is bulking a waste of time being natural?

[thebigguy84]

using a picture of the best in the sport is not helping your argument, and considering he fucked grapefruits from the get go makes him being natural in that pic even more false.. though you do make a point nonetheless.

how do i go from underdeveloped to where i want? actually considering hiring a coach... maybe phil

Yes a coach is a great decision......Have you looked at some of Shelby's Natural competitors very impressive IMO I am almost done with my first year with Shelby and have been nothing but pleased No I am not a natty but the difference in having a good coach is night and day.Very Wise Investment.

 

[Kkv]

Fuck it, imma do it the way the purply guy is saying.

No more fast food for macros.

 

[Bronstonian]

I'm not worried so much about his demise as that could have been a combination of things. However every video I have seen of him, he looked ripped but very skinny. I'd be surprised if he was ever 215 at 8% BF. That would mean that he could hang with some of the best 212s out there and we know that's just an improbable comparison unless Zyzz was 6'10''.

he was 6'1" 215 in the months before his death.

most of the "famous" pics of him are around 195-200 pounds from a year or 2 before he died.

he put on 75 pounds of muscle in 3 years while being a true ecto. pretty sure he was doing it right.

but heart conditions and shitty bangkok rec drugs dont mix.

 

[maldorf]

he was 6'1" 215 in the months before his death.

most of the "famous" pics of him are around 195-200 pounds from a year or 2 before he died.

he put on 75 pounds of muscle in 3 years while being a true ecto. pretty sure he was doing it right.

but heart conditions and shitty bangkok rec drugs dont mix.

I have personally read some posts by him on some of the muscle sites about his drug steroid use and he was asking for advice. This was back when he was posting it, I had no idea who he was.

 

[thatbloke]

if anyone actually wants to know what zyzz's drug protcol was, both roids and narcs jus PM me,
i and a few friends knew him personally before his death, and happen to speak to the last person who saw zyzz the day before he died (who was also in the pharmacy in thailand when he bought his drugs/anabolics) , most of the none sense you read on the net is utter bullshit

zyzz was a party animal yes, but he wasnt some outa of the ordinary drug abuser, he prob has done what most people on this forum have, but was just unlucky

 

[maldorf]

if anyone actually wants to know what zyzz's drug protcol was, both roids and narcs jus PM me,
i and a few friends knew him personally before his death, and happen to speak to the last person who saw zyzz the day before he died (who was also in the pharmacy in thailand when he bought his drugs/anabolics) , most of the none sense you read on the net is utter bullshit

zyzz was a party animal yes, but he wasnt some outa of the ordinary drug abuser, he prob has done what most people on this forum have, but was just unlucky

Do you know what killed him exactly? Was it bad tachycardia that went into v fib and then ended in cardiac arrest? Being in the hot tub didn't help any for sure. Sounds like he may have died from an arrhythmia, or did he have a clot I wonder?

 

[thatbloke]

Do you know what killed him exactly? Was it bad tachycardia that went into v fib and then ended in cardiac arrest? Being in the hot tub didn't help any for sure. Sounds like he may have died from an arrhythmia, or did he have a clot I wonder?

i dont think anyone knows exactly other then his family, and i know they wont discuss it due to the speculation and conspiracy that emerge from discussing zyzz's death becoz of his unconfirmed drug usage

everyone knows he suffered a heart attack, if people wanna know what probably caused it, zyzz was on a substantial amount of tren/winstrol and clenbuteral, and other stimulants while in pattaya before he went to bangkok where he continued to use them, and yes he did have a congenital heart defect

but its almost certain the heart arrhythmia was a conspiracy becoz he complained of chest pains, but mind you he experienced these while using clen and T3, a very comman side effect of them, a clot cant be ruled out but i dont believe it to be since he had no history of such a thing

thats what i do know

to be real, zyzz drug usage and AAS usage wasnt anything out of the ordinary for the usual rec gear user and rec drug users you probably see and hear of,
but like everything there are those who can get away with it, and those that cant, zyzz was one who genetically couldn't, he wasnt some massive drug abusing, steroid abusing addict like people make him out to be, yes he used but it wasnt a quantity that made him more likely to suffer a health problem,

so the whole idea or people making him the poster boy for rec drug and gear abuse is nonesense, he didnt use anymore and prob less then most partying teens do, but sadly he was unlucky, so people justifying 'it wont happen to me coz i dont abuse like zyzz' are jus justifying there bullshit by making up lies, what happen to him could happen to almost anyone who chooses to use roids and rec drugs regularly

its sad coz there's guys using more gear/drugs on thism forum then him, but then claiming hes an abuser and making themselves believe it wont happen to me LOL, but i guess anyone who uses or abuses AAS will make an excuse to justify there usage, i wish people would jus accept they abuse and stop trying to justify it but using others for example

 

[zachbean79]

Remember it is possible(very possible) to look like complete garbage while on gear if diet and training arent addressed. Like others have said, you need to focus on training and diet. While I realize many here don't think you can acquire a look like zyzz naturaly, I know better.

