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Interesting Thread From Bodybuilding Website

rmbX66t1

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I'm curious to here some more experienced guys, especially the pros, chime in on this information. This is obviously posted by a fan, who has no experience at the high level of the IFBB. So I'm really curious how those who've been there feel about it all. Here is part one:

NVious said:
So I've been meaning to write this for a while, but I hadn't gotten the time nor felt the inspiration to really lay it out there. However I feel that the time has come to really put the truth out there.

Before we begin, it's best to say that if you're easily upset or have some "loyalty" to any organization, this is NOT the thread for you.

So let's begin, the IFBB is not an organization with the best interest of bodybuilding fans or even bodybuilders themselves. They've proven time and time again that they couldn't care less about people that actually have an interest in this already fringe "sport." How? Well let's take a look at everything the IFBB does wrong.

[size=+2]1.Judging[/size]
Over the years people have seemingly gotten used to terrible decisions, even at the biggest shows with the most spotlight. Some notable examples are Cutler being gifted in 07 and 11/Cedric at the AC and Dallas/Sami being beaten by the monstrosity KE/Branch winning two AC titles and the list goes on and on (think Baitollah Abbaspour/Charles Dixon). More often than not, you tend to expect some retarded decision to be made at pretty much every pro show.

[size=+2]2.What is actually judged?[/size]
NOBODY even really knows, I mean we have an idea: mandatory poses/muscularity/flow/proportions/aesthetics. These are all terms thrown around, but they're EXTREMELY ambiguous since no judge ever steps forward to discuss their decisions and there is no print of how much each of those is worth. You're left with people being placed differently from show to show, standards changing is a new winner is announced, i.e now they award improvements and disregard a bodybuilder who although better doesn't look as good as he has in the past or they award the most shredded guy who doesn't necessarily look the best or maybe they award the biggest guy who doesn't have the best proportions or maybe they award the guy with the best aesthetics. The issue is that the judges can hide behind these terms and just say "oh it's subjective," thus allowing them to make terrible decisions that would not be justifiable if we had some fine print into what is actually judged. There is ZERO consistency, thus leaving the people following bbing just as confused as someone who may not know anything about it as to why someone won.

Probably the biggest issue I have with the judging itself is that posing...you know the thing that so many prior bodybuilders prided themselves on....yeah POSING ISN'T JUDGED. Maybe the NBA should play with a football, maybe the NFL should take away tackling and use, maybe the NHL should use soccer nets instead, maybe the MLB should...actually baseball sucks so who cares? But you get the point, posing...something that used to be how shows were won or lost and the thing that really brought an "artistic" form to bodybuilding, yeah that's now gone.

[size=+2]3.Streaming[/size]
When I first started following bbing in 09 there were actually streams regularly of many pro shows and even going back further, there were obviously streams for gifs like this to be made:
kingk.gif


Now have humans improved technology wise from 09 to 13? lol..... So why don't we have more streams? PURE LAZINESS. What kind of a moronic organization DOESN'T EVEN MAKE THEIR "SPORT" ACCESSIBLE TO THE FEW PEOPLE THAT CARE? I can find streams for the local junior sports team and have been able to for nearly a decade, yet in 2013 I can only find streams for two of the biggest events in PROFESSIONAL BODYBUILDING... That's a joke, there is ZERO EXCUSES for this. I don't care if in the past you had to wait months to get results, this isn't the past. They could even charge for a yearly online pass, but IFBB marketing itself and trying to maximize fans? Nahhh.

[size=+2]4.Lighting[/size]
Seriously? How hard is it to get this right? I mean in the 90s it seemed nearly every show had epic lighting or at least half decent lighting. Now you're lucky if you get 2-3 shows a year with decent lighting, let's take a look at some recent poverty efforts:

DSC09381_JKCQQIFQKT.jpg


DSC09398_RYIMSMFSSD.jpg


JB5_1912_GRPNRVKSZY.jpg


JB5_1915_SKKYZXOFJV.jpg


Yuckk....wtf happened to shows like this:
[youtube]t-qiDzXzhcc[/youtube]

Can the IFBB not afford to hire a professional lighting crew AT LEAST for their pro shows?

[size=+2]5.The Rampant Hypocrisy[/size]
This ties into the judging, but it deserves it's own mention. The recent Cedric fiasco highlights this entire point, I mean what sort of organization DQs one of the biggest draws to it's shows because that person missed a meaningless meeting in a foreign country. Not only did that person have to arrange for his own transportation to get to the actual event, but they had to pay to be in the country.....STRONG professional organization. Of all the things to enforce in their nonsensical paradigm, they choose this? Didn't they put out a memo saying they were going to mark down guts some years ago? Aren't AAS/diuretics banned per their rules? Hmmmm.

/Part1
 
Last edited:

rmbX66t1

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Part two:

NVious said:
Outside of the IFBB, what are the biggest issues with the bodybuilders.

