Is a healthy liver underrated in optimizing body composition?

[qbkilla]

I know many people use liver support for overall health reasons, but do you think keeping a healthy liver is key to optimize body composition too?

I can't recall the thread but someone on here mentioned how the liver filters everything and if it's not working normally do to oral use or whatever, you aren't getting the most out of your aas dosage.

I also believe the liver helps convert igf, so if we have elevated liver values, does this make GH not as effective?

Also, does elevated AST and alt mean the liver is not working optimally or just that it is stressed?

 

[luki7788]

I know many people use liver support for overall health reasons, but do you think keeping a healthy liver is key to optimize body composition too?

I can't recall the thread but someone on here mentioned how the liver filters everything and if it's not working normally do to oral use or whatever, you aren't getting the most out of your aas dosage.

I also believe the liver helps convert igf, so if we have elevated liver values, does this make GH not as effective?

Also, does elevated AST and alt mean the liver is not working optimally or just that it is stressed?

I don't know when people will understand that alt and ast are insignificant parameters and that they don't really talk about anything. The training itself can increase alt and ast up to 3x and it will not be disturbing. Eat a fat burger for the night and wash it down with 2 beers and I guarantee that when you go to liver tests in the morning, your alt and ast will be strongly elevated.

If you look at something it's bilirubin, ggtp and alkaline phase, not alt and ast

 

[BIG1512]

I don't know when people will understand that alt and ast are insignificant parameters and that they don't really talk about anything. The training itself can increase alt and ast up to 3x and it will not be disturbing. Eat a fat burger for the night and wash it down with 2 beers and I guarantee that when you go to liver tests in the morning, your alt and ast will be strongly elevated.

If you look at something it's bilirubin, ggtp and alkaline phase, not alt and ast

I agree I get my ast and alt checked every 3 months then ggtp and all that every 6 months.

 

[specter]

I know many people use liver support for overall health reasons, but do you think keeping a healthy liver is key to optimize body composition too?

I can't recall the thread but someone on here mentioned how the liver filters everything and if it's not working normally do to oral use or whatever, you aren't getting the most out of your aas dosage.

I also believe the liver helps convert igf, so if we have elevated liver values, does this make GH not as effective?

Also, does elevated AST and alt mean the liver is not working optimally or just that it is stressed?

As far as i remember the liver is the biggest fatburner in the body and is very important in fat metabolism.

 

[buck]

I think all organs need to be healthy for the body to work efficiently. The liver does a lot form making IFG-1 to acting as a filter etc.

 

[qbkilla]

I don't know when people will understand that alt and ast are insignificant parameters and that they don't really talk about anything. The training itself can increase alt and ast up to 3x and it will not be disturbing. Eat a fat burger for the night and wash it down with 2 beers and I guarantee that when you go to liver tests in the morning, your alt and ast will be strongly elevated.

If you look at something it's bilirubin, ggtp and alkaline phase, not alt and ast

Good info I did not know this. Just from reading threads over the years people focus on alt and ast when do doctors test for the ones you mentioned, in a physical? Or do we likely need to get private bloods?

 

[Gunsmith]

I think that you want the entire body functioning as perfect as possible for best results.
If the body is struggling to heal an ailing body part or organ then it's gonna try to heal that before repairing muscle

Imagine trying to build a race care , in order to get the most out of it all systems need to be working perfectly from the engine , transmission , suspension , everything works in sync to optimize performance.

 

[marssel]

I know many people use liver support for overall health reasons, but do you think keeping a healthy liver is key to optimize body composition too?

I can't recall the thread but someone on here mentioned how the liver filters everything and if it's not working normally do to oral use or whatever, you aren't getting the most out of your aas dosage.

I also believe the liver helps convert igf, so if we have elevated liver values, does this make GH not as effective?

Also, does elevated AST and alt mean the liver is not working optimally or just that it is stressed?

Yes your liver, kidneys and gall bladder are key to lipo genesis as well as muscle growth. A healthy body is leaner and more capable of growing and carrying lean muscle. Yes I believe that at the core your liver is they key. Yes liver values will go up and down based on training and other little things but if you went the rest of your life without alcohol you’d be better off. As a Marine I drank like a fish, was in optimal triathlon for fun shape but drank a lot, cut back when I got into competing and felt better. Quit for fertility for 3 years, we are due anyday so last weekend of deer season I had a few Coors at a lease I’m trying to get on, just to be social, they all drink like fish. 4 beers I felt it for days, there’s a reason I don’t drink and it isn’t morality. Will I drink again, of course but rarely it’s just too hard on the body and as related to this the liver.

 

[Biggerp73]

there’s a reason I don’t drink and it isn’t morality.

Alcohol can be immoral, but it can also be a gift from God. Depends on how you use it - within reason, or to excess.


"27 Wine can put new life into you if you drink it in moderation. What would life be like without it? Wine was created to make us happy. 28 If you drink it in moderation and at the right time, it can lift your spirits and make you cheerful, 29 but if you drink when you are angry and upset, it leads to headaches, embarrassment, and disgrace. 30 A drunken fool can lose his temper and hurt himself. His drinking makes him weak and an easy target for angry blows. 31 Never rebuke a person when you have both been drinking. Don't hurt his feelings while he is having a good time. It's not the time to criticize anyone, or to ask him to pay back a debt."

