Is it really cheating?????? Your Thoughts

[KillerStack]

tHANK YOU... your only suppose to have 3 cortisone shots your whole life... Cortisone never leaves your body... was told by a triner... correct me if im wrong...

I don't think that's the reason. It leaves the body. I suspect the reason they only do a few shots in a particular area is that it weakens the tissues. A sports medicine doctor told me he only uses it in the shoulders, too much of a risk for tendon rupture if used elsewhere.

Didn't Dorian get a shot in his elbow before he tore the tricep?

 

[buselmo]

I see a lot of double standards here...

if sports rules say it's not ok... then it's cheating
what if the government says it's not ok... ? are you cheating yourself out of jail time?

i don't mean this in an offensive way... and it's retarded that the american government bans this shit... but i'm just trying to make a point to those who say it's cheating...

to me, it's not cheating at all... you are a cheater IF YOU GET CAUGHT! because it's a fucking leveled field and everyone is using the same shit... you don't use? you get left out and fucking lose.

 

[ItalianStalion9]

definietly cheating if its against the rules if its tested for like baseball. but not for IFBB.

people are worried about steroids in nascar i read somewhere thats funny you can only push a pedal so hard. then again i wouldnt call that a sport

 

[zman12]

I will say this that when McGwire, Sosa, and Bonds were taking PED it was not tested for in MLB so you can't be cheating if something is not tested for. Now after they started the testing process you can say it is or not cheating because I belive there is always going to be people that are going to beat the test and some will get caught. MLB knew that Sosa and McGwire was juicing they had just come off strike and needed the fans back after they got back to making money they just threw all those guys under the bus thats what I think is wrong when the sport was struggling they were great now that its not they are calling them all cheats. Then they don't want to put them in the Hall of Fame who really know when they started taking them in baseball it could have been for years but some of them will make it in because they are not tied to it. This just my opinion though.

 

[Steve123]

Man, I remember once upon a time, the only people who used AAS were Football player, bodybuilders and Powerlifters and some Olympic athletes. Today we have NASCAR drivers and golfers thinking they need gear!!! WTF.

Simply put, the term "Natural" is so loose now that beleive it to be a complete fucking joke. Some of these top "Natural" guys in the WNBF, IFPA etc., in many cases, are completely full of shit and should be not only ashamed of themselves but exposed publicly for the fakes they really are. There are a couple, who will go unmentioned, who I know for a fact run cycles.

I don't care about gear use but don't call yourself Natural and don't compete in a natural organization unless you're willing to hand that trophy to the guy who took second place. Meaning, I don't even care if a guy does the contest for fun. Just don't accept an award because the guy who actually won is standing there holding the second place trophy when he should be holding the first place one.

 

[Wingnut32]

A bit OT but

I will say this that when McGwire, Sosa, and Bonds were taking PED it was not tested for in MLB so you can't be cheating if something is not tested for. Now after they started the testing process you can say it is or not cheating because I belive there is always going to be people that are going to beat the test and some will get caught. MLB knew that Sosa and McGwire was juicing they had just come off strike and needed the fans back after they got back to making money they just threw all those guys under the bus thats what I think is wrong when the sport was struggling they were great now that its not they are calling them all cheats. Then they don't want to put them in the Hall of Fame who really know when they started taking them in baseball it could have been for years but some of them will make it in because they are not tied to it. This just my opinion though.

To answer your question in the 60's. That just makes the whole Bonds and McGwire are the devil talk even more of a joke.

USATODAY.com - Former pitcher Tom House describes past steroid use

 

[liftalot79]

Well then..........

"We didn't get beat, we got out-milligrammed," he said. "And when you found out what they were taking, you started taking them."

Aint that the truth!

I know everybody reacts to different esters but if one of my friends ask me for a Special blend and has good results I might throw it into my Cycle.

 

[fireazm]

hmm

I love everyones take on this. So another question. How many of the WWE superstars do you think are on steroids?

John Cena? hmm maybe but that kid has always been big and into football ect

Triple H... probally
Randy Orton... hmm maybe but hes not crazy jacked
Sheamus... probally
Undertaker... ehh dont know
Edge... na
Batista... probally
Big Poppa Pump... lol ummm yep


So who do you think is juicing in the WWE.

 

[richiec]

Of course Lance has used PEDs. There is zero doubt.

Long but interesting interview with a doping expert regarding Lance:

**broken link removed**

So when did he fail a drug test?

Did Bonds fail a test?

Everyone seems to be "in the know" but these guys continually pass drug tests, that's amazing to me with the amount of drugs "they're obviously taking". It's all hear-say bs that people keep building on. We've become the country of guilty until proven innocent. Armstrong, Bonds, and every other athlete has to prove their innocence? Screw that

(by the way, I definitely think Bonds used, but there are no positive tests to back it up, so there is no proof)

 

[dropshot001]

So when did he fail a drug test?

Did Bonds fail a test?

Everyone seems to be "in the know" but these guys continually pass drug tests, that's amazing to me with the amount of drugs "they're obviously taking". It's all hear-say bs that people keep building on. We've become the country of guilty until proven innocent. Armstrong, Bonds, and every other athlete has to prove their innocence? Screw that

(by the way, I definitely think Bonds used, but there are no positive tests to back it up, so there is no proof)

bonds was working with conte for a while and conte is the one who always is talking about how these tests are an IQ test. i'm pretty sure that a guy like conte who created new drugs himself can also advise athletes on how to beat the test as well.

 

[superman18]

I dont think its cheating. The whole point of these competitions is to see how far you can push a human body. With todays advancement in technology why not use substances that will make even the most genetically gifted look like beginners. Would you rather have a skinny police officer protecting you or a roid infused power house? Same logic in sports.