But to acquire a similar look naturally will take a serious amount of commitment to your diet.

Take pride in the hard work and effort your going to put into achieving your goal. You will develope strength of character along with self confidence.

I wish luck friend

 

[AshopRep]

Remember it is possible(very possible) to look like complete garbage while on gear if diet and training arent addressed. Like others have said, you need to focus on training and diet. While I realize many here don't think you can acquire a look like zyzz naturaly, I know better.

But to acquire a similar look naturally will take a serious amount of commitment to your diet.
Take pride in the hard work and effort your going to put into achieving your goal. You will develope strength of character along with self confidence.

I wish luck friend

It's rare if ever you will see someone 215lbs shredded, while being a natty.

 

[Buttman3]

Remember it is possible(very possible) to look like complete garbage while on gear if diet and training arent addressed.

Mate, I have to disagree with you on this. Now, I don't know what you mean by "look like complete garbage". Do you mean looking skinny or fat?

I know for a fact that when I was on Tren (finaplix) and my dose was around 50mg EoD (3x a week for a total of 150mg), my body fat was significantly reduced to the point where my abs were visible without changing my diet or my training.

Don't get me wrong mate, with proper training and diet, one can maximize gains while on gear.

Like others have said, you need to focus on training and diet. While I realize many here don't think you can acquire a look like zyzz naturaly, I know better.

To attain Zyzz's look as a natural, one must have great genetics. Zyzz himself has shit genetics, as many other people out there including myself, and it's impossible for Zyzz or people like him to look like that naturally.

But to acquire a similar look naturally will take a serious amount of commitment to your diet.

From what I have seen, genetics play a much bigger role than diet. I have a friend whose brother is a lazy ass. Back when I was a natural, we'd train for at least an hour, 3 or 4 times a week. The lazy brother hit the gym no more than 15 min, twice a week, max. He was much bigger and more shredded than we were. And I'm quite certain the guy didn't juice, because he lived in a small place with a big family, and there was no place for him to hide his stuffs. Plus, the guy did not seem like he care about getting big and wasn't into bodybuilding at all.

 

[wukillabee]

Damn I jumped on this thread late. Not sure how Zyzz, bulking, and natural would even been in the same thread let alone the same sentence, lol! When I see or think of Zyzz's physique the last thing that comes to mind is bulking. Great aesthetic look he had similar to Frank Zane.

Sent from my HTC One X+ using Tapatalk 2

 

[wukillabee]

MY biggest pet peeves in the sport.

a) Guys so unhappy with themselves that they blame everyone and every other thing for their unhappiness

b) They found out drugs work. Really? Were you that much of a freaking idiot before and didn't think they did? Everyone else knew they worked. How did you miss the boat? So now they think anything told to them pre-drugs means that they were told a bunch of bullshit. Want to make a fire? here is some dry straw and some kindling......oh Frankie poured some gas on that fire and its a huge fireball so now dry straw and kindling is a bunch of bullshit......(whatever)

Here is some truth for you

Drugs work.

Drugs with incredibly thought out progressive training and incredibly thought out nutrition work even better than just drugs by themselves.

If you don't do drugs, incredibly thought out progressive training and incredibly thought out nutrition are the best tools you have over the guy who also doesn't use drugs and trains and eats like crap.

Since you don't seem to read thoroughly and take blanket statements as pertaining to you.....if you cared to read the details I have recommended naturals take in 1.5 grams of protein. Do you really think I make any money off of you if you take in 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight per day.....Eat that amount....I don't care how you take it in. It sure doesn't have to be protein powder and it sure as hell doesn't need to be protein powder from True Nutrition. IN fact I request it after seeing your post here. Don't ever buy protein powder from my company. If you are going to use it, buy it from some other company, place or entity. There that should take care of that problem.

You are skinny fat...I get it...you are unhappy and looking for someone to blame for your unhappiness. I was skinny fat too....I was a paltry 137 at 19-20 years old at 6 foot 1.....instead of being like you and blaming others for my unhappiness.....I read and read and read and studied and studied and studied and GOT IT DONE.

