posted anything to back up your assertions. How can you prove that you are correct without evidence? Your word means nothing without proof. Plain and simple.

Try that in a court of law or even any college classes, and see how far you get.
 
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The issue at hand Mike is you have not posted anything to back up your assertions. How can you prove that you are correct without evidence? Your word means nothing without proof. Plain and simple.

Try that in a court of law or even any college classes, and see how far you get.

These word games are stupid. Both of our positions are as clear as day.

Or should I say "Hello Mr. Wall"
 
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No Mike, you throw up smoke screens and diversions when asked to provide burden of proof.

I could care less if anyone on this planet prefers berberine over metformin or vice-versa. I've handed down information on the potential for interactions with berberine, if those who choose too use, to be cautious. I've also handed down optional choices to an adjuvant to aid in the absorption with berberine. Which I'm sure you'll take both of these and regurgitate as if you discovered this upon your own findings.

So no where within this thread or anywhere else have I told other's not to use BBR.

I've really wasted a lot of my time with you on several occasions. Forget not, I'll still provide to those an area of interest to gain more insight than what has been present by you or whom ever else to ensure there's more than just one person's insight. We all gain from this. Even moreso when we insert citations for burden of proof.
 
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Mike, are you going to post the studies on Metformin? If not, this thread just needs to be locked.

I'm asking for educational purposes as I've never read this in the research nor have I ever once heard any professional ever state this as the case.
 
The issue at hand Mike is you have not posted anything to back up your assertions. How can you prove that you are correct without evidence? Your word means nothing without proof. Plain and simple.

Try that in a court of law or even any college classes, and see how far you get.

Does this study gives us to clues as to what Mike is referring to?

Metformin represses androgen-dependent and androgen-independent prostate cancers by targeting androgen receptor. - PubMed - NCBI

Prostate. 2015 Aug 1;75(11):1187-96. doi: 10.1002/pros.23000. Epub 2015 Apr 20.

Metformin represses androgen-dependent and androgen-independent prostate cancers by targeting androgen receptor.

Wang Y1, Liu G1, Tong D1, Parmar H2, Hasenmayer D2, Yuan W1, Zhang D2, Jiang J1.



Author information




Abstract

BACKGROUND:

Metformin has been reported to inhibit the growth of different types of cancers, including prostate cancer. We were interested to understand if the effect of metformin on prostate cancer is AR-dependent and, if so, whether metformin could act synergistically with the other anti-AR agents to serve as a therapeutic regimen with high efficacy and low toxicity.

METHODS:

Cell viabilities and apoptosis were determined by MTT assay and annexin V-FITC staining, respectively, when the two human prostate cancer cell lines, the androgen-dependent LNCaP and the androgen-independent 22RV1 were treated with metformin alone or in combination with bicalutamide. Quantitative RT-PCR and western blotting assays were conducted to examine metformin effects on AR mRNA and protein levels, respectively. Chromatin immunoprecipitation (ChIP) assays were conducted to confirm the recruitment of AR to the ARE(s) located on the promoter region of the AR target gene PSA.

RESULTS:

Metformin treatment reduced cell viability and enhanced apoptosis for both cell lines and additive effects were observed when LNCaP cells were treated with combined metformin and bicalutamide. Metformin down-regulated full-length AR protein in LNCaP cells. Both full-length and the truncated AR (AR-v7) were down-regulated by metformin in CWR22Rv1 cells. In both LNCaP and CWR22Rv1 cells, metformin repressed AR signaling pathway not by affecting AR protein degradation/stability, but rather through down-regulating the levels of AR mRNAs.

CONCLUSIONS:

Metformin represses prostate cancer cell viability and enhances apoptosis by targeting the AR signaling pathway. Combinations of metformin and other anti-AR agents pose a potentially promising therapeutic approach for treatment of prostate cancers, especially the castrate-resistant prostate cancer, with high efficacy and low toxicity.

© 2015 Wiley Periodicals, Inc.

http://www.cancerletters.info/article/S0304-3835(14)00499-6/abstract

SMILE upregulated by metformin inhibits the function of androgen receptor in prostate cancer cells


Highlights


•Metformin reduces the androgen-dependent growth of prostate cancer cells and the expression of endogenous AR target genes.
•Metformin induces SMILE expression in prostate cancer cells, of which knockdown with shRNA abolished the inhibitory effect of metformin on AR function.
•SMILE suppresses AR transactivation through physical interaction with AR.
•SMILE inhibits the expression of AR target genes and the androgen-dependent growth of prostate cancer cells.