Ben Sira 31:27‭-‬31

 

[MasteroniPepperoni]

The liver also plays a role in estrogen regulation. People always say the "the liver can take a beating" and put it under the kidneys and heart for importance. They forget a healthy liver can optimally detox toxins putting less strain on kidneys and liver also regulates cholesterol. Decreased bile production increases cholesterol I believe. Also glucose storage/release . I'd say if liver is stressed, body composition will take a hit negatively.

 

[MasteroniPepperoni]

The Liver is a shield . Once you damage that shield to the point where it has enough cracks , you won't be as protected. Once the shield is completely broken, you're done lol.

 

[jaxino]

I know many people use liver support for overall health reasons, but do you think keeping a healthy liver is key to optimize body composition too?

I can't recall the thread but someone on here mentioned how the liver filters everything and if it's not working normally do to oral use or whatever, you aren't getting the most out of your aas dosage.

I also believe the liver helps convert igf, so if we have elevated liver values, does this make GH not as effective?

Also, does elevated AST and alt mean the liver is not working optimally or just that it is stressed?

A friend of mine used 50mg Winstrol for 20 weeks straight.

I have used Winstrol at 100mg for 10 weeks straight.

None of us used TAD or NAC or whatever for liver.

We both did bloods for AST, ALT, BILIRUBINE, GGT, ALKALINO FOSFATASE, we both did bloods after 1 week without training, and the only value a bit off was ALKALINO FOSFATASE.
Kidney values were in line too.

Oral aas are not so "toxic" like people think.

Mate stop listening to bro scientists and do your own tries instead.


The key for body composition is only one: DIET.

 

[marssel]

A friend of mine used 50mg Winstrol for 20 weeks straight.

I have used Winstrol at 100mg for 10 weeks straight.

None of us used TAD or NAC or whatever for liver.

We both did bloods for AST, ALT, BILIRUBINE, GGT, ALKALINO FOSFATASE, we both did bloods after 1 week without training, and the only value a bit off was ALKALINO FOSFATASE.
Kidney values were in line too.

Oral aas are not so "toxic" like people think.

Mate stop listening to bro scientists and do your own tries instead.


The key for body composition is only one: DIET.

Diet, cardio, and water intake

 

[qbkilla]

Diet, cardio, and water intake

Cardio being the one most neglected by many

 

[ripriot]

I wouldn’t pay any attention to AST. Elevated levels of AST indicates there MAY be liver damage.

Unlike ALT, where elevated levels in the blood indicates there is active liver damage.

If you read some of the studies about AAS users being treated for AAS induced liver damage, they rarely use AST but do use ALT. They use more of the test luki said in addition to other test.

Androgenic Steroids - LiverTox - NCBI Bookshelf

 

[buck]

I had elevated liver levels for years but no Dr' really cared. Without other tests showing negative results or outrageously high levels they are just a marker to watch.

 

[heavyhitter]

Just listened to a podcast with Dr. Ken Berry and he stated the same thing. He also made a point that I’d never thought of. These values that were using to find these “healthy” ranges for alt, ast, cholesterol, etc. are created by averaging out bloodwork on a large scale. Well, who is more likely to get bloodwork done? Healthy people, or sick people? So we’re basing these things off the test results if sick people. We now know dietary saturated fat doesn’t affect blood levels, but that sugars and industrial seed oils are actually the main contributor to increased blood cholesterol. But now, we also know too that high cholesterol isn’t an indicator of poor health, what we should be looking at more is particle size, etc.

I had elevated liver levels for years but no Dr' really cared. Without other tests showing negative results or outrageously high levels they are just a marker to watch.

 

[TheOtherOne55]

Body composition? No.
We know this because Bodybuilders look great, yet can have some liver problems.
(although i believe liver health is greatly exaggerated in BBing)
So we kinda already know the answer to this thread.

But does having a healthy liver translate to having an overall HEALTHIER BODY? Yes.
Does a healthy body mean good body composition? No.
We already know all the answers here.

 

[qbkilla]

Body composition? No.
We know this because Bodybuilders look great, yet can have some liver problems.
(although i believe liver health is greatly exaggerated in BBing)
So we kinda already know the answer to this thread.

But does having a healthy liver translate to having an overall HEALTHIER BODY? Yes.
Does a healthy body mean good body composition? No.
We already know all the answers here.

I was thinking more along the lines of someone using moderate dosages, therefore they can only get so much from AAS

Say Joe wont go above 400mg. He will grow based on his dosage and food intake. But if he choses drugs that are easier on his liver and adds In liver support, would he look better on 400mg than had he chose harsher drugs (to the liver) and not used support?

 

[luki7788]

I was thinking more along the lines of someone using moderate dosages, therefore they can only get so much from AAS

Say Joe wont go above 400mg. He will grow based on his dosage and food intake. But if he choses drugs that are easier on his liver and adds In liver support, would he look better on 400mg than had he chose harsher drugs (to the liver) and not used support?

No, look at the condition of the organs, including Dallas's liver, and it looked phenomenal from the outside