[size=+2]There is a clear regression in the quality of bodybuilders[/size]
This is the cold harsh truth, although there are a few good bodybuilders left, they're few and far between. The best way to illustrate this is to take a look at the Arnold Classic 10 years ago and the Arnold Classic now:

**broken link removed**

**broken link removed**

Some of the physiques being reward in the top 6 today
**broken link removed**

normal_DSC_8445_ergebnis%7E2.jpg


**broken link removed**

DSC_8978_ergebnis%7E0.jpg


The beauty/aesthetic appeal has clearly been lost and for what? A bunch of huge guts that aren't even that impressive anywhere else. I understand that some people prefer bigger physiques, but the quality is NOT BETTER. It's not like these guys are all just huge mass monsters everywhere, it's usually a huge stomach with maybe one other good body part. There is really no excuse for the debacle at the Arnold and how many sub par physiques that were rewarded.

The physiques in general lack a foundation, the little details/separation are missing and the taper has been killed. So while they've got the GODLY STRIVE FOR shredded glutes, is the rest of their physique really there?

At the end of the day you can either reward guys like that, that the general public is going to think look absolutely awful and really they're very correct or you can start scaling back the physiques and reward someone who has much better aesthetic appeal and AT LEAST you can attract more people to follow bodybuilding that way, as opposed to turning off the few that do even more.

In general there has definitely been a regression and a clear over reliance on drugs among the modern crop of bodybuilders. The waists are out of control, some guys are clearly using SEOs and there really is no net gain as nobody in the modern day is even coming close to ****ing with 03 Coleman as far as pure mass goes. I don't even have to go as far back as the 90s to prove this point, even the guys 10 years ago were better, the genetic aspect of bodybuilding is being sucked out and being replaced with sheer drug abuse.

[size=+2]They're Non Marketable/Dull Stereotypical Meatheads[/size]
With the exception of a few guys that are actually interesting to watch/listen to like Antoine/Cedric/Evan/Kai/Heath, the majority of the IFBB couldn't really care less about interacting with fans/posting on forums or giving the few people that care updates. This is why people like Zyzz/Hodgetwins/Chris Jones are just as popular if not more popular than A LOT of the top IFBB pros, they post regular updates, interact with people and seem to have a fun/easy going attitude, even though clearly their physiques aren't on the level of some of the top guys, they're far more easy to relate to.

In mentioning the physiques above, that is the other aspect that has gotten away from bodybuilding is the ability to relate to the average person. Not only do these guys fail to articulate their thoughts/interact with fans/be accessible, but their physiques are just too out there for the general public, so not only do they lose possible market share to guys that "shouldn't be on their level," they also do themselves no favors by the way they go about "putting themselves out there."

I.e why is Joe Blow going to be inspired by IFBB pro XYZ when he turn on crossfit on ESPN or see Greg Plitt on a muscle and fitness cover and that is 1000X closer to what he'd want to look like or perform like. Bodybuilders are always going to be stereotyped, but unless they go out of their way to educate the public about the reality of what they do, it's going to stay that way and to a large extent, it's because the stereotype has a big truth. Even Arnold, the person who has done most for bodybuilding as a whole said in his book "Bodybuilders are lazy."

[size=+2]The Industry[/size]

We all know the industry itself is entirely founded on the lies of supplement companies, i.e by putting bodybuilder xyz on useless product zyx they imply that he somehow got that way with their product, meanwhile they leave out huge aspects of what it really took to get there. It's essentially an industry founded on smoke and mirrors, with little regard for the actual truth.

Not only that, but all the magazines have their petty little feuds with each other, preventing the interviewers from actually interviewing the bodybuilders. The great irony here is that just by interviewing the other person's signed "athlete" you could help promote not only the athlete, but your own company as well as the others, so the overall growth of bodybuilding would increase, but nahhhh gotta STICK IT TO EM!

If there is no unity within, how do you possibly expect to draw in a new crowd?

[size=+2]The Rise of Crossfit/Fitness/Physique[/size]

With all of the above said, even if you realize 1/10 of it to be true, why would you try and pursue an active involvement in this industry/organization?

Most people realize this and it's why things like crossfit/physique are continuing to grow, meanwhile bodybuilding (IFBB specifically) seems to be becoming more and more on the fringe.

[size=+2]Wrapping it up[/size]

Let's just finish off on this note: regardless of where you stand on these issues, I think we can all agree that there is a lot of room for improvement.

The bad:
Ultimately the IFBB DOES NOT care that much, they've found their niche market and make good money charging people to renew their IFBB cards or enter contests while spending minimal on promotion/lighting/proper judging or really attempting to fix things.

I shudder to think about the day that Arnold passes because just when I think things have hit rock bottom, they may even find a way to get even worse. Arnold IMO is really the one thing/person that exists that can still execute a drastic change on the IFBB as a whole, unfortunately with his schedule/appearances I just don't see that happening. Here is Arnold's take on the direction of bodybuilding:

[size=+2][–]GovSchwarzeneggerThe Real Arnold 883 points 1 month ago[/size]

First, I have nothing against monsters. It takes a lot of effort to get there. But we shouldn't go away from the basic principles of proportions, symmetry, muscularity, performance on the stage, and the idea of a small waist and big shoulders. The further we get from those principles, the further we get from the ideal.