Abstract

Metformin, a diabetes drug, has been reported to inhibit the growth of prostate cancer cells. In this study, we investigated the effect and action mechanism of metformin on the function of androgen receptor (AR), a key molecule in the proliferation of prostate cancer cells. Metformin was found to reduce androgen-dependent cell growth and the expression of AR target genes by inhibiting AR function in prostate cancer cells such as LNCaP and C4-2 cells. Interestingly, metformin upregulated the protein level of small heterodimer partner-interacting leucine zipper (SMILE), a coregulator of nuclear receptors, and knockdown of SMILE expression with shRNA abolished the inhibitory effect of metformin on AR function. Further studies revealed that SMILE protein itself suppressed the transactivation of AR, and its ectopic expression resulted in the repressed expression of endogenous AR target genes, PSA and NKX3.1, in LNCaP cells. In addition, SMILE protein physically interacted with AR and competed with the AR coactivator SRC-1 to modulate AR transactivation. As expected, SMILE repressed androgen-dependent growth of LNCaP and C4-2 cells. Taken together, these results suggest that SMILE, which is induced by metformin, functions as a novel AR corepressor and may mediate the inhibitory effect of metformin on androgen-dependent growth of prostate cancer cells.

Metformin anti-tumor effect via disruption of the MID1 translational regulator complex and AR downregulation in prostate cancer cells - Springer

Metformin anti-tumor effect via disruption of the MID1 translational regulator complex and AR downregulation in prostate cancer cells

Abstract


Background

Metformin is an approved drug prescribed for diabetes. Its role as an anti-cancer agent has drawn significant attention because of its minimal side effects and low cost. However, its mechanism of anti-tumour action has not yet been fully clarified.


Methods

The effect on cell growth was assessed by cell counting. Western blot was used for analysis of protein levels, Boyden chamber assays for analyses of cell migration and co-immunoprecipitation (CoIP) followed by western blot, PCR or qPCR for analysis of protein-protein and protein-mRNA interactions.


Results

Metformin showed an anti-proliferative effect on a wide range of prostate cancer cells. It disrupted the AR translational MID1 regulator complex leading to release of the associated AR mRNA and subsequently to downregulation of AR protein in AR positive cell lines. Inhibition of AR positive and negative prostate cancer cells by metformin suggests involvement of additional targets. The inhibitory effect of metformin was mimicked by disruption of the MID1-α4/PP2A protein complex by siRNA knockdown of MID1 or α4 whereas AMPK activation was not required.


Conclusions

Findings reported herein uncover a mechanism for the anti-tumor activity of metformin in prostate cancer, which is independent of its anti-diabetic effects. These data provide a rationale for the use of metformin in the treatment of hormone naïve and castration-resistant prostate cancer and suggest AR is an important indirect target of metformin.

**broken link removed**


Metformin Inhibits Androgen-Induced IGF-IR Up-Regulation in Prostate Cancer Cells by Disrupting Membrane-Initiated Androgen Signaling

Roberta Malaguarnera*, Antonella Sacco*, Alaide Morcavallo, Sebastiano Squatrito, Antimo Migliaccio, Andrea Morrione, Marcello Maggiolini, and Antonino Belfiore



We have previously demonstrated that, in prostate cancer cells, androgens up-regulate IGF-I receptor (IGF-IR) by inducing cAMP-response element-binding protein (CREB) activation and CREB-dependent IGF-IR gene transcription through androgen receptor (AR)-dependent membrane-initiated effects. This IGF-IR up-regulation is not blocked by classical antiandrogens and sensitizes cells to IGF-I-induced biological effects. Metformin exerts complex antitumoral functions in various models and may inhibit CREB activation in hepatocytes. We, therefore, evaluated whether metformin may affect androgen-dependent IGF-IR up-regulation. In the AR+ LNCaP prostate cancer cells, we found that metformin inhibits androgen-induced CRE activity and IGF-IR gene transcription. CRE activity requires the formation of a CREB-CREB binding protein-CREB regulated transcription coactivator 2 (CRTC2) complex, which follows Ser133-CREB phosphorylation. Metformin inhibited Ser133-CREB phosphorylation and induced nuclear exclusion of CREB cofactor CRTC2, thus dissociating the CREB-CREB binding protein-CRTC2 complex and blocking its transcriptional activity. Similarly to metformin action, CRTC2 silencing inhibited IGF-IR promoter activity. Moreover, metformin blocked membrane-initiated signals of AR to the mammalian target of rapamycin/p70S6Kinase pathway by inhibiting AR phosphorylation and its association with c-Src. AMPK signals were also involved to some extent. By inhibiting androgen-dependent IGF-IR up-regulation, metformin reduced IGF-I-mediated proliferation of LNCaP cells. These results indicate that, in prostate cancer cells, metformin inhibits IGF-I-mediated biological effects by disrupting membrane-initiated AR action responsible for IGF-IR up-regulation and suggest that metformin could represent a useful adjunct to the classical antiandrogen therapy.


