Is it just me or young guys dont gain like the vets do on first cycles

[chris250]

I dont know if im way off base here. But, it seems like a newbie's are gaining only 10-15lbs off a first or second time cycle, and then only keep a few pounds once on PCT. I dont know if gear back in the early 90's was better or what (honestly I dont think so, becasue there is some great UG out there right now, but yes lots of fakes and low dose crap) But when I was a kid, my first cycle I did Omaradren 250mg E5D, 50mg anadrol (real american syntex)and after only 10 weeks, I was up 28lbs and kept 20lbs of it after PCT. It wasnt just me, my buddies did the the same or simular cycle, and all gained over 20lbs on the cycle. Now newbie's seem to be having a hard time gaining 10lbs on a cycle, and keeping hardly any of it, post PCT. I guess, us old time vets just ate, and trained harder and better, or what...but just doesnt seem to add up....

is this correct or im way off base

 

[Medic08]

My take on it is that the "vets" have their diet/training more in check vs. the "newbs." You've got all these highschool kids running cycles and only eating 2-3 x's a day. And what they do eat is no where near what they should be eating. So they grow just BC of the hormones alone, but when they come off their Marcos are only a fraction of what they should be so it doesn't support the new muscle that they gained....

I'm no expert, but that's my take.

 

[Elvia1023]

I talk to alot of newbies taking things in my gym (open over here) and they all pretty much gain alot of weight in their first 2 cycles. Although there are also alot of fakes now so the opposite is true too. It tends to be nothing or lots of gains from what I see (fake/real gear).

I think alot of it is alot of newbies lie... especially on here. They do their cycles but write like they just started aas that week but in reality are on their 2nd cycle.

But one thing we do see all the time is alot of guys eat next to nothing and take gear so don't put on much weight. Although in my experience anyone who takes legit dbol/adrol can eat a crap diet and still put on alot of weight but due to that poor diets lose all the weight they gained. Alot of newbies think adding a protein shake to their existing 3 meals a day from their mum is all they need to do.

I wasn't around years ago but I will say I think many would be surprised just how crap alot of the gear going around is. Find a good source and stick with them and hope they stay in business

 

[SL1CED]

I dont know if im way off base here. But, it seems like a newbie's are gaining only 10-15lbs off a first or second time cycle, and then only keep a few pounds once on PCT. I dont know if gear back in the early 90's was better or what (honestly I dont think so, becasue there is some great UG out there right now, but yes lots of fakes and low dose crap) But when I was a kid, my first cycle I did Omaradren 250mg E5D, 50mg anadrol (real american syntex)and after only 10 weeks, I was up 28lbs and kept 20lbs of it after PCT. It wasnt just me, my buddies did the the same or simular cycle, and all gained over 20lbs on the cycle. Now newbie's seem to be having a hard time gaining 10lbs on a cycle, and keeping hardly any of it, post PCT. I guess, us old time vets just ate, and trained harder and better, or what...but just doesnt seem to add up....

is this correct or im way off base

Old vets didn't train harder or eat smarter. If anything there's more scientific studies, more trainers, more accessibility now to helping with training AND dieting.

The difference is the quality of gear, plain and simple. Secondarily, estrogenic enviromental issues which I believe would have some indiication on diminishing androgen receptors but that's marginally. It's the gear.

 

[trance22]

My take on it is that the "vets" have their diet/training more in check vs. the "newbs." You've got all these highschool kids running cycles and only eating 2-3 x's a day. And what they do eat is no where near what they should be eating. So they grow just BC of the hormones alone, but when they come off their Marcos are only a fraction of what they should be so it doesn't support the new muscle that they gained....

I'm no expert, but that's my take.

sounds about right

 

[klowndog]

Good question.

Scientifically it seems like the variables would be the dedication levels and the routines and supps of the test subjects, because obviously the human body hasn't changed in the last 20 yrs, and the chemicals of bodybuilding and muscles have not changed either. Maybe the earth has tilkted a little on its axis and iron is a little lighter now, pound for pound, than it was 20 years ago?

Work ethics?

 

[Elvia1023]

Old vets didn't train harder or eat smarter. If anything there's more scientific studies, more trainers, more accessibility now to helping with training AND dieting.

The difference is the quality of gear, plain and simple. Secondarily, estrogenic enviromental issues which I believe would have some indiication on diminishing androgen receptors but that's marginally. It's the gear.

I see merit in both sides in some ways. But yes I find it amusing when some think everyone their day trained harder etc. I see alot of young guys in the gym and they are pushing it. I have been to about 6 different local gyms in the last year and in everyone I see young guys deadlifting alot of weight and generally training hard.