The good:
NONE of what I said is that drastic that it can't be fixed, it wouldn't even be that difficult to fix. I honestly think if people got their **** together, in a matter of a year or two bodybuilding could be completely revamped and headed towards a positive direction, but and this is a big BUT it's going to take an active effort from all people associated with the IFBB/MD/Flex/Supp companies and I just don't know if they're really that interested.

So to sum it up, this kind of turned into a long winded whine fest, but the way I look at it is that we're at the crossroads or have been at the crossroads for quite some time. Unfortunately if no one decides to steer the ship, it'll go with the flow and the flow isn't always where you want to go.
 

Kaladryn

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With the exception of a few guys that are actually interesting to watch/listen to like Antoine/Cedric/Evan/Kai/Heath, the majority of the IFBB couldn't really care less about interacting with fans/posting on forums or giving the few people that care updates.

This sentence explains everything he wrote.
 

rmbX66t1

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This sentence explains everything he wrote.

Lol, there was some nonsense in it, such as that statement. Although, I agree with a lot of the major components (if not all). I think his exposure to the IFBB limits a lot of understanding of it. This ultimately makes his perception a little broken, if you will. I still thought it was a great thread, just a misdirected. I think the fans are not the biggest victim here, but rather, the pros competing.
 

trenlover

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Bodybuilding

a statement made by on of our own here at PM said " bodybuilding is not a sport and is at its best a "show."

I cant remember the guys handle here on PM that wrote that, but every since I read that it has made more and more sense to me.

understand I am a man that completely supports bodybuilders; one of my good friends competes in the IFBB today. I have been to Olympia's and other shows and I love bodybuilding (im not bashing bb).

But back in the 90's when they actually showed bodybuilding on ESPN, this was before all the witch-hunts for athletes on steroids (beginning with Pres. Bush in his state of the union address where he actually spent 10 minutes talking about steroids in pro sports, rather than the real "state of the union"). since that time bodybuilding has ceased to be a sport, IMO.

I would love bodybuilders to get real "athletes" status, privileges and accolades from the sports world here in the U.S......but its never going to happen, thanks to the politicians in D.C. that have redirected peoples attention to steroids in sports, rather than trying to fix this country from what really ails it.
 

Thunder46

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I have to admit as much as I love BB I agree with alot of what the poster said. Bodybuilding is on the decline the last show I was in there were more mens and women physique than bodybuilders, and those damn bikini girls that have nothing to do with a bodybuilding show, at least to me
 

meterman5

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But back in the 90's when they actually showed bodybuilding on ESPN, this was before all the witch-hunts for athletes on steroids (beginning with Pres. Bush in his state of the union address where he actually spent 10 minutes talking about steroids in pro sports, rather than the real "state of the union"). since that time bodybuilding has ceased to be a sport, IMO.

Dear God please don't blame Bush for the decline of bodybuilding ha ha.

I think there are a combination of factors. Steroids in general are getting more media due to tons of athletes getting popped and suspended for PED's. Just as the new flavor of the week is aderrall and hgh in the NFL I think we will see a shift attention.

As far as bodybuilding goes it's always been a nigce sport. Few bodybuilders were able to escape that meathead personality. Arnold even in most of his movies was typcast as a meathead. Thats not to say that some of the guys are not super intelligent and genuinely personable.

As has been pointed out on here profesional bodybuilding has not been a very healthy sport ever. Guys are still sticking to the mentality of the better "freak" I am the more I will win. Unfortunately its been out of control for a while. I followed BB in the late 90's for a bit when I really got into the sport and I prefer a classic " big physique. Probably my favorite was Serge Nubret or Sergio olivia. Just because of the way Nubret flowed yet was only around 200 lbs. Olivia was a monster for his day.

I think cinemax or HBO put out a Pumping Iron anniversary edition and interviewing all the bodybuilders you could see that in the 60' and partially the 70's they seemed like a very close knit group that had a lot of comradere. It does not seem that way now. Until there is another charismatic champion that can be an ambassador like Arnold was bodybuilding will still suffer. The closest thing to that is The Rock. He is probably the biggest mainstream actor that has the charisma and personality to break the meathead stereotype. Professional wrestling has long been laughed at as fake and staged but people still love Dwayne Johnson and give him more credibility. Although legal rights to the name "The Rock" belong to the WWE (last I checked he hadn't negotiated with McMahin for them) he is always going to be known as the rock not Dwayne Johnson.

In the end todays crop of pros is no different than past where their mentality is "more is better" and they are doing things that are really on the realm of pushing it to far (synthol to start). PLus regardless of what the AAS dosages are I am sure through the years they have gotten exponentially bigger. It takes 100's of years for genetic codes to start to alter and eveolve not 20-30 so it's not that today's guys just have "better genetics". Maybe slightly but not much. Couple that with a very unhealthy lifestyle outside of the stage and what you see under the lights is the product.

To end this rant I hope that things do change and I would not be dissapointed to see competitors coming back in at 230-240 a little bit healthier than guys at 260+ the way they look. now. I think this post was about 75% accurate.
 

lntense

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Gay for pay wins contests
 

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