Androgen stimulation is critical for growth and resistance to apoptosis in most early-stage prostate carcinomas, which, therefore, are responsive to androgen deprivation. However, the clinical benefits of androgen deprivation are temporary, and these carcinomas may eventually progress to castration-resistant tumors, for which no effective treatment is currently available. The molecular basis of androgen independency is incompletely understood.

In response to androgens, androgen receptors (ARs) regulate transcription by interacting with the androgen response elements located within the promoter regions of target genes and forming a multiprotein complex, which contains coactivators, corepressors, histone acetyltransferases, and histone deacetylases (1). However, increasing evidence suggests that the biological responses to androgens can be additionally mediated by membrane-initiated signals, which trigger rapid intracellular transduction pathways like ERK, phosphoinositide 3-kinase, protein kinase A, and protein kinase C, that may eventually activate gene transcription (2). Membrane-initiated androgen signals appear to be enhanced in malignant prostate cells by various mechanisms, including increased proportion of membrane-associated ARs and increased expression of kinases (eg, c-Src) and/or adaptors that contribute to the formation of multiprotein complexes with AR at the membrane level and trigger the activation of intracellular pathways (3).

Androgen activity itself may contribute to the progression to castration-resistant prostate cancer by up-regulating autocrine loops involving peptide growth factors and their cognate receptors (4).

In this context, we have previously found that androgens induce a selective up-regulation of the IGF-I receptor (IGF-IR) in prostate cancer cells and increase, in this way, cell proliferation and invasiveness in response to IGF-I (5). This effect occurs through the activation of membrane-initiated signals, which require the recruitment of membrane-bound AR to c-Src and subsequent activation of a downstream signaling pathway involving c-Src/ERK/cAMP-response element-binding protein (CREB) that eventually stimulates the activity of the IGF-IR promoter (5, 6). This mechanism may open a new approach to prostate cancer therapy, because it is poorly affected by classic antiandrogens but can be blocked by CREB silencing or by inhibitors of the c-Src/ERK pathway (6). The transcriptional activity of CREB-dependent target genes requires the formation of the CREB-CREB binding protein (CBP)-CREB regulated transcription coactivator 2 (CRTC2) complex (7). In particular, AMPK phosphorylates CRTC2 at Ser171 causing its interaction with 14–3-3 proteins and sequestration in the cytoplasm. Glucose and hormones lead to the dephosphorylation of CRTC2, its dissociation from 14–3-3 proteins, and as a consequence, its translocation to the nucleus, where it binds CREB and promotes CREB-dependent transcription. Metformin may additionally disrupt the CREB-CBP-CRTC2 complex by inducing CBP phosphorylation at Ser436 (7).

In recent years, the biguanide metformin, widely used as antidiabetic drug, has raised much interest for its anticancer potential (8, 9). Indeed, metformin has shown antiproliferative effects in several cancer cells, including prostate cancer cells (10, 11). Interestingly, prostate cancer cells appear to be more sensitive to metformin than normal epithelial prostate cells. In vivo, metformin increases the response of prostate cells xenografts to the antiandrogen bicalutamide (12). Anticancer effects of metformin are mostly attributed to its ability to activate AMPK, which, in turn, down-regulates mammalian target of rapamycin complex 1 (mTORC1) signaling, an essential regulator of cell growth and proliferation (8). Metformin has, however, pleiotropic effects and may additionally inhibit mTORC1 through AMPK-independent pathways (13, 14). Metformin may also target ERK signaling (15), reduce Ca(2+)-dependent protein kinase Cα/ERK and c-Jun N-terminal kinase/activator protein-1 signaling pathways (16, 17), and also inhibit Akt (protein kinase B [PKB]) activity through serine phosphorylation of insulin receptor substrate-1 (18).

Because metformin is able to inhibit multiple signaling pathways, we aimed at evaluating whether, in prostate cancer cells, metformin may also affect the membrane-initiated effects of androgens, which lead to IGF-IR up-regulation and increased sensitivity to IGF-I. Here, we show that metformin inhibits androgen-induced IGF-IR up-regulation and the resulting mitogenic and invasive effects of IGF-I through multiple mechanisms. These include the inhibition of transcriptional activity of CREB-CBP-CRTC2 complex, the inhibition of mTORC1/p70S6 kinase (p70S6K) pathway, and the disruption of AR/c-Src interaction.
*****
In conclusion, we have identified a novel potential antitumor effect of metformin operating in AR+ prostate cancer cells and involving the inhibition of membrane-initiated androgen effects, adding to the list of the numerous antitumor effects of metformin observed in several in vitro and in vivo model systems. We have especially characterized the action of metformin in blocking androgen-induced IGF-IR up-regulation and IGF-I-mediated biological effects. However, given that metformin inhibits a very early step of membrane-initiated androgen effects, ie, the association between Src and AR and AR phosphorylation, there is the possibility that metformin may also block other membrane-initiated effects of androgens. Several evidences indicate that membrane-initiated androgen effects are enhanced in cancer cells and may play a role in tumor progression (1–3). Our present findings, therefore, open the way to a deeper understanding of the potential effects of metformin in prostate cancer.
 