There is much more knowledge available these days so many follow decent diets/training programs. I can imagine many of the young ones here in 30 years saying how they trained harder than the youth of the future

Every decade has it's hardcore bb's and guys wondering why they aren't growing on 2.5K cals per day

 

[jm425]

Old vets didn't train harder or eat smarter. If anything there's more scientific studies, more trainers, more accessibility now to helping with training AND dieting.

The difference is the quality of gear, plain and simple. Secondarily, estrogenic enviromental issues which I believe would have some indiication on diminishing androgen receptors but that's marginally. It's the gear.

Actually a lot of old vets that trained natty for years on end and then jumped on a cycle did train harder and diet better back in the day compared to the kids nowadays who have maybe 1-2 years tops in the gym, don't push themselves hard enough and eat like shit everyday. This is probably why guys back in the day would gain a lot more muscle on cycles and keep more of it after pct. A lot young guys nowadays think that aas is some magic pill that will blow them up with little work in the gym and eating junk food on a daily basis. Quality of gear has something to do with it, but not as much as what I have mentioned.

 

[jm425]

I see merit in both sides in some ways. But yes I find it amusing when some think everyone their day trained harder etc. I see alot of young guys in the gym and they are pushing it. I have been to about 6 different local gyms in the last year and in everyone I see young guys deadlifting alot of weight and generally training hard.

There is much more knowledge available these days so many go follow decent diets/training programs. I can imagine many of the young ones here in 30 years saying how they trained harder than the youth of the future

Your gym must be hardcore then bro. Most of the guys in my gym won't even deadlift or squat even though they are young and healthy. The work ethic for them is poor as well. A few sets of this, a few sets of that, abs everyday stuck at the same weights year in and out, and then they are done.

 

[Elvia1023]

Actually a lot of old vets that trained natty for years on end and then jumped on a cycle did train harder and diet better back in the day compared to the kids nowadays who have maybe 1-2 years tops in the gym, don't push themselves hard enough and eat like shit everyday. This is probably why guys back in the day would gain a lot more muscle on cycles and keep more of it after pct. A lot young guys nowadays think that aas is some magic pill that will blow them up with little work in the gym and eating junk food on a daily basis. Quality of gear has something to do with it, but not as much as what I have mentioned.

I also agree with this in many ways. Drugs are more accessible now so it's common sense more people will jump on them sooner. They do this before building a decent foundation. Furthermore the number of weightlifters is increasing all the time. You could say there is a lower work ethic for a large share of the youth of today too. But generally I think people are too harsh on the newbies of today. You see a pill that can put 20 pounds on you in 3 weeks and you can buy it for next to nothing and it is advertised all over... can't blame them. Any generation would be the same if they had the accessibility to aas as they do today.

Gear is 'watered down' alot these days... again find a good source and stick with them and hope for the best

 

[Elvia1023]

Your gym must be hardcore then bro. Most of the guys in my gym won't even deadlift or squat even though they are young and healthy. The work ethic for them is poor as well. A few sets of this, a few sets of that, abs everyday stuck at the same weights year in and out, and then they are done.

My current gym is a very commerical and cheap but yeah in the uk they push it... probably too much. I do advise to lower the weight can alot cos it is an injury waiting to happen. But their form is good 90% of the time and they go for it. Alot of them are stick thin but lifting double their body weight. Never been to the US so couldn't comment. I think it is a natural for males to push it though in the gym so I would expect the same all over.

 

[red5150]

Old vets didn't train harder or eat smarter. If anything there's more scientific studies, more trainers, more accessibility now to helping with training AND dieting.

The difference is the quality of gear, plain and simple. Secondarily, estrogenic enviromental issues which I believe would have some indiication on diminishing androgen receptors but that's marginally. It's the gear.

it wasn't all gear. gear was faked more then than now, it was dosed much lower, the only source check was Bill Phillips ref guide, prices were crazy paying $15-20 per amp, $100-$150 for a bottle of test, $1-$4 a tab for dbol,drol, winny, growth HA HA you had to sell your car or slave yourself to indentured gay servitude to get it if you were lucky enough to find it.

guys didnt pick up training and hop on gear right away or after 3 months into training . now i'm not one of these train to your body is maximized or training 15 years natty "hypocrites", but now I know to many guys who only train hard hell even consistant or eat semi decent when on.

 

[buck]

i think it is much like the rest of american culture. the "i want it know" syndrome. I trained for years before cycling. i know of many that train a while and decide they want to be huge and do roids to get there. when they don't they ask me what to take or how to train. and i ask them "what did you have for breakfast"? and how much protein and what their macro's look like and they don't have a clue. and they do isolation movements like mad to get big cause they don't want to do what is uncomfortable.

