Interleukin 15 with IGF or Igfr3????

[Juice Freak]

Hello, I'[m doing various research on the cytokine interleukin-15. It seems to create a vary anabolic environment when combined with igf. My question is and maybe Dat can chime in is. Isn't exogenous igf-1 a waste of time? Would I not be better served by creating an igf1 spike by combining gh with slin. My theory is to use the interleukin only on workout days 3x per week. What is your opinion to combine it with igf1 or igf1r3 or to create a spike with gh and slin??? From my reading exogenous igf does not reach the muscle cell? Just floats around and grows things I don't want growing. Cheers.

 

[Juice Freak]

Anybody have any insight???

 

[Juice Freak]

No one, on this entire board has an idea about how to use interleukin 15 with endogenous or exogenous igf1???? Or any theories?

 

[The Scientist]

No one, on this entire board has an idea about how to use interleukin 15 with endogenous or exogenous igf1???? Or any theories?

Hi I stumble on this in my search of more info on IL 15...


Interleukin-15
By Gavin Kane, PhD.

A relatively new and exciting product has once again hit the underground scene with promises of 200+ pounds of muscle in 2 weeks, blah, blah; yeah you know the same old hype and promises. Then there is the, “I have a friend who knows a guy who trained a guy who took it and put on 28lbs in 4 weeks and got leaner”, yeah right. So here we go again, another promise of the Holy Grail, the big one.

So I shall dig deeper into this new and exciting, revolutionary, promising new drug to expose the myth, the hype and hopefully the truth. I will start with an explanation, what exactly is this stuff? IL-15 is a hormone belonging to a class of compounds referred to as pro-inflammatory cytokines. It is naturally produced in the human body but has been isolated and synthetically manufactured. Recombinant Human KGF-1(FGF-7) produced in E.Coli is a single, non-glycosylated, polypeptide chain containing 164 amino acids and having a molecular mass of 18995 Dalton. This makes it the second longest peptide chain in use today, with gh being the longest at 191 aminos. Here is the sequence:
MNWVNVISDL KKIEDLIQSM HIDATLYTES DVHPSCKVTAMKCFLLELQV ISHESGDTDI HDTVENLIIL ANNILSSNGNITESGCKECE ELEEKNIKEF LQSFVHIVQM FINTS

There have been numerous studies that have peaked the interest of research scientists and bodybuilders alike. Most of these studies were performed on rats as human trials have not yet been approved. What is of interest is the increase in myosin contractile protein content, up to a 5x increase upon administration of IL-15. What this means to you is the possibility of skeletal muscle tissue increases 5x faster than without administration of this peptide.

Another recent study looked at the increase in myoblasts, the cells that form into new adult muscle cells, also known as hyperplasia. They also looked to see if there were any increases in cell proliferation and differentiation. Of interest is that IGF levels had to be lowered to increase proliferation, meaning that IGF and IL-15 could be counter acting. Because both peptides perform similar functions, they may actually be competing, with IGF having more pronounced and stronger effects.

While the proliferation of cells does not seem to be prominent unless IGF levels are already low, such as in severe wasting syndrome, what is of interest in this product and noted in all studies is the incredible anti-catabolic effects by reducing protein turnover rates. However, this has only appeared to be true in patients that were once again suffering from severe wasting syndrome such as AIDS or cancer. There was no noticeable change in healthy adults.

In another study from 2001, healthy rats were given 100mcg/kg of IL-15 to study protein turnover, yet no noticeable change was noted. Something of interest did happen in the rats however, huge decreases in white adipose tissue, up to 33% reductions. So while this peptide may not deliver the incredible increases in new muscle cells, it may show promise as an incredible fat loss product while dieting for shows.

This product is headed and being heralded as the next replacement for growth hormone therapy in patients with severe catabolic wasting syndrome. Patients in advanced stages of AIDS, cancer, and burn victims will benefit most from this product. It appears to have incredible anti-catabolic effects and can possibly prevent further tissue damage from wasting by producing new cells. The problem is this will only happen in IGF deficient cells, such as those damaged from a virus.