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Does this study gives us to clues as to what Mike is referring to?

Metformin represses androgen-dependent and androgen-independent prostate cancers by targeting androgen receptor. - PubMed - NCBI

Prostate. 2015 Aug 1;75(11):1187-96. doi: 10.1002/pros.23000. Epub 2015 Apr 20.

Metformin represses androgen-dependent and androgen-independent prostate cancers by targeting androgen receptor.

Wang Y1, Liu G1, Tong D1, Parmar H2, Hasenmayer D2, Yuan W1, Zhang D2, Jiang J1.



Author information




Abstract

BACKGROUND:

Metformin has been reported to inhibit the growth of different types of cancers, including prostate cancer. We were interested to understand if the effect of metformin on prostate cancer is AR-dependent and, if so, whether metformin could act synergistically with the other anti-AR agents to serve as a therapeutic regimen with high efficacy and low toxicity.

METHODS:

Cell viabilities and apoptosis were determined by MTT assay and annexin V-FITC staining, respectively, when the two human prostate cancer cell lines, the androgen-dependent LNCaP and the androgen-independent 22RV1 were treated with metformin alone or in combination with bicalutamide. Quantitative RT-PCR and western blotting assays were conducted to examine metformin effects on AR mRNA and protein levels, respectively. Chromatin immunoprecipitation (ChIP) assays were conducted to confirm the recruitment of AR to the ARE(s) located on the promoter region of the AR target gene PSA.

RESULTS:

Metformin treatment reduced cell viability and enhanced apoptosis for both cell lines and additive effects were observed when LNCaP cells were treated with combined metformin and bicalutamide. Metformin down-regulated full-length AR protein in LNCaP cells. Both full-length and the truncated AR (AR-v7) were down-regulated by metformin in CWR22Rv1 cells. In both LNCaP and CWR22Rv1 cells, metformin repressed AR signaling pathway not by affecting AR protein degradation/stability, but rather through down-regulating the levels of AR mRNAs.

CONCLUSIONS:

Metformin represses prostate cancer cell viability and enhances apoptosis by targeting the AR signaling pathway. Combinations of metformin and other anti-AR agents pose a potentially promising therapeutic approach for treatment of prostate cancers, especially the castrate-resistant prostate cancer, with high efficacy and low toxicity.

© 2015 Wiley Periodicals, Inc.

Yep absolutely it does. That's why I was asking Mike to cite in isolation. Take note of the antiandrogen, bicalutamide in which I brought up several posts ago.

Bicalutamide, as noted previously in my aforementioned post acts directly on degradation of the androgen receptor.

Mike incidentally doesn't comprehend this. Nor will he accept the fact metformin in isolation does not eliminate the androgen receptor.
 
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Yep absolutely it does. That's why I was asking Mike to cite in isolation. Take note of the antiandrogen, bicalutamide in which I brought up several posts ago.

Bicalutamide, as noted previously in my aforementioned post acts directly on degradation of the androgen receptor.

Mike incidentally doesn't comprehend this. Nor will he accept the fact, metformin in isolation does not eliminate the androgen receptor.

I updated my post with other studies.

The question is... if metformin affect how androgen receptors function (as some of the studies I posted seems to show) without eliminating/degrading them, isn't it still bad since it would lessen the effect of anabolic hormones (either from the body or supplemental sources)?
 
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Mike, are you going to post the studies on Metformin? If not, this thread just needs to be locked.

I'm asking for educational purposes as I've never read this in the research nor have I ever once heard any professional ever state this as the case.

He can't becuse metformin hasn't been shown in isolation to eliminate the androgen receptor.
 
I updated my post with other studies.

The question is... if metformin affect how androgen receptors function (as some of the studies I posted seems to show) without eliminating them, isn't it still bad since it would less the effect of anabolic hormones (either from the body or supplemental sources)?

This has been discussed with both metformin and berberine action on cancer cell lines in the prostate. The question remains, if this action occurs in non-tumorigenesis AR. Truthfully, I have no idea?
 
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