Here are my suggestions:

Please don't do my methods (not that you were doing them anyway correctly)....you are not the guy they are made for.

Stop with the conspiracy theories and figure out a way to get to where you want to be within your personal limits......10 hard sets in the squat rack is a lot better way of getting there then bitching online.

You have 4 things that make you muscularly big (in which you can then turn into "lean and big")

1) genetics (which you were not handed the best)
2) drugs (which is a personal choice)
3) training (and im talking progressive rapid muscle mass accumulation mode)
4) nutrition (putting yourself in the most anabolic state nutritionally you can)

If you don't have 1 and you aren't doing 2 YOU BETTER SURE AS HELL have your gameplan dialed in with 3 and 4

Your best advice is right here. But being a naive kid who doesn't want to do the hard work to get the "look" he wants thinks drugs are the shortcut. So say u take the drugs for 2yrs, still don't get to where u want to be since u refuse to educate yourself in this field, u then give up, quit the drugs, now look worse then when u started, probably stop working out all together, now have a messed up endocrine system u have to live with.

Ur life, ur choices but if ur coming here for help and advice then u should listen and soak it in and not make excuses for yourself to only set urself up for further failure.

Sent from my HTC One X+ using Tapatalk 2

 

[supermonsterp]

Damn. Some this stuff is funny, some tragic. To sum it all up, learn about diet first, then learn about how to lift, then learn about gear, then make a decision, in that order, respectively.

 

[maldorf]

Damn. Some this stuff is funny, some tragic. To sum it all up, learn about diet first, then learn about how to lift, then learn about gear, then make a decision, in that order, respectively.

I would say that diet is the most difficult component to learn about yourself and takes the longest to perfect.

 

[zachbean79]

It's rare if ever you will see someone 215lbs shredded, while being a natty.

I have pics on this board of me.......not quite as shredded as zyzz but natural(honestly i think i look bigger than zyzz).
people always chase size and try to get "bigger" cause then they think they will look big. you need to get LEAN!!!

I think the pics i put up were me at like 208. people always think i'm juiced when i diet down to like 8%......hahaha i'm like 205 at 6'3

 

[zachbean79]

Mate, I have to disagree with you on this. Now, I don't know what you mean by "look like complete garbage". Do you mean looking skinny or fat?

I know for a fact that when I was on Tren (finaplix) and my dose was around 50mg EoD (3x a week for a total of 150mg), my body fat was significantly reduced to the point where my abs were visible without changing my diet or my training.

Don't get me wrong mate, with proper training and diet, one can maximize gains while on gear.



To attain Zyzz's look as a natural, one must have great genetics. Zyzz himself has shit genetics, as many other people out there including myself, and it's impossible for Zyzz or people like him to look like that naturally.



From what I have seen, genetics play a much bigger role than diet. I have a friend whose brother is a lazy ass. Back when I was a natural, we'd train for at least an hour, 3 or 4 times a week. The lazy brother hit the gym no more than 15 min, twice a week, max. He was much bigger and more shredded than we were. And I'm quite certain the guy didn't juice, because he lived in a small place with a big family, and there was no place for him to hide his stuffs. Plus, the guy did not seem like he care about getting big and wasn't into bodybuilding at all.

hey bro

good questions. I really think you , along with many others on this board, just don't really want it bad enough. Cause you know what? self deprivation is not fun. denying yourself of things that everyone else eats and drinks isn't easy.

but when you achieve your goal because YOU put the work in....you will feel a sense of real accomplishment. stop listening to what everyone says you can and can't do as a natural.

 

[zachbean79]

here me at like 208(at the most) i'm 6'3
legs match the physique in a golden era kind of way(means they are smallish lol)

 

[zachbean79]

Vince gironda use to say that looking like a bodybuilder is 85% diet...........
now people seem to think it's 85% steroids.

 

[Elvia1023]

I have pics on this board of me.......not quite as shredded as zyzz but natural(honestly i think i look bigger than zyzz).
people always chase size and try to get "bigger" cause then they think they will look big. you need to get LEAN!!!

I think the pics i put up were me at like 208. people always think i'm juiced when i diet down to like 8%......hahaha i'm like 205 at 6'3

You could easily be natural with good genetics and a good program going. Although your not natural cos I recall you have mentioned using pro hormones a few times. Didn't you use hdrol or mdol and put on a lot of weight once?

Prohormones = not natural

 

[sma]

TBH My biggest regret is dieting down naturally that is when I should of started my first cycle. I think steroids are most efficient while trying to hold mass on a diet... That is what Ive learned and ive ran enough aas to know this is true