 

[Johnny Smiles]

This thread is almost pointless.
IF ITS AGAINST THE RULES ITS CHEATING.
thread over now.
-JS

 

[richiec]

bonds was working with conte for a while and conte is the one who always is talking about how these tests are an IQ test. i'm pretty sure that a guy like conte who created new drugs himself can also advise athletes on how to beat the test as well.

well I played pro ball and there is no way around a blood test, and yes they blood test. you can advise someone to take something to clear up their piss, I don't think you can do the same for blood though, I maybe wrong.

your argument is "guilt by association". just because he worked with him means he must have used them. well, it worked for congress...lmao

I agree with JS, if it's against the rules it's cheating. when a lot of the baseball players were using, they weren't against the rules as weight lifting was still taboo in the sport up until the past decade or so.

 

[jogates]

So when did he fail a drug test?

Did Bonds fail a test?

Everyone seems to be "in the know" but these guys continually pass drug tests, that's amazing to me with the amount of drugs "they're obviously taking". It's all hear-say bs that people keep building on. We've become the country of guilty until proven innocent. Armstrong, Bonds, and every other athlete has to prove their innocence? Screw that

(by the way, I definitely think Bonds used, but there are no positive tests to back it up, so there is no proof)

Just b/c you ''passed'' a drug test doesnt mean you ''passed''... im sure if they handed someone 50,000 cash they would pass them...
Also has anyone here seen the move ''the Program''? LOL

 

[j-bol]

So what about people who are geneticly gifted? Armstrong and Phelps both are know to have traits that prevent them from building as much lactic acid , seems to me like that sure the hell would help in an endurance sport. What about the "worlds strongest toddler" this kid has a myostatin abnormality so he is going to end up way stronger than everybody else his age , is it unfair to ban him from any powerlifting comps as a kid cause surely he won't be matched till the next genetic anomly comes along.

but yes in my oppinion if the rules say you can't take X,Y and Z and you do anyway then your cheating.

I think its stupid to worry about it with any professional sports though , these guys make millions to entertain us , who the fuck cares to watch a baseball game where everybody hits the same , you throw in a frea like bods to bangs one out of the park and ALOT more people show up to see it.

Personaly I think they should stop testing pro players , let the NFL juice their livers out , get stronger and fatser then eventualy some poor bastard is gonna get killed on the field and you know what the rateings will triple!! , violence sells , its like watching Nascar , you don't watch it to see some dumbshit drive around in a circle for 500 miles at 200mph , you watch it wating for a wreck. If their wern't any wrecks you could watch a whole race in 8 seconds , just flush a hand full fo skittles down the toilet !!

100% agree by definition its cheating doing something your not aloud to do cork your bat, spit balls, juice, cheating. cause its breaking a rule.. i think they should be able to do what they want though.. i wana see freaks on the field... its hard to bet on a player though when you dont know what their capable of on a substance... hence the ban.. what i hate hearing is people saying the use of steroids is fake muscle and that i didnt earn the muscle the steroids "gave" it to me.. screw them!!! i bust my ass for these muscles, diet my brains out, rest, research and dedicate my time to make sure im doing the best i can.. no steroid "gave" me anything. (but a lil gyno).. it helped me advance to where i needed to go.. we all ride the same highway juicing or not i just chose to drive in the the fast lane...

 

[Ashop]

Well my opinion is if you compete in a sport that prohibits certain drugs and then you take them... yes it's cheating.

I think you meant Floyd Landis, Lance hasn't tested positive for anything or admitted any drug use.(not saying I know he's clean but... innocent until proven guilty IMO)

Armstrong has always passed everything the general public has been able
to see,,he maintains his innocence and I stick by his decision.

 

[Phidias]

So when did he fail a drug test?

If you had read the link to the interview of that doping expert KillerStack posted, you'd have learnt that Lance's 99 Tour blood samples were tested again in 2005 with new methods, and they showed up positive for EPO...

 

[KillerStack]

So when did he fail a drug test?

Everyone seems to be "in the know" but these guys continually pass drug tests, that's amazing to me with the amount of drugs "they're obviously taking". It's all hear-say bs that people keep building on.

So you think Lance might be a life time natural? If you've read even a little on drug testing you know there's only a few drugs/methods that can be detected. Even WADA says hGH has been used with impunity for decades. Only recently has there been a positive for hGH - one positive, finally! And detectable only via blood testing, not urine. Why wouldn't cyclists use hGH or insulin if there's no chance of getting caught? The expert I linked to, for example, admits that while there's no way to use autologous blood transfusions, homologous is still undetectable. So if you can now say with high certainty Lance doesn't use EPO there's still tons of drugs that are undetectable! I've seen things like Actovegin, Synachten, etc, mentioned. The expert admits that athletes will very likely use something if it can't be detected, and he would do the same in their situation!

I checked my old favorite board yesterday since it was mentioned on cyclingnews, cuttingedgemuscle, which I haven't visited much since "Nandi" died, and there's lots of cyclists talking about drug trends in cycling.

scienceofsport.com also has lots of info if interested.

 

[KillerStack]

If you have read Lance's books (I have) and believe what
he has written, then he is the most tested person in the
history of professional sports. Lance is also one the
most aerobically gifted athletes to ever be tested. Has
set records for Vo max, wattage, etc., that have not
been broken. He is a genetic freak.

Take a look at the link I posted. Scroll down to the part about the tests of his "wattage". What do you think?

The scientist says, "there is nothing special about Lance".

 

[jogates]

If you had read the link to the interview of that doping expert KillerStack posted, you'd have learnt that Lance's 99 Tour blood samples were tested again in 2005 with new methods, and they showed up positive for EPO...

They could have been tampered with tho... I wouldnt really believe that