So what promise does this product hold for bodybuilders? Not much and certainly not at the current cost. I assume part of the mystique of this product and hype is that is it hard to get a hold of, the price is insane, and there are rumors of the upper echelon using it. There is one rumor I can squash right now, no one on the current bodybuilding circuit is currently using this product, not just from lack of availability (you can get anything you want if you have enough money), but from lack of research, lack of real world results, and better products proven to work already available. The average cost of this product is $3550 per 1mg.

IGF-1 LR3 receptor grade can be had for as low as $200 per 1mg, so if it is competing with IGF at cell receptors and you are not deficient, why risk the cost when there are no proven benefits. As much of a rogue peptide user as I am, this is one product that currently has no interest for me.
__________________

 

[The Scientist]

Interleukin 15

But then again there is also more prominent figures in our sport that got more insight then the norm...The next came out of a Q&A with my good old friend and legend Author L Rea.

Interleukin - 15 (IL-15).
This is one of the newer drugs appearing on the bodybuilding scene that I would like to comment only briefly on. The human body produces several growth factors that are mediators and intermediates. In short this means they translate or decrease/increase the effect of hormones and other growth factors.

A study published in the Journal of Endocrinology in 1995 showed IL-15 doubled the rate of hypertrophy in skeletal muscle tissue. Interesting? Well the same study showed that stacking IL-15 with IGF-1 (insulin like growth factor-1; the stuff GH is converted into by the liver and other sites) increased muscular hypertrophy (excessive development/growth) by 500%. How is that for mediation?


What Is Hypertrophy?
Hypertrophy is defined as a condition of overgrowth or excessive development of an organ or body-part.



I have known only a few athletes whom have utilized this stack, and to be honest, I have always believed (and seen that) freaks can be created even from those with below average genetics anyway. Yes, the results were amazing.

The down side of IL-15 use is that lack of research. Some have speculated that IL-15 can trigger cancer cell growth. However, available research has not shown a connection between IL-15 and organ growth as of yet.

I will not, at this point, explain reported cycles or use. There is not enough research as of yet concerning possible negative side effects. However as more research becomes available, you can bet I will be happy to share the reported results.

 

[The Scientist]

Creating IGF-1 des 3

Well this is what I'm expermenting with at the moment so can't give you my opinion of yet...but here is some research...

So we know that insulin is not the only mediator of glucose transport into muscle cells. We also have validated the increase in potential muscle glycogen synthesis during the employment of DNP is about twice that of insulin. Hmmm, not getting it yet? Be patient. You will in a minute.

*Effects of cellular ATP depletion on glucose transport and insulin signaling in 3T3-L1 adipocytes
E Heart, J Kang, C K Sung
American Journal of Physiology - Endocrinology and Metabolism , 280(3):E428-E435 2001

When athletes have employed the DNP/lnsulin Protocol in the past there has
been a noted dramatic increase in lean tissue mass and a lack of hypoglycemia in almost all cases. This in itself was an exciting issue to research as one of the many negative side effects possible from non-medically supervised administration of insulin in hypoglycemia and coma...and death. (All of which suck) There are two possible explanations for this:

1. The insulin molecule is experiencing N-terminal truncation when coming into
contact with circulatory DNP. When the N-terminal is removed from IGF-1 the
resulting growth factor is called Des (1-3) IGF-1. The result is an anabolic far
more powerful than even IGF-1 itself. This is true of IGF-2 and other growth
factors including insulin. The possibility strongly suggests that the truncated
insulin molecule would more readily fit into and activate the muscle cell IGF-1
receptors as well.

2. The insulin and IGF-1 receptors themselves are truncated by the presence ofDNP. In this case the truncation is effecting the COOH-Terminal response thus altering the hypoglycemic and anabolic effects of insulin positively toward that of IGF-1 in both function and action.