 

[Ulamalop]

I remember my first cycle as being my best. Of course, I'm 46 now, and the body doesn't do anything like it did when I was a teenager. Just today, I was in the grocery store, and some good looking chick was in front of me, wearing black tights under a pink sweater dress, and when she bent over to get something from the bottom shelf I got a full on view of a sweet little peach of an ass. teenage me would have popped a boner, 46 year old me said, "um, excuse me" as I reached over her for some natty peanut butter.

 

[Pharm_Fed]

Maybe a better question is who honestly believes that you can put on 20+ pounds of quality muscle in 10 weeks?

Obviously some is water, fat, blood, glycogen...so it could go two ways. Maybe the guys gaining less scale weight now are using all the resources to train and eat smarter and only gaining quality weight so even though the number is lower the amount of muscle gained is the same.

Conversely, there is SL1CED's argument which I concede is absolutely true, many UGL these days have, at the very least, underdosed product...if it's even legit.

 

[BushMan]

I went from 180-210 on my first cycle. Got sick during PCT (flu) and dropped down to 195 but went right back up to 202ish once I could stomach food again... Some of that 30 pounds may have been a little fat i started at a 4% BF, ended around 10

Edit: my cycle was 500mg test C for 13 weeks from a sponsor here. PCT was hCG, aroma, nolva

 

[method2madness]

I'm 37 yrs. old now and I started training when I was 13; yes 13 years old. I did one cycle of omnadrens when I was 18 and then trained clean until the age of 30. Every cycle I've done since then I've kept most of the weight, losing only 10-20% when coming off. I attribute this to a solid base of training, recovery ability and years of steady eating. It takes years to keep any significant amount of gains, whether or not you use AAS or train clean.

 

[Petergozinya]

I gained 22 lbs on 250 mgs of Mexican sus in 10 weeks....no pct. that was 15 years ago. When you are young...you are nowhere near you genetic potential, but I feel once you get near what you body can comfortably hold then it starts to become tougher and tougher to gain quality size.

Upping doses, eating more quality food and training intensity is the next step. You will eventually level out unless you are a very good responder to gear I.e. PROS.

My 2 cents

 

[jay_dub]

I dont know if im way off base here. But, it seems like a newbie's are gaining only 10-15lbs off a first or second time cycle, and then only keep a few pounds once on PCT. I dont know if gear back in the early 90's was better or what (honestly I dont think so, becasue there is some great UG out there right now, but yes lots of fakes and low dose crap) But when I was a kid, my first cycle I did Omaradren 250mg E5D, 50mg anadrol (real american syntex)and after only 10 weeks, I was up 28lbs and kept 20lbs of it after PCT. It wasnt just me, my buddies did the the same or simular cycle, and all gained over 20lbs on the cycle. Now newbie's seem to be having a hard time gaining 10lbs on a cycle, and keeping hardly any of it, post PCT. I guess, us old time vets just ate, and trained harder and better, or what...but just doesnt seem to add up....

is this correct or im way off base

I think it comes down to shitty gear and shitty work ethic.

I've talked to plenty of guys my age(25 and under) getting bunk ass shit and just dont have the experience to know what the good stuff is really like. Of course there's also plenty of guys that just don't know shit about training and eating either.

I laugh when guys talk about gaining 15 lbs their first cycle, wtf?? I gained a good 30-35 solid lbs my first 14 week run on 500mg test (British dragon). Tons of water weight but barely any fat at all.

 

[blowndefuser]

I dont know if im way off base here. But, it seems like a newbie's are gaining only 10-15lbs off a first or second time cycle, and then only keep a few pounds once on PCT. I dont know if gear back in the early 90's was better or what (honestly I dont think so, becasue there is some great UG out there right now, but yes lots of fakes and low dose crap) But when I was a kid, my first cycle I did Omaradren 250mg E5D, 50mg anadrol (real american syntex)and after only 10 weeks, I was up 28lbs and kept 20lbs of it after PCT. It wasnt just me, my buddies did the the same or simular cycle, and all gained over 20lbs on the cycle. Now newbie's seem to be having a hard time gaining 10lbs on a cycle, and keeping hardly any of it, post PCT. I guess, us old time vets just ate, and trained harder and better, or what...but just doesnt seem to add up....

is this correct or im way off base

I would bet you're right. Think about how pure coke was in the 80's compared to the crap you get now. I'm no base head or anything but you hear stuff